Viable Pāli etymologies

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ToVincent
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Re: Viable Pāli etymologies

Post by ToVincent »

Coëmgenu wrote:
The authors of the Brāhmaṇas had so completely broken with the past, that, forgetful of the poetical character of the hymns (of the Veda) and yearning of the poets after the unknown god, they exalted the interrogative pronoun itself into a deity, and acknowledged a god Ka or Who? In the Taittirīya and in the Śatapatha Brāhmaṇa, wherever interrogative verses occur, the author states that Ka is Prajāpati, or the lord of creatures. Nor did they stop here.

Some of the hymns in which the interrogative pronoun occured were called Kadvat, i.e. having kad or quid. But soon a new adjective was formed and not only the hymns but the sacrifices also offered to the god were called Kāya or Who-ish.

At the time of Pāṇini, this word had acquired such legitimacy as to call for a separate rule explaining its formation. The commentator here explains Ka by Brahman. After this we can hardly wonder that in the later Sanskrit literature of the Purāṇas Ka appears as a recognized god, as a supreme god, with a genealogy of his own[...]
(the relevant quotation of Max Müller)
What's your point?
Shooting bullets at your foot?

Aren't you just admitting that your sarcasms were just unfounded?

So Ka exists, for what I see.
And it is not the Egyptian Ka; nor the Ka of Dennis Wheatley's black art; nor Mowgly's Ka, nor whoever Ka (above cited). These are just sarcasms, carried out to veil a disturbing fact for some.

So Ka exists - the Vedic Ka.
So why should I disagree with Müller?

What does Müller says?
That in Middle Vedic Texts (Brhāmaṇas), the use of the concept Ka/Prajapati was pretty common. And that it lasted as far as the Puranic litterature - going through the Late Vedic Texts of the Upaniṣads - and obviously across Buddhism as well.

Let me remind you as well, while we are at it, the tight relationship between the Buddhist philosophy and Vedism, in this example among many, many more.
https://archive.org/stream/PrincipalUpa ... 3/mode/2up

The Atma(Atta)>>Brahma>>Prajapati/Ka(atta), is a concept that the Buddha battled against.
A concept that Buddha rejected on the rationale that the khandhas are impermanent, (hence not continual).
In other words, the Buddha said that there is no Atma>>Brahma>>Prajapati/Ka Self/self in the Dhamma, that is paṭiccasamupāda (sabbe dhammā anatta).

Obviously, such a simple and true explanation of "anatta", puts at stake the divagations of many, that have been going on for so long.
A simple truth that is so vexing and worrisome for many; that they equate it to "trolling". Pretty convenient, isn't it?

As I already said in another thread:
https://dhammawheel.com/viewtopic.php?f ... aw#p432952
The Buddha did act as a conservative against the view of the Upaniṣadic Brahmins; when He expounded a Dhamma (paṭiccasamupāda) with no Atta/atta. And His Dhamma was quite revolutionary, for that matter.

BUT he did also act as a revolutionary, towards the still orthodox view of the non-Upaniṣadic Brahminhood; of which he was a part, by questioning the nature of the "One" in RV. 1.164.06.
That is to say that Buddha also went against the conservative Brahmins, that were still living in the "poetical character of the hymns (of the Veda), and yearning of the poets (Ṛśi) after the unknown god" (as Müller rightly puts it).

----

Moreover, can we say that there is no relationship between Kāya and Ka, when it is written in the Brāhmaṇa:

'Hail to Ka ! Hail to the Who! Hail to the Whoever!'
kāya svāhā kasmai svāhā katamasmai svāheti
ŚBr. 13.1.8.3

----
Again:
The authors of the Brāhmaṇas had so completely broken with the past, that, forgetful of the poetical character of the hymns (of the Veda) and yearning of the poets after the unknown god, they exalted the interrogative pronoun itself into a deity, and acknowledged a god Ka or Who? In the Taittirīya and in the Śatapatha Brāhmaṇa, wherever interrogative verses occur, the author states that Ka is Prajāpati, or the lord of creatures. Nor did they stop here.

Some of the hymns in which the interrogative pronoun occured were called Kadvat, i.e. having kad or quid. But soon a new adjective was formed and not only the hymns but the sacrifices also offered to the god were called Kāya or Who-ish.

At the time of Pāṇini, this word had acquired such legitimacy as to call for a separate rule explaining its formation. The commentator here explains Ka by Brahman. After this we can hardly wonder that in the later Sanskrit literature of the Purāṇas Ka appears as a recognized god, as a supreme god, with a genealogy of his own[...]
(the relevant quotation of Max Müller)
So what?
What's your point?
In this world, there are many people acting and yearning for the Mara's world; some for the Brahma's world; and very few for the Unborn.
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Coëmgenu
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Re: Viable Pāli etymologies

Post by Coëmgenu »

ToVincent wrote:
Coëmgenu wrote:
The authors of the Brāhmaṇas had so completely broken with the past, that, forgetful of the poetical character of the hymns (of the Veda) and yearning of the poets after the unknown god, they exalted the interrogative pronoun itself into a deity, and acknowledged a god Ka or Who? In the Taittirīya and in the Śatapatha Brāhmaṇa, wherever interrogative verses occur, the author states that Ka is Prajāpati, or the lord of creatures. Nor did they stop here.

Some of the hymns in which the interrogative pronoun occured were called Kadvat, i.e. having kad or quid. But soon a new adjective was formed and not only the hymns but the sacrifices also offered to the god were called Kāya or Who-ish.

At the time of Pāṇini, this word had acquired such legitimacy as to call for a separate rule explaining its formation. The commentator here explains Ka by Brahman. After this we can hardly wonder that in the later Sanskrit literature of the Purāṇas Ka appears as a recognized god, as a supreme god, with a genealogy of his own[...]
(the relevant quotation of Max Müller)
What's your point?
Shooting bullets at your foot?

Are you just admitting that your (and other's) sarcasms were just unfounded?

So Ka exists, for what I see.
And it is not the Egyptian Ka; nor the Ka of Dennis Wheatley's black art; nor Mowgly's Ka, nor ... (above cited). Things that are just carried out to veil a disturbing fact for some.
But the Vedic Ka.
Bullets at my foot? You will have to elaborate, because communications have entirely broken down on my end regarding this specific quotation.

You think the Buddha's not-self discourses are actually "the god Ka is a misunderstanding of the personal pronoun and thus does not exist as we think he does" discourses? Or something of the like? Is that what you mean?

If you figure the god Ka is so foundationally important to Buddhism, why does the Buddha not speak of him directly? Rittaka <-- this would not be a "direct" reference to Ka. The Buddha did not teach that this refers to Ka. There is no such discourse in any extant recensions of any Buddhavacana. No such discourse was remembered at any Buddhist council by any past Venerable, AFAIK.

Are you going to now show me a discourse that unambiguously and directly refers to and speaks about "Ka as (or not as) Prajāpati"? Specifically about the misconception regarding Ka as "god vs pronoun" that Müller points out?
What is the Uncreated?
Sublime & free, what is that obscured Eternity?
It is the Undying, the Bright, the Isle.
It is an Ocean, a Secret: Reality.
Both life and oblivion, it is Nirvāṇa.
ToVincent
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Re: Viable Pāli etymologies

Post by ToVincent »

Coëmgenu wrote:...
coëmgenu wrote:Bullets at my foot? You will have to elaborate, because communications have entirely broken down on my end.
Shoot oneself in the foot=
Foolishly harm one's own cause.
http://idioms.thefreedictionary.com/sho ... n+the+foot

In other words, you pretend that Ka is just a ridiculous idea; then you come up later with the proof that It does exist!?!?!

coëmgenu wrote:You think the Buddha's not-self discourses are actually "the god Ka is a misunderstanding of the personal pronoun and thus does not exist as we think he does" discourses? Is that what you mean?
No this is not what I meant.

The concept of Ka is not restricted to the "personal pronoun".
"Ka is Prajāpati", says the Brāhmaṇas.

What I meant, is what I said simply and very straightforwardly before.
Viz. no Atma>>Brahma>>Prajapati/Ka pervasive and continuous Self/self in the Dhamma (paṭiccasamuppāda), says Buddha. Nothing like this; like the middle and late Vedic texts pretend.


coëmgenu wrote: ... about the misconception regarding Ka that Müller points out?
!?!?!?!?
What "misconception"?
Müller never said that!
It was just the Brahmanic philosophy of the time. The middle and late Vedic philosophy. Compared to early Vedic philosophy.
Veda was "written" by many Ṛśi. With somewhat different dharmas.

coëmgenu wrote: If you figure the god Ka is so foundationally important to Buddhism, why does the Buddha not speak of him directly?
Buddha never talks about Mitra, although the god Mitra is just about the underlying notion behind Metta (see notes https://justpaste.it/1a3ol).

What is "foundationally important to Buddhism" is that there is no continuous and pervasive god, like in mid & late Vedic creed. And Sakkāyadiṭṭhi (Self-view) is just about that. (SN 22.47). Viz. this Atma>>Brahma>>Prajapati/Ka belief of the mid & l&te Vedic (unorthodox) Brahmins.
Last edited by ToVincent on Sun Sep 10, 2017 6:27 pm, edited 3 times in total.
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Coëmgenu
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Re: Viable Pāli etymologies

Post by Coëmgenu »

ToVincent wrote:
Coëmgenu wrote:...
coëmgenu wrote:Bullets at my foot? You will have to elaborate, because communications have entirely broken down on my end.
Shoot oneself in the foot=
Foolishly harm one's own cause.
http://idioms.thefreedictionary.com/sho ... n+the+foot

In other words, you pretend that Ka is just a ridiculous idea; then you come up later with the proof that It does exist!?!?!
Ka existing and "rittaka = ritta of ka" being ridiculous are not mutually exclusive.
ToVincent wrote:The concept of Ka is not restricted to the "personal pronoun".
"Ka is Prajāpati", says the Brāhmaṇas.
And this here is the misconception Müller talks about. The misconception made by the authors of the Brāhmaṇas.
Last edited by Coëmgenu on Sun Sep 10, 2017 6:30 pm, edited 2 times in total.
What is the Uncreated?
Sublime & free, what is that obscured Eternity?
It is the Undying, the Bright, the Isle.
It is an Ocean, a Secret: Reality.
Both life and oblivion, it is Nirvāṇa.
ToVincent
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Re: Viable Pāli etymologies

Post by ToVincent »

Coëmgenu wrote:Ka existing and "rittaka = ritta of ka" being ridiculous are not mutually exclusive.
Can you develop?
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Coëmgenu
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Re: Viable Pāli etymologies

Post by Coëmgenu »

ToVincent wrote:
Coëmgenu wrote:Ka existing and "rittaka = ritta of ka" being ridiculous are not mutually exclusive.
Can you develop?
Ok, I meant to say that:

There is no contradiction or inconsistency with pointing out that both Ka 'exists' as a Vedic deity and theories of etymology for Pāli involving Ka in the way that is suggested are ridiculous.

The two facts, both being true, are not, and cannot be, "mutually exclusive".

---
---
---

Replying further:
ToVincent wrote:
Coëmgenu wrote: If you figure the god Ka is so foundationally important to Buddhism, why does the Buddha not speak of him directly?
Buddha never talks about Mitra, although the god Mitra is just about the underlying notion behind Metta (see notes https://justpaste.it/1a3ol).
This one is too much of a non-sequitur. Can you decide if you want Ka to be Prajāpati, Mitra, or all gods? This is just deflection. Can you point out the Buddha speaking directly about "Ka", his presence, or his absence? This would involve more than "rittaka" contrivances.

ToVincent wrote:What is "foundationally important to Buddhism" is that there is no continuous and pervasive god, like in mid & late Vedic creed. And Sakkāyadiṭṭhi (Self-view) is just about that. (SN 22.47). Viz. this Atma>>Brahma>>Prajapati/Ka belief of the mid & l&te Vedic (unorthodox) Brahmins.
[/quote]If you want to call "self" Ka, you are allowed to, but your terminological innovations will cause issues like these on this very thread.

Why bother?
What is the Uncreated?
Sublime & free, what is that obscured Eternity?
It is the Undying, the Bright, the Isle.
It is an Ocean, a Secret: Reality.
Both life and oblivion, it is Nirvāṇa.
ToVincent
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Joined: Tue Aug 30, 2016 6:02 pm

Re: Viable Pāli etymologies

Post by ToVincent »

coëmgenu wrote:Ka existing, (comma) and "rittaka = ritta of ka" being ridiculous, (comma) are not mutually exclusive.
Correcting the punctuation, I understand better what you meant.

Well.
If you mean that "rittaka = ritta of ka" might being ridiculous, I suppose that you got that from Sujato:
https://discourse.suttacentral.net/t/ri ... ented/6347

See how he didn't know about Ka in Vedism at 2017-09-09 00:08:51 - Calls it a silly idea at 00:26:39 - calls it the view of "utter dolts" at 00:54:01 - conclude that this argument is not serious and worthy of critical appraisal at 23:09:51 (a day later) - Yet on that same latter post, he does realize that Ka is not just the "lol-ed" Egyptian Ka, he had refered to, a day before.
So obviously, my argument has to be not serious and worthy of critical appraisal; otherwise he would look a bit like a "dolt" himself.
In other words, making my argument the argument of a dolt, just masks his utter ignorance of the concept of Ka.
Then, comes his twisting of the sources he provides; to make up, and end up with a "fastly made-up" and ludicrous:
"The connection with the form kāya is a religio-linguistic invention of the grammarians".
(A big chunk on Panini being added, to hone his now solid knowledge about the matter (of grammarians) - looks more sturdy).

As far as Sujato's references to other suttas for such words as rittaka; may you send him to Müller's passage he quoted himself, where it is said that words can "acquire such legitimacy, as to call for a separate rule explaining its formation".
I'll even go further:
Our languages are full of words with a primary meaning, that are used later on, in a more trivial way.
The fact that Kāya went on meaning just "body" later on, is just an example of that.
We have seen above in ŚBr. 13.1.8.3, that kāya is evidently related to Ka. Yet, later on it just meant meant "body".
The same could apply to the word rittaka. That is to say, a more trivial use.

One thing for sure, is that the misconception of a self in SN 22.47, and the misconception of the Atma(Atta)>>Brahma>>Prajapati/Ka(atta) of the mid&late Vedic creed, has to do with this Ka.
Everybody knows by now, that Buddha did battle this creed.
coëmgenu wrote: And this here is the misconception Müller talks about. The misconception made by the authors of the Brāhmaṇas.
And this is what the Buddha viewed as a misconception too!

What's your point?
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Re: Viable Pāli etymologies

Post by Coëmgenu »

ToVincent wrote: The fact that Kāya went on meaning just "body" later on, is just an example of that.
We have seen above in ŚBr. 13.1.8.3, that kāya is evidently related to Ka. Yet, later on it just meant meant "body".
They are functional homonyms created by misunderstanding, this "whoish" and "body" kāya. That is what I took from the Venerable's exposition. These two instances of kāya are different words, much like bank, in the sense of a snowbank, or the edge of a river, and bank in the sense of a where you go to handle your money. That is what I understood the Venerable to be saying. Two different understandings from two different periods and two different philosophies and teachings.
Last edited by Coëmgenu on Sun Sep 10, 2017 7:27 pm, edited 1 time in total.
What is the Uncreated?
Sublime & free, what is that obscured Eternity?
It is the Undying, the Bright, the Isle.
It is an Ocean, a Secret: Reality.
Both life and oblivion, it is Nirvāṇa.
ToVincent
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Re: Viable Pāli etymologies

Post by ToVincent »

Coëmgenu wrote:
ToVincent wrote: These are called homonyms, this "whoish" and "body" kāya. That is what I took from the Venerable's exposition. These two instances of kāya are different words
No Sir!
This is just poor knowledge of the Veda.
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Re: Viable Pāli etymologies

Post by Coëmgenu »

ToVincent wrote:
Coëmgenu wrote: These are functional homonyms created my misunderstanding, this "whoish" and "body" kāya. That is what I took from the Venerable's exposition. These two instances of kāya are different words
No Sir!
This is just poor knowledge of the Veda.
Or good knowledge of Buddhism? :shrug:
Last edited by Coëmgenu on Sun Sep 10, 2017 7:49 pm, edited 2 times in total.
What is the Uncreated?
Sublime & free, what is that obscured Eternity?
It is the Undying, the Bright, the Isle.
It is an Ocean, a Secret: Reality.
Both life and oblivion, it is Nirvāṇa.
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Coëmgenu
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Re: Viable Pāli etymologies

Post by Coëmgenu »

Coëmgenu wrote:
ToVincent wrote:
Coëmgenu wrote: These are functional homonyms created my misunderstanding, this "whoish" and "body" kāya. That is what I took from the Venerable's exposition. These two instances of kāya are different words
No Sir!
This is just poor knowledge of the Veda.
Or good knowledge of Buddhism?
Explanation of empty post: I had an argument here involving PIE roots (a *qéi vs a *kʷos), but it turns out that it was incorrect. So I deleted the argument altogether. I can't delete the post itself, though.
Last edited by Coëmgenu on Sun Sep 10, 2017 8:37 pm, edited 7 times in total.
What is the Uncreated?
Sublime & free, what is that obscured Eternity?
It is the Undying, the Bright, the Isle.
It is an Ocean, a Secret: Reality.
Both life and oblivion, it is Nirvāṇa.
ToVincent
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Re: Viable Pāli etymologies

Post by ToVincent »

coëmgenu wrote:...
And when you blabbermouth on me on other forum, (on which I don't go any longer), on things I write in this one - moreover, calling me "troll" and other things - please be nice enough not to taint it with intentional mendacity.
I will just take an example about many others.
Never did I say that:
"The Pāli “language” is simply “degraded Vedic Sanskrit” that the monks forgot how to pronounce over time."
Never did I say that on this forum (DW).

I did say though, that the Buddha, who certainly did speak Pali with his compatriots, was philosophically fostered through Vedic/Sanskrit, the language of the Vedas. This language was the prime language of the highest varnas, of which the Prince was part as a kśatrya. Just like nobles in 16th century Europe, were brought up through Latin. Vedic/Sanskrit of the Vedas, was the elite's language.
I have never said that the Pāli “language” is simply “degraded Vedic Sanskrit”.
It did borrow a lot from it.

So, if you quote me, please do so. But don't interpret.

I would appreciate - Thank you.
Last edited by ToVincent on Sun Sep 10, 2017 8:00 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Viable Pāli etymologies

Post by Coëmgenu »

I will delete that thread promptly if you doubt my good intentions. In fact, have done so already, the result of that is pending as we speak. Everything I wrote in it, though, is an understanding of what you say that I gleaned from your writings here and on your website. Anything presented wrongly was my fault.

Either way, the post will be gone shortly, as you have objected to it. Never to be seen by anyone ever again. And that is quite fine.

Now, I wrote this post as a farewell for the day, however, honesty compels me to write one point further, here.

This here:
Coëmgenu wrote:Can you point out the Buddha speaking directly about "Ka", his presence, or his absence? This would involve more than "rittaka" contrivances.
I have already used the word "ridiculous" here, so I wont backtrack and use a kinder word in the interest of being honest about my own less-than-skillful choices of words. This is not an allowance for what I truly do (and other as well do) consider a "ridiculous" contrivance, namely that the "ka" in rittaka (tucchaka, asāraka et al.) is an explicit reference to Prajāpati.

However, in the interest of presenting an even view, and also holding myself up to the same level of highly critical scrutiny I am directing against ToVincent, I need to make two points: 1) that there are no references to this "ka=prajāpati" notion in the EBTs may not be quite correct, and 2) depending on if the *qéi and the *kʷos I was consulting earlier are actually two divergent renderings of the same root, I think it might actually be established that kāya (referring to the word as "body"), as a word, does indeed derive from a personal pronoun.

This makes my statement here:
Coëmgenu wrote:Similarly, कायक (kāyaka) is the "kāya (KA + īya) of Ka". Its all rather meta with that compound.
Is only half as correct a critique of the methodologies I was doubting as I initially believed. We still have the claiming of the "ka" at the end of these words as an explicit references to Prajāpati (unless ToVincent would like to later, in the interest of not having me misrepresent his stances, correct me as to his view regarding the particular ka and the end of kāyaka). I still think this is equally as ridiculous as rittaka (tucchaka, asāraka, et al). It is a confusion of grammar, as I see it, which is why I began the questioning with the example of "Abhidhammika", which is not a reference to Prajāpati. For another perspective, Ven Sujato sees the "ka's" at the ends of these words as diminutives. This all, this paragraph here, addresses the "ka" at the end of words and claims about it. Moving on to "ka" in a different context.

This is the line that potentially changed my mind regarding specifically kāya, from DN, which is widely speculated to have been a collection compiled with the express purpose of converting Brahmins:
Tathāgatassa hetaṃ, vāseṭṭha, adhivacanaṃ ‘dhammakāyo’ itipi, ‘brahmakāyo’ itipi, ‘dhammabhūto’ itipi, ‘brahmabhūto’ itipi.
Brahmakāyo, specifically here, I think there is a possible argument for the "Whoish" reading of kāya specifically rather than the "collection/body" reading. Although, to be fair, I think it is complicated by the immediate presence of dhammakāyo, to which the "body/collection" reading far more readily applies.

What moves me toward the "Whoish" reading for brahmakāyo is the highly tenuous, syncretic, and Christian reading I had previously held for brahmakāyo & brahmabhūto, highly influenced, as it was, by the notion of theosis:
"For the Son of God became man so that we might become God." -Saint Athanasius of Alexandria
I had never been convinced of this, though. It always seemed too "convenient". However, that the practitioner becomes the "body of Brahma" seems as nice a metaphor as anything else for the ultimate achievement.

However, looking at brahmakāyo in light of the sacrificial altar, and looking at the kāyo as "that which is dedicated to", and looking at kāyo as a burnt offering (I am thinking here of "extinguished" as a notion, i.e. Nibbāna). I think that this reading is actually much less contrived than my previous theosis-influenced reading was, at the very least. Although I myself would not vouch for it independently.

I would like to remain clear that my position regarding rittaka, tucchaka, asāraka, et al, is the same.

---------
---------
---------

All in all, I have to be on my way, and cannot argue any longer for today. Perhaps we will be able to enjoy our mutual disagreements another time.
What is the Uncreated?
Sublime & free, what is that obscured Eternity?
It is the Undying, the Bright, the Isle.
It is an Ocean, a Secret: Reality.
Both life and oblivion, it is Nirvāṇa.
ToVincent
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Re: Viable Pāli etymologies

Post by ToVincent »

coëmgenu wrote: Similarly, कायक (kāyaka) is the "kāya (KA + īya) of Ka". Its all rather meta with that compound.
कायक (kāyaka) is, I suppose, a late post-Buddhist Sanskrit word, that means "belonging or relating to the (corporeal) body".
In this case, कायक kāyaka (kāya-ka) means "concerning the body".

॰क -ka forms agents.
- In fine compositi, -ka >> substantive of parentage.
or
- In fine compositi, -ka >> diminutive.

In the above case, the former -ka applies - that is to say: "concerning - relating to".
Viz. "Concerning what belongs to Ka".
कायक (kāyaka) = क ka + ॰य -ya (w/the vṛddhi of the theme) + ॰क ka

Yet, that word kāyaka, became through time, a more common way to say "concerning the (mere physical) body".

For what is interesting, is the later use of kāya in kāyaka.
As I said in a previous post, some words can go "trivial" (more common,) along the way, and lose their primary meaning.

kāyaka, for instance, went to mean "relating to (concerning) the corporeal body".
While Kāya, in pre-Bhuddist and Buddhist philosophy, has quite a wider range of meaning, than the later use of a mere "corporeal body".
kāyaka becomes almost śarīra ( शरीर ) [√ शॄ śṝ (shattered-decay) + -॰ईर -īra (which goes)].

However, śarīra, the physical body, is not kāya, the "body", viz. the "organs" of early Indian philosophy.
Note that here, "organs" do not just mean the ear, the nose, the liver, the stomach, etc.
I suppose that, to have the insight of what the "organs" mean in early Indian philosophy, requires more than a quick "one day" google search fix.
Knowing to discern the commonalities in the extensiveness of the development of Brahma>>Prājapati(Ka), among the different views of the Ṛśis, requires more than picking quickly some informations, here and there, on the WWW - particularly on a short range of time.

Now, what imports to me in this discussion coming from another thread, is that people understand that the Self/self, was considered as pervasive and continuous, in late Vedic philosophy - and that the Buddha did raise against this view.
His rationale was that, it could not be continuous, because the khandhas (and their subsequent dhammas) are impermanent.
Simple as that.
So "anatta" means a "not continuous" self - unlike the continuous Self/self of the Upaniṣadic creed, at the time of Buddha.

And what is "atta"?
- atta in Vedic terms, is the person, the individuality, that has an inherent character of continuity.
- atta in Buddhist terms, is the person, the individuality, that has no inherent character of continuity.


End of discussion, as far as I am concerned.
In this world, there are many people acting and yearning for the Mara's world; some for the Brahma's world; and very few for the Unborn.
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Assaji
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Re: Viable Pāli etymologies

Post by Assaji »

Hi Vincent,
ToVincent wrote:However, śarīra, the physical body, is not kāya, the "body", viz. the "organs" of early Indian philosophy.
Note that here, "organs" do not just mean the ear, the nose, the liver, the stomach, etc.
There's a thread about this:
https://dhammawheel.com/viewtopic.php?f=23&t=13799
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