Buddhists are being killed in Myanmar.

Exploring Theravāda's connections to other paths - what can we learn from other traditions, religions and philosophies?
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Lazy_eye
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Re: Buddhists are being killed in Myanmar.

Post by Lazy_eye » Sun Dec 09, 2012 3:19 pm

tiltbillings wrote:
Dmytro wrote: . . .
You might want to actually make a connected point or two here as to why there is violence in Thailand and Burma directed at Muslims and from Muslims directed at Buddhists. Your msg makes no sense whatsoever. Please clarify.
I'm not sure the dots can really be connected, as there isn't one overarching explanation. The various struggles have different reasons, from what I can see.

The violence in Thailand is in the far south. This is a Muslim majority area, which Thailand annexed in 1902 despite it not being culturally Thai. The people are ethnic Malays, they are poorer and less educated compared to Thai Buddhists and ethnic Chinese, and many resent rule from Bangkok, which has been both heavy-handed and inept.

The anti-Buddhist pogrom in Bangladesh was unusual. There hasn't been much of a problem between the majority Muslims and the Buddhist minority over the years. It has been reported in some places that the attacks were reprisals by Rohingya refugees angry about the situation in Burma. And they may have had some help from some local hardline Islamists who wanted to embarrass the secular government.

Not really the same set of issues at all.

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Dan74
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Re: Buddhists are being killed in Myanmar.

Post by Dan74 » Sun Dec 09, 2012 3:36 pm

nekete wrote:Hi...

I really don't know in which sub/forum write this...

Do you know that buddhists (monks and lays) are being killed these days in places like Bangladesh and Myanmar by muslims? There is a facebook site where somebody is informin ng about all this. I'd like to know how all this madness has started, I have asked there but no answer to my question. You can check it here... https://www.facebook.com/BuddhistDefenceLeague" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

In the south of Thailand monks also are killed by muslims. In this case I think it's because muslims want a islamic state in Thailand. It's been for years that this is happening.

Does somebody knows something about all this? I'd like to know more and understand what's happening in Bangladesh or Myanmar, even in the south of Thailand.

Thank you.
There are many good responses above, I would just like to add that we should be careful to avoid tribalistic thinking, the us versus them mentality and heed the Buddha's advice to cherish all living beings.

From all indications I have seen, in Myanmarit was the Muslims that were really victimized with entire villages destroyed.
_/|\_

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nekete
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Re: Buddhists are being killed in Myanmar.

Post by nekete » Sun Dec 09, 2012 6:56 pm

Bhikkhu Pesala wrote:The madness has been going on for ever, and even in the Buddha's time Buddhists were killing Buddhists before there were any Moslems or Christians.

The best way to avoid getting killed is to avoid getting born again, which is the main purpose of the Buddha's teaching.
Yes, my friend, but I wanted to know how all this has started in Bangladesh and Myanmar. Even in Thailand, but I think there it's because muslims want to have an islamic state.

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nekete
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Re: Buddhists are being killed in Myanmar.

Post by nekete » Sun Dec 09, 2012 6:59 pm

James the Giant wrote:
nekete wrote:There is a facebook site where somebody is informing about all this.
....https://www.facebook.com/BuddhistDefenceLeague" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
Hi Nekete, if you are going to research the topic, just be careful you read information from all sides of the conflict. That Buddhist Defense League page is propaganda, and strongly anti-Muslim. It does not present a balanced picture of the situation. For example, they will never tell you that more Muslims than Buddhists have been killed in the Myanmar violence.
It's a horrible situation. Don't add to it by becoming an anti-Muslim fanatic.
But were that muslims killed by buddhists? I mean monks. I'm not going to be an anti-muslim :) it's just that I want to know what and why it's happening.

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nekete
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Re: Buddhists are being killed in Myanmar.

Post by nekete » Sun Dec 09, 2012 7:00 pm

Yana wrote:people kill each other everyday Buddhist or otherwise.
Yes, I know, but I'm interested in this violence against buddhists in Myanmar, Thailand and Bangladesh.

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nekete
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Re: Buddhists are being killed in Myanmar.

Post by nekete » Sun Dec 09, 2012 7:05 pm

Dmytro wrote:Hi Nekete,

The violence has a long history,

"In 1193, the Nalanda University complex was destroyed by Afghan Khilji-Ghilzai Muslims under Bakhtiyar Khalji; this event is seen as the final milestone in the decline of Buddhism in India."

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Muslim_con ... bcontinent" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

The question is rather why the violence has escalated now?

This is a part of larger tragedy. Bangladesh is prone to floods, and now, with the advent of global climate change, these floods have risen to unprecedented levels.

"In 1998, over 75% of the total area of the country was flooded. It was similar to the catastrophic flood of 1988 in terms of the extent of the flooding. A combination of heavy rainfall within and outside the country and synchronization of peak flows of the major rivers contributed to the river.

The 2004 flood was very similar to the 1988 and 1998 floods with two thirds of the country under water."

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Floods_in_Bangladesh" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

Since the key countries emitting CO2 - USA and China - still don't act on this issue, the floods will get even larger, which will lead to more illegal immigration to Myanmar (which has uncontrolled border sections), and to more ethnic tensions.

:namaste:
Hi, Dmytro.

Are you saying that all this violence in Bangladesh it's because of the floods?

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nekete
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Re: Buddhists are being killed in Myanmar.

Post by nekete » Sun Dec 09, 2012 7:07 pm

pilgrim wrote:Attacks on Buddhists are not always reported . It is not Muslims alone that attack Buddhists. There are inter-religious conflicts between Buddhists and other communities too. And with increasing population pressure and scarcity of water, land and other resources I expect this will continue if not increase. The following sites documents some of the attacks on Buddhists by Muslims and others.
http://jihadonbuddhists.org/" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
http://www.buddhapia.com/eng/tedesco/pic1/list.html" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

Having said that, we should also be aware that Buddhists are not always the victims, as in Rakhine state, Myanmar where Buddhists are as much to blame.
Thanks for the links.I'll read them.

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Dmytro
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Re: Buddhists are being killed in Myanmar.

Post by Dmytro » Mon Dec 10, 2012 8:03 pm

Hi Nekete,
nekete wrote:Are you saying that all this violence in Bangladesh it's because of the floods?
Floods and general climate change are a major factor of malnutrition and extreme poverty in Bangladesh.
40% of coastal land is already affected by salinity.
$10 billion were spent on defence measures over 30 years.

And the situation is getting worse. Yields from rain fed agriculture could be reduced to 50% by 2020.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Climate_ch ... Bangladesh" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

In practice, this means even more illegal immigrants to Myanmar, India, and other countries, and cultural barbarization, including the escalation of violence.

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tiltbillings
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Re: Buddhists are being killed in Myanmar.

Post by tiltbillings » Mon Dec 10, 2012 10:41 pm

Dmytro wrote:Hi Nekete,
nekete wrote:Are you saying that all this violence in Bangladesh it's because of the floods?
Floods and general climate change are a major factor of malnutrition and extreme poverty in Bangladesh.
40% of coastal land is already affected by salinity.
$10 billion were spent on defence measures over 30 years.

And the situation is getting worse. Yields from rain fed agriculture could be reduced to 50% by 2020.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Climate_ch ... Bangladesh" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

In practice, this means even more illegal immigrants to Myanmar, India, and other countries, and cultural barbarization, including the escalation of violence.
Now, you are starting to make an actual argument here. What evidence can you point to that supports that this is what is behind the more recent violence in Burma?
>> Do you see a man wise [enlightened/ariya] in his own eyes? There is more hope for a fool than for him.<< -- Proverbs 26:12

This being is bound to samsara, kamma is his means for going beyond. -- SN I, 38.

“Of course it is happening inside your head, Harry, but why on earth should that mean that it is not real?” HPatDH p.723

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Mr Man
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Re: Buddhists are being killed in Myanmar.

Post by Mr Man » Tue Dec 11, 2012 3:25 pm

Dmytro wrote:
In practice, this means even more illegal immigrants to Myanmar, India, and other countries, and cultural barbarization, including the escalation of violence.
Even more than what? In recent times has there been more population movement from Myanmar to it's neighboring countries or visa versa? The term "cultural barbarization" is hideous.

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Re: Buddhists are being killed in Myanmar.

Post by dude » Tue Dec 11, 2012 5:07 pm

"The term "cultural barbarization" is hideous."

Why? What do you think it means?

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Mr Man
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Re: Buddhists are being killed in Myanmar.

Post by Mr Man » Tue Dec 11, 2012 5:40 pm

dude wrote:"The term "cultural barbarization" is hideous."

Why? What do you think it means?
Well "barbarization" means to degrade or currupt.

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Bhikkhu Pesala
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Re: Buddhists are being killed in Myanmar.

Post by Bhikkhu Pesala » Tue Dec 11, 2012 8:24 pm

Very few things are more barbaric and corrupt than the idea of something called racial purity that is somehow "corrupted" or devalued by racial integration.

In the Buddha's time it was the Brahmin caste who regarded themselves as superior, and the story that I linked to earlier shows the disaster that befell the Sākyan race due to their sense of superiority over other races.

The Buddha taught that it was conduct alone that made a person noble, and that it was nothing to do with race or parentage. All wars and conflicts have their origin in the gross ignorance of human beings who consider themselves superior to others.

The Buddhist Discourse to Sakka — the King of Tāvatimsa — recorded in the Sakkapañha Sutta gives some good insights into the origin of conflicts.

As Buddhists, we should look beyond the differences between human beings that arise from race, skin colour, religion and ethnic origins. We should look for the essentials of all religions, and learn to reconcile those who are involved in conflict.
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cooran
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Re: Buddhists are being killed in Myanmar.

Post by cooran » Tue Dec 11, 2012 8:26 pm

Sadhu, Bhante! :bow:

with metta and respect,
Chris
---The trouble is that you think you have time---
---Worry is the Interest, paid in advance, on a debt you may never owe---
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Re: Buddhists are being killed in Myanmar.

Post by dude » Tue Dec 11, 2012 10:01 pm

Mr Man wrote:
dude wrote:"The term "cultural barbarization" is hideous."

Why? What do you think it means?
Well "barbarization" means to degrade or currupt.
Do you not think mass murder is barbarism and degrades the one who does it?

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