Capital punishment

Exploring Theravāda's connections to other paths - what can we learn from other traditions, religions and philosophies?
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Ngawang Drolma.
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Re: Capital punishment

Post by Ngawang Drolma. »

Peter wrote:
Drolma wrote:I don't think the Buddha suggested that we accrue negative karma by taking life, even if we think our intentions are wholesome. We may think it's wholesome, but we're inherently deluded.
I also thought you typo'd here.
It read to me like you were denying the Buddha taught killing creates negative karma. :jawdrop:
But now I see what you are saying.
The Buddha taught us to refrain from taking life, even if we think our intentions are wholesome. We may thing it's wholesome, but that sort of thinking is inherently deluded.
LOL, that would be a pretty weird thing to say. If I ever do start spouting non-sense, hopefully friends here will stop me :lol:

My sentence was unclear, here's a revision:
I don't think the Buddha recommended that we should accrue negative karma by taking life, even if we think our intentions are wholesome. We may think it's wholesome, but we're inherently deluded.
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phil
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Location: Tokyo

Re: Capital punishment

Post by phil »

TheDhamma wrote:
phil wrote: I was astonished to read recently that 80% of Japanese are in favour of capital punishment and only 6% are opposed. I have so many Japanese friends and they are so gentle and moderate in their behaviour that it just doesn't fit.
Hi Phil,

From unscientific polls (such as those on Buddhist forums) it appears that most Buddhists are opposed to the death penalty. I suspect the First Precept and the fact that a former murderer, Angulimala, became an Arahant are the primary reasons many Buddhists who have studied the Suttas are opposed to the death penalty.

Yet, as you have seen, many Buddhist countries have and support the death penalty. I imagine this may change to increased opposition as Buddhists move more toward a study based approach instead of a ritualistic form of practice. Or maybe they have legitimate reasons for supporting the death penalty in some instances. It would be interesting to hear from Buddhists who support the death penalty. Most of the 'unscientific' polls show about 90% of Buddhists opposed to the death penalty, but these are on online forums where most are familiar with the Suttas.


Hi David

I would like to broach this subject with people and find out if despite the general lack of interest in Buddhism in Japan there isn't a kind of belief in karma at work, that people think murderrs are simply getting what they have earned. This would be a simplified understanding of karma of course. I would like to present people with the story of Angulimala, and the story that Chris offers in the post that followed yours.

My wife works for Amnesty International, and has had a very small amount of success in getting people to think by making them reflect on whether they would be able to push the button themselves. If they can't, how can they morally demand that others do?

I find it very puzzling really. I actually avoid the subject because it is always a little shocking to find that people who are otherwise so gentle and peaceful could support such a barbarous practice. Again, the lack of a life sentence without parole is a big part of the problem.

Metta,

Phil
Kammalakkhano , bhikkhave, bālo, kammalakkhano pandito, apadānasobhanī paññāti
(The fool is characterized by his/her actions/the wise one is characterized by his/her actions/Wisdom shines forth in behaviour.)
(AN 3.2 Lakkhana Sutta)
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Mexicali
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Re: Capital punishment

Post by Mexicali »

I simply don't see any justification for capital punishment. I used to hold the view that it was impermissible because the justice system is so corrupt and stacked against poor and brown people. Now I believe that even if we have undeniable proof of guilt, and there are no mitigating factors, capital punishment is still indefensible. Part of this has been the Buddhist understanding that we are not fundamentally any one thing, and thus an "evil" man can still change. But part has just been that there is no compelling reason to take a life in anything other than direct defense of self or others, and giving the state that right seems positively corrupt to me. Even the worst case, unrepentant child murderer (not that this description fits most death row inmates anyway) needs to be allowed to live out their life and be given the opportunity to reflect and change.

Incidentally, in China, the only heavily Buddhist country I've been to, people are enthusiastically pro-Death Penalty, even though in China you can get the death penalty for quite a few things short of murder. I don't really get it.
"We do not embrace reason at the expense of emotion. We embrace it at the expense of self-deception."
-- Herbert Muschamp
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Ceisiwr
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Re: Capital punishment

Post by Ceisiwr »

Capital Punishment is just revenge in IMO

Metta
“Knowing that this body is just like foam,
understanding it has the nature of a mirage,
cutting off Māra’s flower-tipped arrows,
one should go beyond the King of Death’s sight.”
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pink_trike
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Re: Capital punishment

Post by pink_trike »

The death penalty is a quite natural and easy idea to accept when people are pathologically alienated from the natural world, and when the world population is 6.5 billion and expected to increase to 9.5 billion in the next 45 years or so, and when life is reduced to a factory mentality. Life naturally becomes objectified and cheap under these conditions...just another disposable object among the hundreds of thousands of disposable objects that we're buried under. The death penalty is an integral, natural part of the psychotic logic of modern life. What's really crazy is being shocked by it. What did we expect?
Vision is Mind
Mind is Empty
Emptiness is Clear Light
Clear Light is Union
Union is Great Bliss

- Dawa Gyaltsen

---

Disclaimer: I'm a non-religious practitioner of Theravada, Mahayana/Vajrayana, and Tibetan Bon Dzogchen mind-training.
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robertk
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Re: Capital punishment

Post by robertk »

I think there less than a dozen executions a year in japan, but around 200,000 legal abortions.
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Mexicali
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Re: Capital punishment

Post by Mexicali »

Sure, but abortion is something that occurs whether or not it's legal. State-sponsored executions are another matter.
"We do not embrace reason at the expense of emotion. We embrace it at the expense of self-deception."
-- Herbert Muschamp
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