Looking for a particular Sutta

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Bakmoon
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Looking for a particular Sutta

Post by Bakmoon » Wed Jan 23, 2013 10:57 pm

There is a Sutta in which the Buddha is asked why he uses terms such as I, me, you, and self, and the Buddha responds that he uses these terms as conventions, but I can't remember which Sutta it is in. Anyone know?
The non-doing of any evil,
The performance of what's skillful,
The cleansing of one's own mind:
This is the Buddhas' teaching.

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Cittasanto
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Re: Looking for a particular Sutta

Post by Cittasanto » Wed Jan 23, 2013 11:22 pm

Bakmoon wrote:There is a Sutta in which the Buddha is asked why he uses terms such as I, me, you, and self, and the Buddha responds that he uses these terms as conventions, but I can't remember which Sutta it is in. Anyone know?
Is this it?
DN9 - Potthapada Sutta wrote:"Citta, these are the world's designations, the world's expressions, the world's ways of speaking, the world's descriptions, with which the Tathagata expresses himself but without grasping to them."
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He who knows only his own side of the case knows little of that. His reasons may be good, and no one may have been able to refute them.
But if he is equally unable to refute the reasons on the opposite side, if he does not so much as know what they are, he has no ground for preferring either opinion …
...
He must be able to hear them from persons who actually believe them … he must know them in their most plausible and persuasive form.
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Bakmoon
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Re: Looking for a particular Sutta

Post by Bakmoon » Thu Jan 24, 2013 1:35 am

Cittasanto wrote:
Bakmoon wrote:There is a Sutta in which the Buddha is asked why he uses terms such as I, me, you, and self, and the Buddha responds that he uses these terms as conventions, but I can't remember which Sutta it is in. Anyone know?
Is this it?
DN9 - Potthapada Sutta wrote:"Citta, these are the world's designations, the world's expressions, the world's ways of speaking, the world's descriptions, with which the Tathagata expresses himself but without grasping to them."
I don't think so. The one I remember was rather short.
The non-doing of any evil,
The performance of what's skillful,
The cleansing of one's own mind:
This is the Buddhas' teaching.

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daverupa
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Re: Looking for a particular Sutta

Post by daverupa » Fri Jan 25, 2013 3:23 pm

Bakmoon wrote:I don't think so. The one I remember was rather short.
It only occurs in the Nikayas in DN 9 and MN 74; perhaps you read Mahaniddesa 284 & 303, which quotes the occasion in MN 74.
  • "And how is it, bhikkhus, that by protecting oneself one protects others? By the pursuit, development, and cultivation of the four establishments of mindfulness. It is in such a way that by protecting oneself one protects others.

    "And how is it, bhikkhus, that by protecting others one protects oneself? By patience, harmlessness, goodwill, and sympathy. It is in such a way that by protecting others one protects oneself.

- Sedaka Sutta [SN 47.19]

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ground
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Re: Looking for a particular Sutta

Post by ground » Fri Jan 25, 2013 4:48 pm

[Deva:]
He who's an Arahant, his work achieved,
Free from taints, in final body clad,
That monk still might use such words as "I."
Still perchance might say: "They call this mine."
...
Would such a monk be prone to vain conceits?

[The Blessed One:]
Bonds are gone for him without conceits,
All delusion's chains are cast aside:
Truly wise, he's gone beyond such thoughts.[1]
That monk still might use such words as "I,"
Still perchance might say: "They call this mine."
Well aware of common worldly speech,
He would speak conforming to such use.[2]

http://www.accesstoinsight.org/tipitaka ... .wlsh.html" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
:sage:

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daverupa
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Re: Looking for a particular Sutta

Post by daverupa » Fri Jan 25, 2013 5:09 pm

Delightful addition! Also, perchance short enough to be the one in question...
  • "And how is it, bhikkhus, that by protecting oneself one protects others? By the pursuit, development, and cultivation of the four establishments of mindfulness. It is in such a way that by protecting oneself one protects others.

    "And how is it, bhikkhus, that by protecting others one protects oneself? By patience, harmlessness, goodwill, and sympathy. It is in such a way that by protecting others one protects oneself.

- Sedaka Sutta [SN 47.19]

Bakmoon
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Re: Looking for a particular Sutta

Post by Bakmoon » Mon Jan 28, 2013 2:10 pm

ground wrote:
[Deva:]
He who's an Arahant, his work achieved,
Free from taints, in final body clad,
That monk still might use such words as "I."
Still perchance might say: "They call this mine."
...
Would such a monk be prone to vain conceits?

[The Blessed One:]
Bonds are gone for him without conceits,
All delusion's chains are cast aside:
Truly wise, he's gone beyond such thoughts.[1]
That monk still might use such words as "I,"
Still perchance might say: "They call this mine."
Well aware of common worldly speech,
He would speak conforming to such use.[2]

http://www.accesstoinsight.org/tipitaka ... .wlsh.html" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
:sage:
That's the one. Saadhu!
The non-doing of any evil,
The performance of what's skillful,
The cleansing of one's own mind:
This is the Buddhas' teaching.

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