Temporary ordination practicalities
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Re: Temporary ordination practicalities
Remember that the spirit - if not the absolute letter - of the eight uposatha precepts is that of living the life of the renunciant. So, when it comes to minimum time, this practice is already established. One could go the other way, and suggest rather than short term ordination, long term eight precept uposatha. Though probably most people would prefer the former, for various reasons. Though really, there is very little difference at all.
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- appicchato
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Re: Temporary ordination practicalities
No question about it, mind-blowing is the term…the deference shown to the robes (in Thailand), no matter who is in them, can be overwhelming...His rather mind-blowing suggestion was to ordain in NZ...then fly to Thailand to see how it felt arriving there in the robes…
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Re: Temporary ordination practicalities
I will be heading to Thailand next week.The monks who have gone from here to Thailand on visa runs say things change at the border.Priority getting seen,half price bus fares and of course the thrill the Thai people get when they spot Phra Falang.appicchato wrote:No question about it, mind-blowing is the term…the deference shown to the robes (in Thailand), no matter who is in them, can be overwhelming...His rather mind-blowing suggestion was to ordain in NZ...then fly to Thailand to see how it felt arriving there in the robes…
And crawling on the planets face,some insects called the human race.
Lost in time
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Lost in time
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Re: Temporary ordination practicalities
Yes, should be interesting. I found it mind-blowing enough just being on alms round with my American teacher in Bangkok (in the role of carrying what was offered after it had been into his bowl). We came back to the Wat with about three shopping bags full of food...Nanadhaja wrote:... and of course the thrill the Thai people get when they spot Phra Falang.
Even being on 8 precepts at my local Wat I can get a small taste of this. Apparently last weekend people were competing to be able to bring a meal to my kuti... And I had to share two thirds of the meal with the birds, otherwise I'd be asleep all afternoon
Mike
- Goofaholix
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Re: Temporary ordination practicalities
Anybody would get the impression that Thais have heard that merit was a finite resource and they'd better get in quick before it runs out.mikenz66 wrote:Yes, should be interesting. I found it mind-blowing enough just being on alms round with my American teacher in Bangkok (in the role of carrying what was offered after it had been into his bowl). We came back to the Wat with about three shopping bags full of food...Nanadhaja wrote:... and of course the thrill the Thai people get when they spot Phra Falang.
Even being on 8 precepts at my local Wat I can get a small taste of this. Apparently last weekend people were competing to be able to bring a meal to my kuti... And I had to share two thirds of the meal with the birds, otherwise I'd be asleep all afternoon
Mike
Pronouns (no self / not self)
“Peace is within oneself to be found in the same place as agitation and suffering. It is not found in a forest or on a hilltop, nor is it given by a teacher. Where you experience suffering, you can also find freedom from suffering. Trying to run away from suffering is actually to run toward it.”
― Ajahn Chah
“Peace is within oneself to be found in the same place as agitation and suffering. It is not found in a forest or on a hilltop, nor is it given by a teacher. Where you experience suffering, you can also find freedom from suffering. Trying to run away from suffering is actually to run toward it.”
― Ajahn Chah
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Re: Temporary ordination practicalities
What l ike about that is that they have the Right view, that such a thing as karma exists and that that there are spiritually superior beings among the bikkhu sangha who as a collective are worthy of respect. Here are people who's belief in karma is not limited to belief but spills over into action, suggesting a strong Right view capable of giving rise to the rest of the Noble eightfold path.
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- Goofaholix
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Re: Temporary ordination practicalities
Ever been to Thailand?rowyourboat wrote:What l ike about that is that they have the Right view, that such a thing as karma exists and that that there are spiritually superior beings among the bikkhu sangha who as a collective are worthy of respect. Here are people who's belief in karma is not limited to belief but spills over into action, suggesting a strong Right view capable of giving rise to the rest of the Noble eightfold path.
Pronouns (no self / not self)
“Peace is within oneself to be found in the same place as agitation and suffering. It is not found in a forest or on a hilltop, nor is it given by a teacher. Where you experience suffering, you can also find freedom from suffering. Trying to run away from suffering is actually to run toward it.”
― Ajahn Chah
“Peace is within oneself to be found in the same place as agitation and suffering. It is not found in a forest or on a hilltop, nor is it given by a teacher. Where you experience suffering, you can also find freedom from suffering. Trying to run away from suffering is actually to run toward it.”
― Ajahn Chah
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Re: Temporary ordination practicalities
Goofaholix wrote:Ever been to Thailand?rowyourboat wrote:What l ike about that is that they have the Right view, that such a thing as karma exists and that that there are spiritually superior beings among the bikkhu sangha who as a collective are worthy of respect. Here are people who's belief in karma is not limited to belief but spills over into action, suggesting a strong Right view capable of giving rise to the rest of the Noble eightfold path.
Sure, that must be tempered by the understanding that the rounds of births and deaths are unsatisfactory. Otherwise there was be just 'merit-making' and little practice.
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Re: Temporary ordination practicalities
Unfortunately many Thais, and even monks, think that escape from Samsara is virtually impossible in this day and age, so they do not even try.rowyourboat wrote: Sure, that must be tempered by the understanding that the rounds of births and deaths are unsatisfactory. Otherwise there was be just 'merit-making' and little practice.
Making merit leads to a better rebirth....still stuck in the prison.
Being good is not enough to escape....that requires much effort.
Re: Temporary ordination practicalities
_/\_
Last edited by Hanzze on Thu Jan 13, 2011 3:06 pm, edited 1 time in total.
Just that! *smile*
...We Buddhists must find the courage to leave our temples and enter the temples of human experience, temples that are filled with suffering. If we listen to Buddha, Christ, or Gandhi, we can do nothing else. The refugee camps, the prisons, the ghettos, and the battlefields will become our temples. We have so much work to do. ... Peace is Possible! Step by Step. - Samtach Preah Maha Ghosananda "Step by Step" http://www.ghosananda.org/bio_book.html
BUT! it is important to become a real Buddhist first. Like Punna did: Punna Sutta Nate sante baram sokham _()_
...We Buddhists must find the courage to leave our temples and enter the temples of human experience, temples that are filled with suffering. If we listen to Buddha, Christ, or Gandhi, we can do nothing else. The refugee camps, the prisons, the ghettos, and the battlefields will become our temples. We have so much work to do. ... Peace is Possible! Step by Step. - Samtach Preah Maha Ghosananda "Step by Step" http://www.ghosananda.org/bio_book.html
BUT! it is important to become a real Buddhist first. Like Punna did: Punna Sutta Nate sante baram sokham _()_
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Re: Temporary ordination practicalities
It makes me sad that we in the so called enlightened West, have such a difficult time accepting that enlightenment is possible - and find it difficult to accept that there might be enlightened people/monks/individuals in this world -and that it is possible for us to be the same.
With metta
Matheesha
With metta
Matheesha
With Metta
Karuna
Mudita
& Upekkha
Karuna
Mudita
& Upekkha
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Re: Temporary ordination practicalities
Hi Fabianfredfabianfred wrote:Unfortunately many Thais, and even monks, think that escape from Samsara is virtually impossible in this day and age, so they do not even try.rowyourboat wrote: Sure, that must be tempered by the understanding that the rounds of births and deaths are unsatisfactory. Otherwise there was be just 'merit-making' and little practice.
Making merit leads to a better rebirth....still stuck in the prison.
Being good is not enough to escape....that requires much effort.
Yes, that is a good point. Would you recommend temporary ordination? If so what benefits do you see in it?
with metta
Matheesha
With Metta
Karuna
Mudita
& Upekkha
Karuna
Mudita
& Upekkha
- Phra Chuntawongso
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Re: Temporary ordination practicalities
Hi Mike.mikenz66 wrote:Yes, should be interesting. I found it mind-blowing enough just being on alms round with my American teacher in Bangkok (in the role of carrying what was offered after it had been into his bowl). We came back to the Wat with about three shopping bags full of food...Nanadhaja wrote:... and of course the thrill the Thai people get when they spot Phra Falang.
Even being on 8 precepts at my local Wat I can get a small taste of this. Apparently last weekend people were competing to be able to bring a meal to my kuti... And I had to share two thirds of the meal with the birds, otherwise I'd be asleep all afternoon
Mike
Well I have done the travelling from a non buddhist nation to a buddhist nation while in robes and it certainly is a new experience.From having women reallocated seats on one aircraft as I was seated in the middle of two ladies and the Thai cabin crew wouldn't allow that(Malaysia-Thailand)to be upgraded to first class on an already discounted ticket on another aircraft.(Bangkok to Chiang Mai)Priority through immigration and at check in.Half price bus tickets,the list goes goes on.
I hope that if you do ordain in Aotearoa then head for the Land of Smiles you will see for yourself the incredible difference in attitude.It takes a little getting used to.
Anyway I am now settling into my new temple.The same place as fabianfred.My next experience is that of getting my monks passport and visa sorted.I am waiting to hear from the head Abbot of the area as to whether or not they will accept my ordination papers from Malaysia.If they don't I will have to re-ordain here in Thailand,but the Abbot here says that will be no problem if we need to.
I will keep you all informed of things as the progress.
Nice to be back
With metta
And crawling on the planets face,some insects called the human race.
Lost in time
Lost in space
And meaning
Lost in time
Lost in space
And meaning
Re: Temporary ordination practicalities
Welcome back Venerable.
Mike
Mike
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Re: Temporary ordination practicalities
our egos often rebel at the thought that there might be better people out there than ourselves...rowyourboat wrote:It makes me sad that we in the so called enlightened West, have such a difficult time accepting that enlightenment is possible - and find it difficult to accept that there might be enlightened people/monks/individuals in this world -and that it is possible for us to be the same.
With metta
Matheesha