Hello Vincent,vinasp wrote:Hi mawkish1983,
The most complete exposition of what statements the Buddha would or would not make is found in the Abhayarajakumara Sutta ( M. 58 ) but it is complicated . The essense of it is that whether or not a statement is made depends not just on its truth but also whether it is usefull and pleasant , there are eight combinations in total. I am looking for a simpler account or some cases where this is taught by example. I remember there is a sutta where the Buddha meets Vacchagotta and does not teach the no-self doctrine ( even though it is true ) because Vacchagottas mind is too disturbed on that occasion. But this is really an example of refraining from teaching the truth which is not quite what we need.
Kind regards, Vincent.
The Buddha did not lie. He, like any skillful teacher, taught at the level his students could understand. This link below, with a compilation of his words on Right Speech may be helpful.
metta
Chris
1. EXPLANATION OF SAMMAVACA
2. NOBLE & IGNOBLE WAYS OF SPEAKING
3. TWO MODES OF SAMMAVACA: LOKIYA & LOKUTTARA
4. STANDARD FOR SCRUTINIZING "SPOKEN KARMA"
5. POINTS OF PRAISE & BLAME CONCERNING SAMMAVACA
6. ELABORATION OF THE FOUR SAMMAVACA
7. WELL-SPOKEN WORDS ARE SAMMAVACA
8. WELL-SPOKEN WORDS ARE SAMMAVACA
(another angle)
9. SPEECH OF NOBLE & IGNOBLE PERSONS
10. STANDARD OF HIGHEST SAMMAVACA
11. HIGHEST LEVEL OF SAMMAVACA (Buddha-level)
12. EXAMPLES OF FRIVOLOUS SPEECH IN TEACHERS
13. RESULTS OF WRONG SPEECH
SUTTA REFERENCES
1. EXPLANATION OF SAMMAVACA
2. NOBLE & IGNOBLE WAYS OF SPEAKING
3. TWO MODES OF SAMMAVACA: LOKIYA & LOKUTTARA
4. STANDARD FOR SCRUTINIZING "SPOKEN KARMA"
5. POINTS OF PRAISE & BLAME CONCERNING SAMMAVACA
6. ELABORATION OF THE FOUR SAMMAVACA
7. WELL-SPOKEN WORDS ARE SAMMAVACA
8. WELL-SPOKEN WORDS ARE SAMMAVACA
(another angle)
9. SPEECH OF NOBLE & IGNOBLE PERSONS
10. STANDARD OF HIGHEST SAMMAVACA
11. HIGHEST LEVEL OF SAMMAVACA (Buddha-level)
12. EXAMPLES OF FRIVOLOUS SPEECH IN TEACHERS
13. RESULTS OF WRONG SPEECH
SUTTA REFERENCES
http://www.suanmokkh.org/archive/rtspch1.htm" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;