Thought suppression by Samatha

The cultivation of calm or tranquility and the development of concentration
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DAWN
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Re: Thought suppression by Samatha

Post by DAWN » Sun Sep 23, 2012 10:52 am

Cittasanto wrote: you don't aim for nibbana?
No, and you ?
Sabbe dhamma anatta
We are not concurents...
I'am sorry for my english

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Cittasanto
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Re: Thought suppression by Samatha

Post by Cittasanto » Sun Sep 23, 2012 11:01 am

I aim for the end of suffering, however I suspect I know where you are going to try to twist this.
Blog, Suttas, Aj Chah, Facebook.

He who knows only his own side of the case knows little of that. His reasons may be good, and no one may have been able to refute them.
But if he is equally unable to refute the reasons on the opposite side, if he does not so much as know what they are, he has no ground for preferring either opinion …
...
He must be able to hear them from persons who actually believe them … he must know them in their most plausible and persuasive form.
John Stuart Mill

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DAWN
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Re: Thought suppression by Samatha

Post by DAWN » Sun Sep 23, 2012 11:15 am

Cittasanto wrote:I aim for the end of suffering, however I suspect I know where you are going to try to twist this.
If there is aim, there is suffering.
You are reason in your suspection.
Sabbe dhamma anatta
We are not concurents...
I'am sorry for my english

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Cittasanto
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Re: Thought suppression by Samatha

Post by Cittasanto » Sun Sep 23, 2012 12:24 pm

DAWN wrote:
Cittasanto wrote:I aim for the end of suffering, however I suspect I know where you are going to try to twist this.
If there is aim, there is suffering.
You are reason in your suspection.
yeah without convention words have no meaning.
Blog, Suttas, Aj Chah, Facebook.

He who knows only his own side of the case knows little of that. His reasons may be good, and no one may have been able to refute them.
But if he is equally unable to refute the reasons on the opposite side, if he does not so much as know what they are, he has no ground for preferring either opinion …
...
He must be able to hear them from persons who actually believe them … he must know them in their most plausible and persuasive form.
John Stuart Mill

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DAWN
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Re: Thought suppression by Samatha

Post by DAWN » Sun Sep 23, 2012 12:34 pm

Cittasanto wrote:
DAWN wrote:
Cittasanto wrote:I aim for the end of suffering, however I suspect I know where you are going to try to twist this.
If there is aim, there is suffering.
You are reason in your suspection.
yeah without convention words have no meaning.
I dont understant
Sabbe dhamma anatta
We are not concurents...
I'am sorry for my english

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Cittasanto
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Re: Thought suppression by Samatha

Post by Cittasanto » Sun Sep 23, 2012 2:22 pm

DAWN wrote:I dont understant
Ajahn Chah listened to one of his disciples recite the Heart Sutra. When he had finished, Ajahn Chah said, "No emptiness either… no bodhisatta." He then asked, "Where did the sutra come from?" "It’s reputed to have been spoken by the Buddha," the follower replied. "No Buddha," retorted Ajahn Chah. Then he said, "This is talking about deep wisdom beyond all conventions. How could we teach without them? We have to have names for things, isn’t that so?"
as this is now meta discussion I will leave this unsurprising redundancy here.
Blog, Suttas, Aj Chah, Facebook.

He who knows only his own side of the case knows little of that. His reasons may be good, and no one may have been able to refute them.
But if he is equally unable to refute the reasons on the opposite side, if he does not so much as know what they are, he has no ground for preferring either opinion …
...
He must be able to hear them from persons who actually believe them … he must know them in their most plausible and persuasive form.
John Stuart Mill

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DAWN
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Re: Thought suppression by Samatha

Post by DAWN » Sun Sep 23, 2012 2:39 pm

Cittasanto wrote:
DAWN wrote:I dont understant
Ajahn Chah listened to one of his disciples recite the Heart Sutra. When he had finished, Ajahn Chah said, "No emptiness either… no bodhisatta." He then asked, "Where did the sutra come from?" "It’s reputed to have been spoken by the Buddha," the follower replied. "No Buddha," retorted Ajahn Chah. Then he said, "This is talking about deep wisdom beyond all conventions. How could we teach without them? We have to have names for things, isn’t that so?"
as this is now meta discussion I will leave this unsurprising redundancy here.
Thanks, now i understant. But you can not know if i have or have no meaning of this words, i'am not sure that you have this iddhi, so actualy in this situation, you talk about conventions without knowing, but you talk by conventions (that some one have/no have meaning of some word) without knowing (iddhi).

There is an proverb in old french language :
Tex donne boen consoils autrui, qui ne savroit conselier lui.
Who can give advice to others, if he is not able to give advice to gim self.

I feel some probleme in your reaction. So i would like to say Exuse me if i said something that you are not agree about.

You take a good decision to leave. That i will do too.
Sabbe dhamma anatta
We are not concurents...
I'am sorry for my english

rowyourboat
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Re: Thought suppression by Samatha

Post by rowyourboat » Mon Sep 24, 2012 4:56 pm

@reflection: thanks for that suggestion. I will play around with this a bit.

@daverupa: it could be that I need to balance my faculties as samadhi has become unwieldy. Alternatively development of samadhi with and without vitakka (but not in jhana) is mentioned in some suttas may have something to do with this experience - though I may be jumping the gun if I think of it like that.

@DAWN : yes I have explored the option of ordaining but it is not an option for me :). I need to be able to think as well as have a more fluid type of samadhi. I will have to reserve the heavy stuff for the retreats.

@cittasanto: thank you for your input.

With metta

Matheesha
With Metta

Karuna
Mudita
& Upekkha

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Cittasanto
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Re: Thought suppression by Samatha

Post by Cittasanto » Mon Sep 24, 2012 8:00 pm

Hi Matheesha,
Just remember this is a path of mistakes, sometimes we reach dead ends, other times wrong use of things (I tend to go with the latter).
I like your responce to Daverupa, it is certainly a praise worthy and simle version of what has been suggested. But just to note there that is the second Jhana in the commentaries (if you didn't already know). If you can attain Jhana don't stop, just balance :)
Blog, Suttas, Aj Chah, Facebook.

He who knows only his own side of the case knows little of that. His reasons may be good, and no one may have been able to refute them.
But if he is equally unable to refute the reasons on the opposite side, if he does not so much as know what they are, he has no ground for preferring either opinion …
...
He must be able to hear them from persons who actually believe them … he must know them in their most plausible and persuasive form.
John Stuart Mill

rowyourboat
Posts: 1952
Joined: Sat Jan 03, 2009 5:29 pm
Location: London, UK

Re: Thought suppression by Samatha

Post by rowyourboat » Sun Sep 30, 2012 8:51 pm

Cittasanto wrote:Hi Matheesha,
Just remember this is a path of mistakes, sometimes we reach dead ends, other times wrong use of things (I tend to go with the latter).
I like your responce to Daverupa, it is certainly a praise worthy and simle version of what has been suggested. But just to note there that is the second Jhana in the commentaries (if you didn't already know). If you can attain Jhana don't stop, just balance :)
Thanks Cittasanto. I am staging a gradual return to my samatha. :)
With Metta

Karuna
Mudita
& Upekkha

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Cittasanto
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Re: Thought suppression by Samatha

Post by Cittasanto » Sun Sep 30, 2012 10:32 pm

rowyourboat wrote:
Cittasanto wrote:Hi Matheesha,
Just remember this is a path of mistakes, sometimes we reach dead ends, other times wrong use of things (I tend to go with the latter).
I like your responce to Daverupa, it is certainly a praise worthy and simle version of what has been suggested. But just to note there that is the second Jhana in the commentaries (if you didn't already know). If you can attain Jhana don't stop, just balance :)
Thanks Cittasanto. I am staging a gradual return to my samatha. :)
:twothumbsup:
Blog, Suttas, Aj Chah, Facebook.

He who knows only his own side of the case knows little of that. His reasons may be good, and no one may have been able to refute them.
But if he is equally unable to refute the reasons on the opposite side, if he does not so much as know what they are, he has no ground for preferring either opinion …
...
He must be able to hear them from persons who actually believe them … he must know them in their most plausible and persuasive form.
John Stuart Mill

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