"Dogs do it better"

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Individual
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"Dogs do it better"

Post by Individual » Sun Feb 22, 2009 4:02 am

On another forum I visit, someone said:
In Theravada there is a saying: "Dogs do it better".
Has anyone here heard this saying before or know its possible origin? Could they possibly elaborate on its meaning?
The best things in life aren't things.

The Diamond Sutra

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Dhammanando
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Re: "Dogs do it better"

Post by Dhammanando » Sun Feb 22, 2009 5:57 am

Hi Individual,

The only thing that comes to mind is the Soṇa Sutta (AN. iii. 221-2), where the Buddha describes the five ways in which dogs are better than brahmins, owing to the latter's discarding of their ancient customs. It's one of a series of suttas where the Buddha decries how the brahmins of his day had degenerated. To paraphrase:

1. Dogs only have sex with other dogs, whereas brahmins, though formerly having sex only with other brahmins, nowadays will do it with women from any caste.
2. Dogs only have sex when the bitch is in season, whereas brahmins will do it at any time.
3. Dogs don't buy and sell bitches, but rather, will mate according to mutual affection. Brahmins do buy and sell lady brahmins.
4. Dogs don't hoard silver, gold, grain etc., but brahmins do.
5. Dogs go looking for their evening meal in the evening and their morning meal in the morning. Brahmins stuff themselves silly and then keep the leftovers for the next meal.

"Verily, bhikkhus, these are the five ancient brahmin dhammas that are nowadays practised by dogs but not by brahmins."

Best wishes,
Dhammanando Bhikkhu

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tiltbillings
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Re: "Dogs do it better"

Post by tiltbillings » Sun Feb 22, 2009 6:17 am

And who said the Buddha did not have a sense of humor.
>> Do you see a man wise [enlightened/ariya] in his own eyes? There is more hope for a fool than for him.<< -- Proverbs 26:12

This being is bound to samsara, kamma is his means for going beyond. -- SN I, 38.

“Of course it is happening inside your head, Harry, but why on earth should that mean that it is not real?” HPatDH p.723

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jcsuperstar
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Re: "Dogs do it better"

Post by jcsuperstar » Sun Feb 22, 2009 7:10 am

i think it may be a buddhadasa reference, or maybe ajahn chah? but i remember something about dogs from one of them....
สัพเพ สัตตา สุขีตา โหนตุ

the mountain may be heavy in and of itself, but if you're not trying to carry it it's not heavy to you- Ajaan Suwat

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appicchato
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Re: "Dogs do it better"

Post by appicchato » Sun Feb 22, 2009 9:46 am

tiltbillings wrote:And who said the Buddha did not have a sense of humor.
Touche... :smile:

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DNS
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Re: "Dogs do it better"

Post by DNS » Sun Feb 22, 2009 4:10 pm

When you put it in English translation, it sort of sounds like one of the bad rap songs.

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Jechbi
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Re: "Dogs do it better"

Post by Jechbi » Sun Feb 22, 2009 6:26 pm

Who let the dogggs out?

Boom. Boom. Boomboom.

:thumbsup:
Rain soddens what is kept wrapped up,
But never soddens what is open;
Uncover, then, what is concealed,
Lest it be soddened by the rain.

Individual
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Re: "Dogs do it better"

Post by Individual » Sun Feb 22, 2009 6:52 pm

Dhammanando wrote:Hi Individual,

The only thing that comes to mind is the Soṇa Sutta (AN. iii. 221-2), where the Buddha describes the five ways in which dogs are better than brahmins, owing to the latter's discarding of their ancient customs. It's one of a series of suttas where the Buddha decries how the brahmins of his day had degenerated. To paraphrase:

1. Dogs only have sex with other dogs, whereas brahmins, though formerly having sex only with other brahmins, nowadays will do it with women from any caste.
2. Dogs only have sex when the bitch is in season, whereas brahmins will do it at any time.
3. Dogs don't buy and sell bitches, but rather, will mate according to mutual affection. Brahmins do buy and sell lady brahmins.
4. Dogs don't hoard silver, gold, grain etc., but brahmins do.
5. Dogs go looking for their evening meal in the evening and their morning meal in the morning. Brahmins stuff themselves silly and then keep the leftovers for the next meal.

"Verily, bhikkhus, these are the five ancient brahmin dhammas that are nowadays practised by dogs but not by brahmins."

Best wishes,
Dhammanando Bhikkhu
:lol:

I have sadly observed the same quality, with regards to my own behavior. Many dogs don't get angry or neurotic or depressed in the way that human beings do.
The best things in life aren't things.

The Diamond Sutra

thornbush
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Re: "Dogs do it better"

Post by thornbush » Mon Feb 23, 2009 5:47 am

ImageImage

Element

Re: "Dogs do it better"

Post by Element » Fri Feb 27, 2009 11:34 am

Individual wrote:Has anyone here heard this saying before or know its possible origin? Could they possibly elaborate on its meaning?
Ralf Mo made it up.

However, it is reassuring to learn the Buddha had the same notion.

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kc2dpt
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Re: "Dogs do it better"

Post by kc2dpt » Fri Feb 27, 2009 2:40 pm

tiltbillings wrote:And who said the Buddha did not have a sense of humor.
I have to admit, that is a pretty convincing example.
- Peter

Be heedful and you will accomplish your goal.

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tiltbillings
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Re: "Dogs do it better"

Post by tiltbillings » Mon Jan 16, 2012 6:54 am

http://sujato.wordpress.com/2011/11/29/ ... ali-canon/" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
>> Do you see a man wise [enlightened/ariya] in his own eyes? There is more hope for a fool than for him.<< -- Proverbs 26:12

This being is bound to samsara, kamma is his means for going beyond. -- SN I, 38.

“Of course it is happening inside your head, Harry, but why on earth should that mean that it is not real?” HPatDH p.723

Tom
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Re: "Dogs do it better"

Post by Tom » Fri May 31, 2013 5:59 am

Dhammanando wrote:The only thing that comes to mind is the Soṇa Sutta (AN. iii. 221-2), where the Buddha describes the five ways in which dogs are better than brahmins, owing to the latter's discarding of their ancient customs.
Where does this concept of dogs being better than brahmins in these ways come from?

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Sekha
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Re: "Dogs do it better"

Post by Sekha » Fri May 31, 2013 6:04 am

And what if this sutta was a late addition?

To me it sounds like pure ill-will and I cannot imagine the Buddha saying such things
Where knowledge ends, religion begins. - B. Disraeli

http://www.buddha-vacana.org" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

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tiltbillings
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Re: "Dogs do it better"

Post by tiltbillings » Fri May 31, 2013 6:11 am

Sekha wrote:And what if this sutta was a late addition?

To me it sounds like pure ill-will and I cannot imagine the Buddha saying such things
It is not out of character of other suttas in relation to the Brahmins. Modern day sensibilities likely are not necessarily appropriate in determining what the Buddha said or did not say. There is a fair amount of very sharp humor used in the suttas.
>> Do you see a man wise [enlightened/ariya] in his own eyes? There is more hope for a fool than for him.<< -- Proverbs 26:12

This being is bound to samsara, kamma is his means for going beyond. -- SN I, 38.

“Of course it is happening inside your head, Harry, but why on earth should that mean that it is not real?” HPatDH p.723

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