"Whatever is subject to origination is all subject to..."

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SamKR
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"Whatever is subject to origination is all subject to..."

Post by SamKR » Fri Aug 28, 2009 8:55 pm

I cannot explain the doctrine to you in detail, but I can give you the gist in brief.'


"'Speak a little or a lot,
but tell me just the gist.
The gist is what I want.
What use is a lot of rhetoric?'
"Then Ven. Assaji gave me this Dhamma exposition:


"'Whatever phenomena arise from cause:
their cause
and their cessation.
Such is the teaching of the Tathagata,
the Great Contemplative.'"
Then to Moggallana the wanderer, as he heard this Dhamma exposition, there arose the dustless, stainless Dhamma eye: Whatever is subject to origination is all subject to cessation.
http://www.accesstoinsight.org/tipitaka ... .than.html" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

I like the above conversation very much. My limited understanding based on this conversation is the following:

If anything originates at any point of time, it will definitely cease at any other point of time.

Why is that? It is because everything happens due to complex webs of many different causes. When there is any slight change somewhere in one of the causes there will be a change in its effect too. There are inconstruable number of chains of cause and effect in the nature, and these complex web of chains are the reason why everything changes and nothing is permanent.

In fact, changes at the deepest levels (at the levels of atoms or molecules) are unimaginably fast. The perception of relatively stable surrounding is yet another complex illusion of nature.

Only that “thing” can be permanent which does not have any origin or beginning point.

Please suggest if there are flaws in this understanding or if there is anything else I missed.
Thanks.

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retrofuturist
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Re: "Whatever is subject to origination is all subject to..."

Post by retrofuturist » Fri Aug 28, 2009 10:07 pm

Greetings Sam,

I think that's a nice little analysis.

The challenge, if you will, is bringing that awareness of impermanence in the "external" world, to that of the inner "world" of which the Buddha spoke...

... as described in SN 35.82 by way of the five aggregates
http://www.accesstoinsight.org/tipitaka ... .than.html" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

... as described in SN 12.44 by way of dependent origination
http://www.accesstoinsight.org/tipitaka ... .than.html" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

... and as described in AN 4.45 by way of contrast with cosmology and the physical universe
http://www.accesstoinsight.org/tipitaka ... .than.html" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

Metta,
Retro. :)
"Do not force others, including children, by any means whatsoever, to adopt your views, whether by authority, threat, money, propaganda, or even education." - Ven. Thich Nhat Hanh

"The uprooting of identity is seen by the noble ones as pleasurable; but this contradicts what the whole world sees." (Snp 3.12)

"To argue with a person who has renounced the use of reason is like administering medicine to the dead" - Thomas Paine

SamKR
Posts: 972
Joined: Sun Jul 19, 2009 4:33 pm

Re: "Whatever is subject to origination is all subject to..."

Post by SamKR » Sun Aug 30, 2009 6:16 am

retrofuturist wrote:
The challenge, if you will, is bringing that awareness of impermanence in the "external" world, to that of the inner "world" of which the Buddha spoke...
Thanks retrofuturist for this suggestion and the links.

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