Haters Holding US Hostage Embraced Denial, Resistance and Wi

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tiltbillings
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Re: Haters Holding US Hostage Embraced Denial, Resistance an

Post by tiltbillings » Fri Oct 18, 2013 9:20 pm

purple planet wrote:
Shinning ignorance.
Thats harsh speech - you have some really good posts - i thought you are quite advanced in the path at least more then me - how does this seat with right speech ?
It is not harsh speech. It is that you simply do not know what you are taking about.
>> Do you see a man wise [enlightened/ariya] in his own eyes? There is more hope for a fool than for him.<< -- Proverbs 26:12

This being is bound to samsara, kamma is his means for going beyond. -- SN I, 38.

“Of course it is happening inside your head, Harry, but why on earth should that mean that it is not real?” HPatDH p.723

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Re: Haters Holding US Hostage Embraced Denial, Resistance an

Post by tiltbillings » Fri Oct 18, 2013 9:23 pm

Modus.Ponens wrote:
tiltbillings wrote:
Modus.Ponens wrote:I was about to criticise you, but then I saw you are from Israel. Take it from someone who neither lives in paranoic fear of islam (which is understandable from an Israeli national) but who knows what the religion is: Obama has n-o-t-h-i-n-g to do with islam. He is a bad president, but not because of any of that. But at least he's not a lizard!
George W. Bush was a bad president.
Yes. Worse.

But I, as a proud socialist (in the modern/nordic sense of the word), am very disapointed, to say the least, with the aledged socialism of Obama. I know he is facing opposition by a group of intractable numbskuls, but he could do better.
He could? Well, share with us what he could do that is better. Show us your insight into this problem. Shows how he is a bad president.
>> Do you see a man wise [enlightened/ariya] in his own eyes? There is more hope for a fool than for him.<< -- Proverbs 26:12

This being is bound to samsara, kamma is his means for going beyond. -- SN I, 38.

“Of course it is happening inside your head, Harry, but why on earth should that mean that it is not real?” HPatDH p.723

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Re: Haters Holding US Hostage Embraced Denial, Resistance an

Post by DNS » Fri Oct 18, 2013 9:25 pm

Shalom purpleplanet,

Actually, the U.S. has been historically on the side of Israel in almost all issues related to the Middle East. Most people who have complained about the U.S. - Israeli connection, have complained that it is too strongly biased toward Israel and not enough of a balance of considering the concerns and plight of Arabs in the region. Most nations and people around the world feel that U.S. foreign policy has been too biased toward Israel, not the other way around.

I personally would like to see a more balanced position -- for the sake of peace for everyone. But of course I don't live in Israel anymore, so understand that there are a multitude of views. But I think it would be best for Israel too, if there was more peace, not warfare.

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Re: Haters Holding US Hostage Embraced Denial, Resistance an

Post by Modus.Ponens » Fri Oct 18, 2013 9:45 pm

tiltbillings wrote:
Modus.Ponens wrote:
tiltbillings wrote:George W. Bush was a bad president.
Yes. Worse.

But I, as a proud socialist (in the modern/nordic sense of the word), am very disapointed, to say the least, with the aledged socialism of Obama. I know he is facing opposition by a group of intractable numbskuls, but he could do better.
He could? Well, share with us what he could do that is better. Show us your insight into this problem. Shows how he is a bad president.
Well I must admit I'm not very well informed on the subject, so my opinion has limited value. My information of american politics comes mainly from the Daily Show with Jon Stewart. However, the fact that Obama cannot "sell" the idea that people who are poor have the right to not die because of lack of health treatment, is absolutely insane! Many rich people paying less percentage of taxes than poor people is absolutely insane! If he can't argue the obvious it's either because he is incompetent or because he doesn't want to. Either way, he's a bad president.
"He turns his mind away from those phenomena and, having done so, inclines his mind to the property of deathlessness: 'This is peace, this is exquisite — the resolution of all fabrications; the relinquishment of all acquisitions; the ending of craving; dispassion; cessation; Unbinding.' " - Jhana Sutta

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Re: Haters Holding US Hostage Embraced Denial, Resistance an

Post by purple planet » Fri Oct 18, 2013 9:48 pm

all this politcal issues are strongly connected to islam - how can i talk about this issues without talking about islam ? - i cant
( by the way im no bush fan just saying obama is worse)

as always i try to stay away from the lounge - not with success so i hope this is my last post feel free to continue to reply just dont expect me to reply
purple planet wrote:

Shinning ignorance.



Thats harsh speech - you have some really good posts - i thought you are quite advanced in the path at least more then me - how does this seat with right speech ?

It is not harsh speech. It is that you simply do not know what you are taking about.
i guess its about my views and not me - even though i talked bad about the article - i talked about the article and not about the writer of the article + his not here ( i hope ) -
Shinning ignorance
- i guess it can be seen as a legit statment about my post and its not clearly wrong i cant say exactly why but it does seem like harsh speech and as something that could have been softer - like : "this view point is ignorant" or "what you said is ignorant" - that way the reader dosnt connect it with "himself"
Last edited by purple planet on Fri Oct 18, 2013 10:22 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Haters Holding US Hostage Embraced Denial, Resistance an

Post by mikenz66 » Fri Oct 18, 2013 10:00 pm

Hi PP,
purple planet wrote:sorry cant say anything cause my post well get deleted and i will get my number 4 warning - how much warnings are there ?
all this politcal issues are strongly connected to islam - how can i talk about this issues without talking about islam ? - i cant
( by the way im no bush fan just saying obama is worse)
Actually, the TOS say:
* Badmouthing of other spiritual paths is not allowed.
So it would be against the TOS to argue, for example, that Islam is inherently evil. It is not be against the TOS to state opinions and worries about political and military conflicts.

The TOS also does not allow:
meta-discussion (i.e. discussion about discussion),
and you are currently violating that portion of the TOS.

:anjali:
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Re: Haters Holding US Hostage Embraced Denial, Resistance an

Post by Justsit » Fri Oct 18, 2013 10:04 pm

Modus.Ponens wrote:My information of american politics comes mainly from the Daily Show with Jon Stewart.
Well, that's a problem right there. Not exactly a trusted source.


[quote="Modus.Ponens}...fact that Obama cannot "sell" the idea that people who are poor have the right to not die because of lack of health treatment, is absolutely insane! Many rich people paying less percentage of taxes than poor people is absolutely insane! If he can't argue the obvious it's either because he is incompetent or because he doesn't want to. Either way, he's a bad president.[/quote]

Wrong! Of course those things are insane. But trying to "sell" those ideas is futile. The people who have the big money and those who run the financial institutions do not care about the poor. Obama could talk until he's blue in the face and nothing would change. He is constrained by the realities of how power is wielded in America. And perhaps you might not be aware of this, but POTUS is not the one pulling the biggest strings.

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Re: Haters Holding US Hostage Embraced Denial, Resistance an

Post by tiltbillings » Fri Oct 18, 2013 10:13 pm

Modus.Ponens wrote:
Well I must admit I'm not very well informed on the subject, so my opinion has limited value. My information of american politics comes mainly from the Daily Show with Jon Stewart.
The Daily Show. Good gawd!! Great, biting satire and commentary at times, but hardly a basis for a careful, considered criticism.

However, the fact that Obama cannot "sell" the idea that people who are poor have the right to not die because of lack of health treatment, is absolutely insane! Many rich people paying less percentage of taxes than poor people is absolutely insane! If he can't argue the obvious it's either because he is incompetent or because he doesn't want to. Either way, he's a bad president.
Ignorance of what the situation actually is. He is not a bad president. He is a president that is in a bad situation, much of which is out of his control, much of which has to do with forces that have been at play for some long while. He is a president that has moved things forward, while the atavistic forces are pushing back against that changes that are to them extremely fearsome. The USA is changing, it is browning, it is becoming more tolerant, but there are those who find this frightening, there are those who will exploit this fear for power and money. What we are seeing with America is a fascinating struggle as it pushes forward. Obama is not a bad president. While he is far from perfect, his pushing the social agenda of health care and equality, and his twice being elected, point to, for all the turmoil and struggle, something good going on here.
>> Do you see a man wise [enlightened/ariya] in his own eyes? There is more hope for a fool than for him.<< -- Proverbs 26:12

This being is bound to samsara, kamma is his means for going beyond. -- SN I, 38.

“Of course it is happening inside your head, Harry, but why on earth should that mean that it is not real?” HPatDH p.723

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Ben
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Re: Haters Holding US Hostage Embraced Denial, Resistance an

Post by Ben » Fri Oct 18, 2013 10:42 pm

I have to agree with Tilt. Obama, considering the hysterical opposition and criminal economic vandalism by the tea-bag party, has done very well. I think history will judge Obama as one of the best presidents of the US.
Kind regards,
Ben
“No lists of things to be done. The day providential to itself. The hour. There is no later. This is later. All things of grace and beauty such that one holds them to one's heart have a common provenance in pain. Their birth in grief and ashes.”
- Cormac McCarthy, The Road

Learn this from the waters:
in mountain clefts and chasms,
loud gush the streamlets,
but great rivers flow silently.
- Sutta Nipata 3.725

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dagon
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Re: Haters Holding US Hostage Embraced Denial, Resistance an

Post by dagon » Fri Oct 18, 2013 10:55 pm

Ben wrote:I have to agree with Tilt. Obama, considering the hysterical opposition and criminal economic vandalism by the tea-bag party, has done very well. I think history will judge Obama as one of the best presidents of the US.
Kind regards,
Ben
plus one

He is the first American President in this lifetime that i have respected.
PS - any chance of swapping leaders - you can have ours - PLEASE

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Re: Haters Holding US Hostage Embraced Denial, Resistance an

Post by SDC » Fri Oct 18, 2013 10:57 pm

Modus.Ponens wrote:Well I must admit I'm not very well informed on the subject, so my opinion has limited value. My information of american politics comes mainly from the Daily Show with Jon Stewart. However, the fact that Obama cannot "sell" the idea that people who are poor have the right to not die because of lack of health treatment, is absolutely insane! Many rich people paying less percentage of taxes than poor people is absolutely insane! If he can't argue the obvious it's either because he is incompetent or because he doesn't want to. Either way, he's a bad president.
Face palm!

Even though I disagreed with most of your recent anti-American posts, I was at least giving you the benefit of the doubt that you were somewhat informed. That's over now. Nothing personal though.

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Re: Haters Holding US Hostage Embraced Denial, Resistance an

Post by Modus.Ponens » Fri Oct 18, 2013 11:25 pm

Even though I don't have a detailed knowledge of american politics, I have put forward two arguments explaining why, imo, Obama is a bad president. Since I admited that I didn't have detailed knowledge you guys didn't even bother puting counter-arguments forward. "Oh, the poor ignorant guy. He has no idea." The two points stand _ and there's more. But let's focus on these for now.
"He turns his mind away from those phenomena and, having done so, inclines his mind to the property of deathlessness: 'This is peace, this is exquisite — the resolution of all fabrications; the relinquishment of all acquisitions; the ending of craving; dispassion; cessation; Unbinding.' " - Jhana Sutta

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Re: Haters Holding US Hostage Embraced Denial, Resistance an

Post by dagon » Fri Oct 18, 2013 11:32 pm

Modus.Ponens wrote:Even though I don't have a detailed knowledge of american politics, I have put forward two arguments explaining why, imo, Obama is a bad president. Since I admited that I didn't have detailed knowledge you guys didn't even bother puting counter-arguments forward. "Oh, the poor ignorant guy. He has no idea." The two points stand _ and there's more. But let's focus on these for now.
I am not american or interested in arguing but you may find this article interesting
http://www.washingtonmonthly.com/magazi ... 035755.php

metta
paul

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Re: Haters Holding US Hostage Embraced Denial, Resistance an

Post by SDC » Fri Oct 18, 2013 11:32 pm

I don't get into detailed political discussions because my knowledge is casual at best and my motivation to engage is almost non-existent.

And I didn't post that to dissuade you in any way from posting, but I will now look at what you say about this particular topic differently.

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Re: Haters Holding US Hostage Embraced Denial, Resistance an

Post by tiltbillings » Fri Oct 18, 2013 11:47 pm

Modus.Ponens wrote:Even though I don't have a detailed knowledge of american politics, I have put forward two arguments explaining why, imo, Obama is a bad president. Since I admited that I didn't have detailed knowledge you guys didn't even bother puting counter-arguments forward. "Oh, the poor ignorant guy. He has no idea." The two points stand _ and there's more. But let's focus on these for now.
I did put forth a very straightforward response to your abysmally ignorant opinion about Obama.
>> Do you see a man wise [enlightened/ariya] in his own eyes? There is more hope for a fool than for him.<< -- Proverbs 26:12

This being is bound to samsara, kamma is his means for going beyond. -- SN I, 38.

“Of course it is happening inside your head, Harry, but why on earth should that mean that it is not real?” HPatDH p.723

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