Did the Buddha teach anything other than four noble truths?

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form
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Did the Buddha teach anything other than four noble truths?

Post by form » Mon Jul 15, 2019 1:22 am

It seems to me that just penetrating the 4NT will be enough to get beyond Dukka. So what are the other stuff doing in the nikayas?

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cappuccino
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Re: Did the Buddha teach anything other than four noble truths?

Post by cappuccino » Mon Jul 15, 2019 1:44 am

the teaching is simple yet complex at the same time

reading daily will clarify in a few years

santa100
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Re: Did the Buddha teach anything other than four noble truths?

Post by santa100 » Mon Jul 15, 2019 1:46 am

Just like there're different zoom levels: bird's-eye view, close-up view, microscopic view, etc., the Dhamma also provides various "zoom" layers from large to more fine-grained. The 4NT is actually sort of a more close-up view already. From a higher level, it's equally valid to say that just penetrating the teaching of: "To avoid all evil, to cultivate good, and to cleanse one's mind." (Dhp 14.183) will be enough to get beyond Dukkha.

Srilankaputra
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Re: Did the Buddha teach anything other than four noble truths?

Post by Srilankaputra » Mon Jul 15, 2019 4:40 am

Due to the vastness of ignorance.
O seeing one,we for refuge go to thee!
O mighty sage do thou our teacher be!

Paccuppannañca yo dhammaṃ,
Tattha tattha vipassati

“Yato yato mano nivāraye,
Na dukkhameti naṃ tato tato;
Sa sabbato mano nivāraye,
Sa sabbato dukkhā pamuccatī”ti.

SarathW
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Re: Did the Buddha teach anything other than four noble truths?

Post by SarathW » Mon Jul 15, 2019 5:38 am

It is important to understand that all the knowledge in this world is a fabrication.
Nothing is the ultimate truth.
Even Four Noble Truths and the Noble Eightfold path is a fabrication as a knowledge.
Buddha taught only the fabricated knowledge required for the liberation.
“As the lamp consumes oil, the path realises Nibbana”

Srilankaputra
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Re: Did the Buddha teach anything other than four noble truths?

Post by Srilankaputra » Mon Jul 15, 2019 5:52 am

SarathW wrote:
Mon Jul 15, 2019 5:38 am
It is important to understand that all the knowledge in this world is a fabrication.
Nothing is the ultimate truth.
Even Four Noble Truths and the Noble Eightfold path is a fabrication as a knowledge.
Buddha taught only the fabricated knowledge required for the liberation.
:bow:
O seeing one,we for refuge go to thee!
O mighty sage do thou our teacher be!

Paccuppannañca yo dhammaṃ,
Tattha tattha vipassati

“Yato yato mano nivāraye,
Na dukkhameti naṃ tato tato;
Sa sabbato mano nivāraye,
Sa sabbato dukkhā pamuccatī”ti.

form
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Re: Did the Buddha teach anything other than four noble truths?

Post by form » Mon Jul 15, 2019 6:10 am

SarathW wrote:
Mon Jul 15, 2019 5:38 am
It is important to understand that all the knowledge in this world is a fabrication.
Nothing is the ultimate truth.
Even Four Noble Truths and the Noble Eightfold path is a fabrication as a knowledge.
Buddha taught only the fabricated knowledge required for the liberation.
:goodpost:

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Antaradhana
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Re: Did the Buddha teach anything other than four noble truths?

Post by Antaradhana » Mon Jul 15, 2019 12:04 pm

SarathW wrote:Even Four Noble Truths and the Noble Eightfold path is a fabrication as a knowledge.
Buddha taught only the fabricated knowledge required for the liberation.
Dhamma - akālika (timeless). All buddhas, in all times, in all world systems, in all cycles of existence - always open the same Dhamma, the same Four Truths.
Last edited by Antaradhana on Mon Jul 15, 2019 1:23 pm, edited 1 time in total.
All that is subject to arising is subject to termination, all formations are non-permanent. And that which is impermanent is suffering. Regarding what is impermanent and prone to suffering, one cannot say: "This is mine, I am this, this is my self".

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Re: Did the Buddha teach anything other than four noble truths?

Post by Antaradhana » Mon Jul 15, 2019 12:14 pm

form wrote:
Mon Jul 15, 2019 1:22 am
It seems to me that just penetrating the 4NT will be enough to get beyond Dukka. So what are the other stuff doing in the nikayas?
Truths are revealed in detail, for example, the second truth includes a paticcasamuppada, etc. For awakening, it is enough for someone to hear a superficial lecture on Dhamma, but there were only a handful of such people even in the time of the Buddha, and now there is probably no such thing at all, since now is a time of decline. For most people, it is necessary to study the Dhamma in great detail and possibly over many lifetimes in order to understand and comprehend the deep meaning.
All that is subject to arising is subject to termination, all formations are non-permanent. And that which is impermanent is suffering. Regarding what is impermanent and prone to suffering, one cannot say: "This is mine, I am this, this is my self".

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DooDoot
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Re: Did the Buddha teach anything other than four noble truths?

Post by DooDoot » Mon Jul 15, 2019 12:22 pm

Srilankaputra wrote:
Mon Jul 15, 2019 5:52 am
:bow:
The Buddha taught the Four Noble Truths exist, whether or not they are discovered by a Buddha. SarathW seems to be posting Mahayana & Christian ideas, including here. :roll:
AN 3.136 & SN 12.20 wrote:Whether or not there is the arising of Tathagatas, this property stands — this regularity of the Dhamma, this orderliness of the Dhamma, this this/that conditionality. The Tathagata directly awakens to that, breaks through to that. Directly awakening & breaking through to that, he declares it, teaches it, describes it, sets it forth.

https://www.accesstoinsight.org/tipitak ... .than.html
There is always an official executioner. If you try to take his place, It is like trying to be a master carpenter and cutting wood. If you try to cut wood like a master carpenter, you will only hurt your hand.

https://soundcloud.com/doodoot/paticcasamuppada
https://soundcloud.com/doodoot/anapanasati

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DooDoot
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Re: Did the Buddha teach anything other than four noble truths?

Post by DooDoot » Mon Jul 15, 2019 12:27 pm

form wrote:
Mon Jul 15, 2019 1:22 am
It seems to me that just penetrating the 4NT will be enough to get beyond Dukka. So what are the other stuff doing in the nikayas?
The suttas appear to say stream-entry was attained from penetrating the 4NTs (SN 56.11) and arahantship was attained from penetrating the three characteristics (SN 22.59). Its seems the 3Cs is a more powerful realisation than the 4NTs.
There is always an official executioner. If you try to take his place, It is like trying to be a master carpenter and cutting wood. If you try to cut wood like a master carpenter, you will only hurt your hand.

https://soundcloud.com/doodoot/paticcasamuppada
https://soundcloud.com/doodoot/anapanasati

Srilankaputra
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Re: Did the Buddha teach anything other than four noble truths?

Post by Srilankaputra » Mon Jul 15, 2019 1:16 pm

Antaradhana wrote:
Mon Jul 15, 2019 12:04 pm
Srilankaputra wrote:
Mon Jul 15, 2019 5:52 am
Even Four Noble Truths and the Noble Eightfold path is a fabrication as a knowledge.
Buddha taught only the fabricated knowledge required for the liberation.
Dhamma - akālika (timeless). All buddhas, in all times, in all world systems, in all cycles of existence - always open the same Dhamma, the same Four Truths.
Hi,

I think you made a mistake. I didn't write what you tagged.
O seeing one,we for refuge go to thee!
O mighty sage do thou our teacher be!

Paccuppannañca yo dhammaṃ,
Tattha tattha vipassati

“Yato yato mano nivāraye,
Na dukkhameti naṃ tato tato;
Sa sabbato mano nivāraye,
Sa sabbato dukkhā pamuccatī”ti.

Srilankaputra
Posts: 673
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Location: Sri Lanka

Re: Did the Buddha teach anything other than four noble truths?

Post by Srilankaputra » Mon Jul 15, 2019 1:19 pm

DooDoot wrote:
Mon Jul 15, 2019 12:22 pm
Srilankaputra wrote:
Mon Jul 15, 2019 5:52 am
:bow:
The Buddha taught the Four Noble Truths exist, whether or not they are discovered by a Buddha. SarathW seems to be posting Mahayana & Christian ideas, including here. :roll:
AN 3.136 & SN 12.20 wrote:Whether or not there is the arising of Tathagatas, this property stands — this regularity of the Dhamma, this orderliness of the Dhamma, this this/that conditionality. The Tathagata directly awakens to that, breaks through to that. Directly awakening & breaking through to that, he declares it, teaches it, describes it, sets it forth.

https://www.accesstoinsight.org/tipitak ... .than.html
Hi DD,

Shouldn't you ask Sarath? Why did you tag me?
O seeing one,we for refuge go to thee!
O mighty sage do thou our teacher be!

Paccuppannañca yo dhammaṃ,
Tattha tattha vipassati

“Yato yato mano nivāraye,
Na dukkhameti naṃ tato tato;
Sa sabbato mano nivāraye,
Sa sabbato dukkhā pamuccatī”ti.

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Antaradhana
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Re: Did the Buddha teach anything other than four noble truths?

Post by Antaradhana » Mon Jul 15, 2019 1:21 pm

Srilankaputra wrote:
Mon Jul 15, 2019 1:16 pm
Antaradhana wrote:
Mon Jul 15, 2019 12:04 pm
Srilankaputra wrote:
Mon Jul 15, 2019 5:52 am
Even Four Noble Truths and the Noble Eightfold path is a fabrication as a knowledge.
Buddha taught only the fabricated knowledge required for the liberation.
Dhamma - akālika (timeless). All buddhas, in all times, in all world systems, in all cycles of existence - always open the same Dhamma, the same Four Truths.
Hi,

I think you made a mistake. I didn't write what you tagged.
Hi,

I mean that Dhamma (4 Truths) is an immutable law, not fabricated knowledge.

P.S. Sorry, I noticed an error in authorship when quoting. I have corrected.
All that is subject to arising is subject to termination, all formations are non-permanent. And that which is impermanent is suffering. Regarding what is impermanent and prone to suffering, one cannot say: "This is mine, I am this, this is my self".

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Re: Did the Buddha teach anything other than four noble truths?

Post by Srilankaputra » Mon Jul 15, 2019 1:28 pm

Antaradhana wrote:
Mon Jul 15, 2019 1:21 pm
Srilankaputra wrote:
Mon Jul 15, 2019 1:16 pm
Antaradhana wrote:
Mon Jul 15, 2019 12:04 pm


Dhamma - akālika (timeless). All buddhas, in all times, in all world systems, in all cycles of existence - always open the same Dhamma, the same Four Truths.
Hi,

I think you made a mistake. I didn't write what you tagged.
Hi,

I mean that Dhamma (4 Truths) is an immutable law, not fabricated knowledge.
Ah! I thought you were trying to communicate with Sarath and made a mistake.

Might I ask what is the relationship of an Arahant with the Noble Truths, who has finished the task, laid down the burden and achieved the goal of the holy life?
O seeing one,we for refuge go to thee!
O mighty sage do thou our teacher be!

Paccuppannañca yo dhammaṃ,
Tattha tattha vipassati

“Yato yato mano nivāraye,
Na dukkhameti naṃ tato tato;
Sa sabbato mano nivāraye,
Sa sabbato dukkhā pamuccatī”ti.

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