User1249x wrote: ↑Sat Apr 21, 2018 2:57 pm
Example is AN 10.58 in particular the 9th enumeration. I wont analyze it here because it is a lot of work and is off-topic
I analyzed below in about 5 minutes.
User1249x wrote: ↑Sat Apr 21, 2018 2:57 pmbut comparing the two translations will show how big of a difference there is;
Ven. Thanissaro;
"'All phenomena gain their footing in the deathless.
Ven. Bodhi;
(9) They culminate in the deathless.
We have discussed this before. Both translations above were shown to be incorrect in their translating 'dhamma' as 'things' or 'phenomena'. As for "deathless footing" vs "deathless culminate", the Pali is "amatogadhā".
gādha1
neuter
firm footing (in water); firm ground.
gādha2
masculine or neuter
a hole; a refuge.
gādha1
depth; a hole, a dugout AN.ii.107 = Pp.43 (cp. Pp-a 225); Sdhp.394 (˚ṃ khaṇati). Cp. gāḷha2.
Sk. gāḷha pp. of gāh, see gāhati
gādha2
adj. passable, fordable in a˚ unfathomable, deep Pv-a.77 (= gambhīra). nt. a ford, a firm stand, firm ground, a safe place: gambhīre ˚ṃ vindati AN.v.202. ˚ṃ esati to seek the terra firma SN.i.127; similarly: ˚ṃ labhati to gain firm footing SN.i.47; ˚ṃ ajjhagā SN.iv.206; ˚ṃ labhate Ja.vi.440 (= patiṭṭhā). Cp. o˚, paṭi˚.
gādhati
to stand fast, to be on firm ground, to have a firm footing: āpo ca paṭhavī ca tejo vāyo na gādhati “the four elements have no footing DN.i.223 = SN.i.15
■ Dhamma-Vinaye gādhati “to stand fast in the Doctrine & Discipline” SN.iii.59 sq.
v. der. fr. gādha2
Formerly, Bodhi translated this as "merge".
Therefore, the question needs to be asked why VBB has translated as he has done?
User1249x wrote: ↑Sat Apr 21, 2018 2:57 pmThere is a similar problem in DN11 concerning Vinnana Anidassanam.
In general the relationship between the terms Vinnana Anidassanam, The Deathless and Nibbana needs to be explained and it needs to be explained in a way that consistently makes sense and so that it can not be refuted. Afaik there is only one way to do it and Ven. Bodhi has expressed wrong view in regards to this.
Vinnana Anidassanam is not Nibbana. We have also discussed this before. Why do you keep repeating the same old unsubstantiated ideas?
User1249x wrote: ↑Sat Apr 21, 2018 2:57 pmThe Deathless and Nibbana needs to be explained and it needs to be explained in a way that consistently makes sense and so that it can not be refuted. Afaik there is only one way to do it and Ven. Bodhi has expressed wrong view in regards to this.
The Deathless and Nibbana are essentially synonyms; as stated in many suttas, such as in
SN 45.7. Regardless, when making an allegation against someone, as has been done above, it should ideally be substantiated.
I have addressed three matters you have raised yet in all three matters you have not explained let alone substantiated your allegations. Imo, this is not how to conduct a discussion. You should provide your clear view about the following:
1. Why is VBB's translation of 'gādha' incorrect?
2. What relationship does Vinnana Anidassanam have with The Deathless and Nibbana?
3. Why are The Deathless and Nibbana different and why was VBB wrong in treating these as synonyms?
47. Since the Deathless and Nibbāna are synonymous, to justify the distinction between them here, A-a identifies “the Deathless” with the Nibbāna-element with a residue left, and “Nibbāna” with the Nibbāna-element with no residue left. See Ch.IV, n.10.
https://www.bps.lk/olib/wh/wh238_Nyanap ... I.html#N47