Buddhism and smoking, what's your thoughts?

A discussion on all aspects of Theravāda Buddhism
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sundara
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Is tobacco a drug

Post by sundara » Sat Jul 25, 2009 11:39 pm

Is tobacco a drug and what are it's effects because I just put the fumes in the canal and in the mouth not in the lungs.

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DNS
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Re: Is tobacco a drug

Post by DNS » Sat Jul 25, 2009 11:44 pm

http://buddhismatoz.com/s/Smoking.html" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

Ven. Dhammika and others don't consider it a drug, in the sense of street drugs or prescription narcotics. But it can certainly be addictive and harmful to the body.

There are plenty of monks who smoke in Thailand and some other Southeast Asian nations, but the Sri Lankans seem to be the most opposed to it. For monastics, there is usually no health or maintenance reason to smoke, so it probably should not be considered okay, but for lay people the rules are not so strict.

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Ben
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Re: Is tobacco a drug

Post by Ben » Sun Jul 26, 2009 2:53 am

By not inhaing the smoke you still risk mouth cancer.
Only a fool would continue smoking, given the serious health effects.
The active drug in tobacco is nicotine, while it is not an intoxicant, it is one of the agents within tobacco that will kill you.

Ben
“No lists of things to be done. The day providential to itself. The hour. There is no later. This is later. All things of grace and beauty such that one holds them to one's heart have a common provenance in pain. Their birth in grief and ashes.”
- Cormac McCarthy, The Road

Learn this from the waters:
in mountain clefts and chasms,
loud gush the streamlets,
but great rivers flow silently.
- Sutta Nipata 3.725

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Jechbi
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Re: Is tobacco a drug

Post by Jechbi » Sun Jul 26, 2009 3:33 am

Ben wrote:Only a fool would continue smoking ...
There are lots of things that only a fool would continue to do.

I applaud those fools who are working on giving up smoking. It's hard. Don't be discouraged.
Rain soddens what is kept wrapped up,
But never soddens what is open;
Uncover, then, what is concealed,
Lest it be soddened by the rain.

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clw_uk
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Re: Is tobacco a drug

Post by clw_uk » Sun Jul 26, 2009 3:35 am

I myself used to be a heavy smoker, i tried many times to quit but the only thing that worked was Buddhas teachings on attachment and sensuality and meditation practice, put together with patience and forgiveness when i failed the fags went, now i dont ever crave them :)
Unbowed, Unbent, Unbroken

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Annapurna
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Re: Is tobacco a drug

Post by Annapurna » Sun Jul 26, 2009 6:54 am

sundara wrote:Is tobacco a drug and what are it's effects because I just put the fumes in the canal and in the mouth not in the lungs.
Nicotine is very addictive and damages your heart and vessels, and the tar in cigarattes plus over 140 other toxins cause cancer etc.

If you can help it, don't even start. It's not "chic", it's a stupid, suicidal waste of money.

Some kids try to feel adult by copying the adults' vices, instead of their virtues.

4 of my friends died in the last years, all were heavy smokers:

1. lung emphysema,
2. lungcancer,
3. heartattack,
4. cardiac arrest.

But it's your choice.

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tiltbillings
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Re: Is tobacco a drug

Post by tiltbillings » Sun Jul 26, 2009 7:34 am

Tobacco is self inflicted disease.
>> Do you see a man wise [enlightened/ariya] in his own eyes? There is more hope for a fool than for him.<< -- Proverbs 26:12

This being is bound to samsara, kamma is his means for going beyond. -- SN I, 38.

“Of course it is happening inside your head, Harry, but why on earth should that mean that it is not real?” HPatDH p.723

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Jechbi
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Re: Is tobacco a drug

Post by Jechbi » Sun Jul 26, 2009 10:51 am

tiltbillings wrote:Tobacco is self inflicted disease.
Lots of things are self-inflicted diseases. Life is a terminal condition.
Rain soddens what is kept wrapped up,
But never soddens what is open;
Uncover, then, what is concealed,
Lest it be soddened by the rain.

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Ben
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Re: Is tobacco a drug

Post by Ben » Sun Jul 26, 2009 11:08 am

Jechbi wrote:
tiltbillings wrote:Tobacco is self inflicted disease.
Lots of things are self-inflicted diseases. Life is a terminal condition.
Absolutely, but one can reduce their disease burden by either not smoking or giving it up.
“No lists of things to be done. The day providential to itself. The hour. There is no later. This is later. All things of grace and beauty such that one holds them to one's heart have a common provenance in pain. Their birth in grief and ashes.”
- Cormac McCarthy, The Road

Learn this from the waters:
in mountain clefts and chasms,
loud gush the streamlets,
but great rivers flow silently.
- Sutta Nipata 3.725

Compassionate Hands Foundation (Buddhist aid in Myanmar) • Buddhist Global ReliefUNHCR

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Jechbi
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smoking and poverty

Post by Jechbi » Sun Jul 26, 2009 11:21 am

Ben wrote:Absolutely, but one can reduce their disease burden by either not smoking or giving it up.
No doubt. For some, it's easier said than done. There's a real backlash of contempt against smokers these days, and I think in many cases it's more complicated than "just say no," as Nancy Reagan used to suggest regarding drugs.

Link to .pdf file: Correlation between smoking and poverty. From that link:
... smoking is more common among poor men (variously defined by income, education, occupation, or social class) than rich men in nearly all countries. ... Why poor people smoke more remains a complex question that requires further research.
Metta
Rain soddens what is kept wrapped up,
But never soddens what is open;
Uncover, then, what is concealed,
Lest it be soddened by the rain.

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Ben
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Re: Is tobacco a drug

Post by Ben » Sun Jul 26, 2009 11:59 am

Hi Jechbi
I absolutely agree. Smoking-related illnesses are rapidly becoming the domain of the lower socio-economic groups, certainly in this country and I assume also in the US as well. Continued smoking also becomes a vehicle for continuing poverty. In this country, the federal government is considering increasing the tax on tobacco to make a packet of 25 cigarettes to over $20. So, for those unfortunate to contract smoking-related disease, the many years of cigarette consumption becomes the financial down-payment which is followed by years of the crippling cost (personal and social) of treatment.
So, in my mind, it becomes even more imperative that those who can least afford tobacco and the treatment of smoking-related disease, do what they can to break the addition. And government sponsored health programs should target those sectors of the community.
Like you, I also smoked but I broke the back of addiction by a 12-week program of nicotine replacement therapy. And I recommend the same to any smoker. I just think that it should be fully subsidised by governments who have reaped billions of dollars from tobacco taxes for generations.
Kind regards

Ben
“No lists of things to be done. The day providential to itself. The hour. There is no later. This is later. All things of grace and beauty such that one holds them to one's heart have a common provenance in pain. Their birth in grief and ashes.”
- Cormac McCarthy, The Road

Learn this from the waters:
in mountain clefts and chasms,
loud gush the streamlets,
but great rivers flow silently.
- Sutta Nipata 3.725

Compassionate Hands Foundation (Buddhist aid in Myanmar) • Buddhist Global ReliefUNHCR

e: ben.dhammawheel@gmail.com..

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Annapurna
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Re: Is tobacco a drug

Post by Annapurna » Sun Jul 26, 2009 12:05 pm

... smoking is more common among poor men (variously defined by income, education, occupation, or social class) than rich men in nearly all countries. ... Why poor people smoke more remains a complex question that requires further research.
Poor people have more frustration to compensate. They do it with pleasure.

Smoking is a pleasure, when you're addicted. Before you're addicted,to smoke means you're grown up, and cool. If you don't smoke, people tease you.

Lack of intelligence/education/chances may lead to quick fixes.

Plus, things like smoking or drinking are considered heroic deeds in certain circles.

I know a family of 8, in which all 4 brothers and sisters don't meet on a Saturday night to have dinner somewhere, go to a movie or to dance, but "to drink".

And that's what they do.

A good night out is one where everybody drinks a lot, laughs a lot, and, with the additional courage alcohol brings, perhaps tells some a**holes a thing or two.

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Cittasanto
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Re: Is tobacco a drug

Post by Cittasanto » Sun Jul 26, 2009 5:32 pm

who here has actually looked at the actuall statistics?

I seriously doubt anyone has!

most of the figgures are NOT of a significant difference to make the assurtion that smoking causes cancer.

Japan has the longest life expectancy and the highest amount of cigarets per day per person, but fewer smoking related cancers per 100,000 people than in the US, strange.

http://www.smokingaloud.com/death.html" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
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But if he is equally unable to refute the reasons on the opposite side, if he does not so much as know what they are, he has no ground for preferring either opinion …
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Ben
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Re: Is tobacco a drug

Post by Ben » Sun Jul 26, 2009 10:12 pm

Perhaps you should have a look at this Manapa:
http://www.quit.org.au/article.asp?ContentID=7484" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
“No lists of things to be done. The day providential to itself. The hour. There is no later. This is later. All things of grace and beauty such that one holds them to one's heart have a common provenance in pain. Their birth in grief and ashes.”
- Cormac McCarthy, The Road

Learn this from the waters:
in mountain clefts and chasms,
loud gush the streamlets,
but great rivers flow silently.
- Sutta Nipata 3.725

Compassionate Hands Foundation (Buddhist aid in Myanmar) • Buddhist Global ReliefUNHCR

e: ben.dhammawheel@gmail.com..

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BlackBird
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Re: Is tobacco a drug

Post by BlackBird » Sun Jul 26, 2009 10:43 pm

Ben wrote:The active drug in tobacco is nicotine, while it is not an intoxicant, it is one of the agents within tobacco that will kill you.
Could you please point me to some evidence which supports this, apart from hypothesised links, I am unable to find any which shows that Nicotine is an agent that kills.
Ben wrote:Only a fool would continue smoking, given the serious health effects.
Ajahn Mun smoked 4 cigarettes a day. The often heard response is: "Oh, well they didn't know about the health risks back then."
My response to this is that surely, such an excellent man as Ajahn Mun would have known the health effects of smoking cigarettes.

Having read your link Ben, all I can see is more correlation, I cannot see any causation.
Manapa's link is worth a good read.

Hope you all have a great day!
Jack
"For a disciple who has conviction in the Teacher's message & lives to penetrate it, what accords with the Dhamma is this:
'The Blessed One is the Teacher, I am a disciple. He is the one who knows, not I." - MN. 70 Kitagiri Sutta

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