My guess you have not been reading this thread from its inception. The Sujinists here talk about their practice taking eons to come to fruition, so it does not look that they are advocating a "ripeness" -- a la Bahiya -- possibility in their hearing, thinking about, and hoping for insight.binocular wrote:Well, it's not such an outlandish idea. There are stories of plenty of people who have heard a few words from the Buddha, practiced a little, and "in no long time reached & remained in the supreme goal of the holy life for which clansmen rightly go forth from home into homelessness, knowing & realizing it for himself in the here & now."tiltbillings wrote:What were are being asked to believe by the Sujin followers, in the most bare terms, is that by thinking about a concept we have heard a remarkable level of concentration and awareness will automatically arise.
Perhaps we wrongfully take for granted that we're not close, not ripe for such a quick path to enlightenment.
An interesting example of the "ripeness" possibility is, indeed, the case of Bahiya, who was given very brief and very specific instructions and as a result of which he woke up. The same instructions are given to Ven. Malunkyaputta, who had to actually put them into practice before waking up. The instructions in these suttas are just that: instruction for practice. That Bahiya woke up upon hearing these instructions points to two things: the efficacy of the instructions as well as the the Buddha's ability to teach the right thing to the right person at the right time. But for us what is important is the efficacy of the instructions.
While we may have the Buddha's teachings, we do not have do not have the Buddha himself sitting directly in front of us with his abilities, saying just the right thing. But we do have the Buddha's teaching and what we do with them is to put them into practice. It is not a matter of just hearing them and then thinking about them, hoping that that will somehow cause insight to arise.
As the Buddha's teachings make clear, we can cultivate those aspects that are natural to our minds, concentration and attention, that will allow us to see what needs to be seen clearly, giving rise to insight.