Are dhammas perfect or imperfect?

Exploring Theravāda's connections to other paths - what can we learn from other traditions, religions and philosophies?
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Re: Are dhammas perfect or imperfect?

Post by beeblebrox » Mon Nov 12, 2012 4:31 pm

DAWN wrote: Why stop suffering? Good question, because suffering is perfect too. Perharps stop suffering about suffering

By last words i mean that after parinibbana there is no dhammas, that we experiance dhammas because we suffer.

I dont know if it usefull for others to understand the perfection and harmony of Samsara, but it helps me to see dhammas as they are, and dont judge them, dont suffer about them, see Nibbana in Samsara.
Just observe how rainbow of shines.

In my opinion suffering is not any quality of dhammas, suffering is illusion, a defilement caused by ignorance.
Hi Dawn, after reading your posts in here, I think that maybe we should take care not to try put the Dependent Origination up on the pedestal, for everyone to worship... as the new Atta from which everything seems to revolve.

We also need to take care not to view (not even) Anatta as the new Brahma... from whence it seems to make everything OK.

We also shouldn't try to view the suffering as something that seems perfect and harmonious, just because it is pure Anatta... or as if that's something which sprang up right out of the eternally great, all-mighty Dependent Origination.

We shouldn't view the suffering as something that should be just left alone, in its own total perfection... to allow the human beings to forever burn within the great fires of the First Noble Truth, as if they're our sacrificial animals, for the sake of our own view of the D.O.

I think that we also should take care not to turn Kamma into a version of the Brahma's foot-and-mouth. The brahmins used to try to use the kamma as an explanation for why some people were born untouchable... and also to explain why some people were born as fragrant as the Brahma's breath. (Their ideas of Brahma's foot-and-mouth were only a metaphor for this.) They basically told us that it was our kamma, and that we should learn how to live with it.

The Buddha basically took that right out from the brahmins' hands, and then turned it into a tool of true liberation... to their amazement, not to mention their consternation. That's it. There is nothing perfect nor imperfect about that... it's just pure liberation.

Thanks to him, we can now use this earth-shattering view of the kamma as a tool to lead ourselves right out of whatever the world we happen to find ourselves in, shackled up right in the fetters of the greed, hatred and delusion... that is all.

These ideas of perfection or imperfection, I think, are nothing but worldly things. As far as I can see... perfection is basically a greed for something; imperfection is a hatred for something; and being satisfied with either of those as a true nature of things = a delusion.

I hope that helps you to see.


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Re: Are dhammas perfect or imperfect?

Post by DAWN » Mon Nov 12, 2012 4:54 pm

I dont know why, your reply was made me smiling :D "all-mighty Dependent Origination."

Yes i'am agree with you "These ideas of perfection or imperfection, I think, are nothing but worldly things."

Thanks for your time :anjali:
Sabbe dhamma anatta
We are not concurents...
I'am sorry for my english

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