Arahants

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phalanyani
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Arahants

Post by phalanyani » Mon May 04, 2009 2:56 am

Does anybody have information about presently living Arahants? Are there any known?

with loving kindness the curious
phalanyani

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Cittasanto
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Re: Arahants

Post by Cittasanto » Mon May 04, 2009 8:53 am

I don't think they are known but I know some are suspected to be (applies to monks anyway)
personally I think Sitagu Sayadaw is an Arahant whether he is or not I don't know for certain but I suspect.

there are some Non monastic fellows who claim such attainments, but I doubt they are what they say.
Blog, Suttas, Aj Chah, Facebook.

He who knows only his own side of the case knows little of that. His reasons may be good, and no one may have been able to refute them.
But if he is equally unable to refute the reasons on the opposite side, if he does not so much as know what they are, he has no ground for preferring either opinion …
...
He must be able to hear them from persons who actually believe them … he must know them in their most plausible and persuasive form.
John Stuart Mill

rowyourboat
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Re: Arahants

Post by rowyourboat » Mon May 04, 2009 12:30 pm

There are some sri lankan monks like ven premasiri, ven katukurunde nananda who are thought to be arahanths (and their teachers)- they have incredible knowledge of the dhamma with incredible practice. no confirmations of course. other suspected recent past sri lankan arahaths include ven matara nanarama, ven amathagavesi, Ven sumathipala. There are probably many more but these are the more prominant ones in the meditation circles. Nuns include ven Chandra mani, ven kusuma mani, ven khema mani. There potentially countless non-returners, once returners and stream entrants taught by these wonderful monks and nuns. :bow:

The seven stages of purification (ven matara nanarama)

http://www.buddhanet.net/pdf_file/bm7insight.pdf" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

The nibbana sermons (ven katukurunde nanananda):

http://www.beyondthenet.net/calm/clm_main1.asp" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

dhamma talks by ven amathagavesi

http://www.basicbuddhism.org/index.cfm?GPID=80" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
With Metta

Karuna
Mudita
& Upekkha

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kc2dpt
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Re: Arahants

Post by kc2dpt » Mon May 04, 2009 12:53 pm

phalanyani wrote:Does anybody have information about presently living Arahants? Are there any known?

with loving kindness the curious
phalanyani
How would we know?
What if I told you someone was arahant - how would you know if I was telling the truth? How would you know I wasn't deluded?

It's a serious question. What good does it do you for someone to tell you someone else is arahant?
- Peter

Be heedful and you will accomplish your goal.

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forestmat
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Re: Arahants

Post by forestmat » Mon May 04, 2009 2:00 pm

Is it not a breach of Vinaya to declare oneself Arahant (if fully ordained)?

metta

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gavesako
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Re: Arahants

Post by gavesako » Mon May 04, 2009 2:17 pm

It is funny moving between different Buddhist circles and hearing the disciples declare that their teacher is an arahant, while at the same time implying that the others are not (I know this from the Thai forest tradition, where the Ajahns apparently hold that in Burma there are no arahants -- is this just nationalism or...?). Interestingly, even though it is an offence for a monk to declare oneself publicly (to laypeople) an arahant, there is an exception in the Vinaya where the Buddha says that if laypeople out of excessive devotion invite the monks saying, "May the venerables, may the arahants come to my house," it is okay to accept such an invitation. This shows that often people will use a word like "arahant" simply to express their devotion, without having any means of knowing where that person is actually at.
Bhikkhu Gavesako
Kiṃkusalagavesī anuttaraṃ santivarapadaṃ pariyesamāno... (MN 26)

Access to Insight - Theravada texts
Ancient Buddhist Texts - Translations and history of Pali texts
Dhammatalks.org - Sutta translations

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kc2dpt
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Re: Arahants

Post by kc2dpt » Mon May 04, 2009 5:52 pm

When I hear of people guessing that this or that teacher is arahant... I wonder if a puthujjana could tell the difference between an arahant and an anagami... or an anagami and a sakadagami... or a sakadagami and a sotapanna... or a sotapanna and one merely living restrained in speech and behavior, living frugally, living in accordance with the Vinaya. In this crazy world, if someone is simply nice on a regular basis we might feel prone to elevating them to saintly status.
- Peter

Be heedful and you will accomplish your goal.

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phalanyani
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Re: Arahants

Post by phalanyani » Fri May 08, 2009 6:43 am

it is , indeed, a seriouse question. And i'm aware of the tendency of people to call their own teacher an arahant and declare others as not arahants. The reason why I'm asking is: if there really would be one, i'd shall go to find out if it's true and if it is so, learn.
But, of course, the internet is not a good place for investigations.

happy Vesakh
phalanyani

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Cittasanto
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Re: Arahants

Post by Cittasanto » Fri May 08, 2009 10:17 am

forestmat wrote:Is it not a breach of Vinaya to declare oneself Arahant (if fully ordained)?

metta

forestmat
There are rules prohibiting such declarations to laypeople but not other monastics but I do think there is a rule allowing the declaration to non-monastics also for particular reasons, but I am not 100% on that (been told a rule later to find out it didn't exist) maybe one of the monks can clarify more, but certainly the first part is correct!
Blog, Suttas, Aj Chah, Facebook.

He who knows only his own side of the case knows little of that. His reasons may be good, and no one may have been able to refute them.
But if he is equally unable to refute the reasons on the opposite side, if he does not so much as know what they are, he has no ground for preferring either opinion …
...
He must be able to hear them from persons who actually believe them … he must know them in their most plausible and persuasive form.
John Stuart Mill

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appicchato
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Re: Arahants

Post by appicchato » Fri May 08, 2009 12:35 pm

Peter wrote:...if someone is simply nice on a regular basis we might feel prone to elevating them to saintly status.
And deservedly so...

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kc2dpt
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Re: Arahants

Post by kc2dpt » Fri May 08, 2009 12:37 pm

phalanyani wrote:The reason why I'm asking is: if there really would be one, i'd shall go to find out if it's true
How would you find out if it's true?
- Peter

Be heedful and you will accomplish your goal.

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Cittasanto
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Re: Arahants

Post by Cittasanto » Fri May 08, 2009 12:41 pm

Peter wrote:
phalanyani wrote:The reason why I'm asking is: if there really would be one, i'd shall go to find out if it's true
How would you find out if it's true?
well Ajahn Chah was punched to the head and knocked over by the force, he said he should send all his monks to london to practice metta after that.

I don't think that is advisable, but it does show allot
Blog, Suttas, Aj Chah, Facebook.

He who knows only his own side of the case knows little of that. His reasons may be good, and no one may have been able to refute them.
But if he is equally unable to refute the reasons on the opposite side, if he does not so much as know what they are, he has no ground for preferring either opinion …
...
He must be able to hear them from persons who actually believe them … he must know them in their most plausible and persuasive form.
John Stuart Mill

rowyourboat
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Re: Arahants

Post by rowyourboat » Fri May 08, 2009 6:00 pm

it's reasonable to doubt whether someoen is an arahanth or not... but at the same time all this doubt is also very erosive. It makes it sound like this is hardly possible. There are people out there 'with little dust in their eyes..' hey it might not be you, but at least lets stay open to the possibility!


:anjali:
With Metta

Karuna
Mudita
& Upekkha

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phalanyani
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Re: Arahants

Post by phalanyani » Mon May 18, 2009 6:56 am

Peter wrote:
phalanyani wrote:The reason why I'm asking is: if there really would be one, i'd shall go to find out if it's true
How would you find out if it's true?
Have you ever seen a french person doing this gesture :shrug: ? When they do it it does not only say: I don't know, it also means: I don't care, not my concern.

hope to know when the moment comes.
have a good day
phalanyani

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SeerObserver
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Re: Arahants

Post by SeerObserver » Tue May 19, 2009 5:33 pm

Manapa wrote:
Peter wrote:
phalanyani wrote:The reason why I'm asking is: if there really would be one, i'd shall go to find out if it's true
How would you find out if it's true?
well Ajahn Chah was punched to the head and knocked over by the force, he said he should send all his monks to london to practice metta after that.

I don't think that is advisable, but it does show allot
I'm not familiar with this incident. Did this literally happen?

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