Can you practice Brahma Vihara in second Jhana?

The cultivation of calm or tranquility and the development of concentration
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SarathW
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Can you practice Brahma Vihara in second Jhana?

Post by SarathW » Tue Dec 26, 2017 10:55 am

Can you practice Brahma Vihara in the second Jhana?
“As the lamp consumes oil, the path realises Nibbana”

Saengnapha
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Re: Can you practice Brahma Vihara in second Jhana?

Post by Saengnapha » Wed Jan 17, 2018 4:24 pm

SarathW wrote:
Tue Dec 26, 2017 10:55 am
Can you practice Brahma Vihara in the second Jhana?
In my experience, if you mean metta bhavana as a practice, you can do it as your practice when you are sitting and can easily lead you into jhanas. Visualizing metta and cultivating it can be the easiest and fastest way for some people to experience samadhi.

SarathW
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Re: Can you practice Brahma Vihara in second Jhana?

Post by SarathW » Wed Jan 17, 2018 8:53 pm

My understanding is you cant practice Brahama Vihara in Second Jhana.
In second Jhana there is no Vitakka and Vicara.
“As the lamp consumes oil, the path realises Nibbana”

Saengnapha
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Re: Can you practice Brahma Vihara in second Jhana?

Post by Saengnapha » Thu Jan 18, 2018 1:48 am

SarathW wrote:
Wed Jan 17, 2018 8:53 pm
My understanding is you cant practice Brahama Vihara in Second Jhana.
In second Jhana there is no Vitakka and Vicara.
Give a listen to this. 15 minute video.

Saengnapha
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Re: Can you practice Brahma Vihara in second Jhana?

Post by Saengnapha » Thu Jan 18, 2018 2:51 am

Saengnapha wrote:
Thu Jan 18, 2018 1:48 am
SarathW wrote:
Wed Jan 17, 2018 8:53 pm
My understanding is you cant practice Brahama Vihara in Second Jhana.
In second Jhana there is no Vitakka and Vicara.
Give a listen to this. 15 minute video.
This short pdf accompanies the talk.

SarathW
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Re: Can you practice Brahma Vihara in second Jhana?

Post by SarathW » Thu Jan 18, 2018 5:54 am

Thank you Sengnapha.
In second jhana you do not have vtakka and vicara.
So how do you practice Karuna and Muditha in second Jahana.
“As the lamp consumes oil, the path realises Nibbana”

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DooDoot
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Re: Can you practice Brahma Vihara in second Jhana?

Post by DooDoot » Thu Jan 18, 2018 5:58 am

I think jhana in itself is a brahma realm, where the heart is saturated with bliss & love due to having no (unwholesome) hindrances. There is no need to practise verbal 'metta' recitations because the heart already is saturated with love. :heart:

SarathW
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Re: Can you practice Brahma Vihara in second Jhana?

Post by SarathW » Thu Jan 18, 2018 6:04 am

Hi DD
Yes, I agree.
My question is how he tries to mary four Jhana with Brahmavihara.
How do you practice Brhama Vihara if you do not have Vitakka and Vicar in sencond Jhana.

In this video.
Metta =1st Jhana
Karuna = 2nd Jhana
Muditha = 3rd Jhana
Upekkha = 4th Jhana
“As the lamp consumes oil, the path realises Nibbana”

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DooDoot
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Re: Can you practice Brahma Vihara in second Jhana?

Post by DooDoot » Thu Jan 18, 2018 6:06 am

There is no need to have Vitakka and Vicara in second Jhana because the heart is saturated with love. :heart:

SarathW
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Re: Can you practice Brahma Vihara in second Jhana?

Post by SarathW » Thu Jan 18, 2018 6:39 am

DooDoot wrote:
Thu Jan 18, 2018 6:06 am
There is no need to have Vitakka and Vicara in second Jhana because the heart is saturated with love. :heart:
So then what happens in the third Jhana?
“As the lamp consumes oil, the path realises Nibbana”

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LG2V
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Re: Can you practice Brahma Vihara in second Jhana?

Post by LG2V » Thu Jan 18, 2018 6:51 am

It's possible. I've read it explained in either the scriptures or the commentaries before.

Here's a quote from an article on the Brahmaviharas by Nyanaponika Thera:

https://www.accesstoinsight.org/lib/aut ... el006.html
That meditation is called Brahma-vihara-bhavana, the meditative development of the sublime states. The practical aim is to achieve, with the help of these sublime states, those high stages of mental concentration called jhana, "meditative absorption." The meditations on love, compassion and sympathetic joy may each produce the attainment of the first three absorptions, while the meditation on equanimity will lead to the fourth jhana only, in which equanimity is the most significant factor.
Here are some excellent sites for giving free Dana (Click-Based Donation):
http://freerice.comhttp://greatergood.com/www.ripple.orgwww.thenonprofits.com

SarathW
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Re: Can you practice Brahma Vihara in second Jhana?

Post by SarathW » Thu Jan 18, 2018 7:54 am

Thanks LG.
those high stages of mental concentration called jhana
Very interesting.
So Jhana can be attained in many different ways.
while the meditation on equanimity will lead to the fourth jhana only, in which equanimity is the most significant factor.
This is even more interesting.
It appears you can go straight to fourth Jhana.

What is equanimity by the way?
“As the lamp consumes oil, the path realises Nibbana”

Saengnapha
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Re: Can you practice Brahma Vihara in second Jhana?

Post by Saengnapha » Thu Jan 18, 2018 12:54 pm

DooDoot wrote:
Thu Jan 18, 2018 6:06 am
There is no need to have Vitakka and Vicara in second Jhana because the heart is saturated with love. :heart:
+1.
Brahma Vihara moves into a non verbal area as it deepens in Karuna and Mudita, and finally in Upekkha. You lose your head, so to speak.

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LG2V
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Re: Can you practice Brahma Vihara in second Jhana?

Post by LG2V » Fri Jan 19, 2018 9:58 am

SarathW wrote:
Thu Jan 18, 2018 7:54 am
Thanks LG.
those high stages of mental concentration called jhana
Very interesting.
So Jhana can be attained in many different ways.
while the meditation on equanimity will lead to the fourth jhana only, in which equanimity is the most significant factor.
This is even more interesting.
It appears you can go straight to fourth Jhana.

What is equanimity by the way?

No problem :smile:

Equanimity means serenity. It's mental balance despite the highs and lows of life.
Here are some excellent sites for giving free Dana (Click-Based Donation):
http://freerice.comhttp://greatergood.com/www.ripple.orgwww.thenonprofits.com

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