OpenDhamma Hot Topic Posts being Reviewed

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Khalil Bodhi
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Re: OpenDhamma Hot Topic Posts being Reviewed

Post by Khalil Bodhi » Mon Mar 05, 2012 7:50 pm

Thanks but no thanks Fede. In case we all forget:
The Akkosa Sutta ~ the Insult

Once the Blessed One was staying at Rajagaha in the Bamboo Grove near the Squirrels' Feeding Place. Now the brahman Akkosa Bharadvaja heard this: "The brahman Bharadvaja, it seems, has become a monk under the Great Monk Gotama." Angry and unhappy, he went to where the Blessed One was. Having approached the Blessed One, he abused and criticized the Blessed One in foul and harsh words. Thus reviled, the Blessed One spoke to the brahman Akkosa Bharadvaja: 'Well, brahman, do friends, confidants, relatives, kinsmen and guests visit you?"

"Yes, Gotama, sometimes friends, confidants, relatives, kinsmen and guests do visit me."

"Well, brahman, do you not offer them snacks or food or tidbits?"

"Yes, Gotama, sometimes I do offer them snacks or food or tidbits."

"But if, brahman, they do not accept it, who gets it?"

"If Gotama, they do not accept it, I get it back."

"Even so, brahman, you are abusing us who do not abuse, you are angry with us who do not get angry, you are quarreling with us who do not quarrel. All this of yours we don't accept. You alone, brahman, get it back; all this, brahman, belongs to you.

"When, brahman, one abuses back when abused, repays anger in kind, and quarrels back when quarreled with, this is called, brahman, associating with each other and exchanging mutually. This association and mutual exchange we do not engage in. Therefore you alone, brahman, get it back; all this, brahman, belongs to you."

"People, including the king, know the Venerable Gotama thus: 'The Monk Gotama is the Worthy One.' When does the Venerable Gotama become angry?"

Said the Buddha:

"Where is anger for one freed from anger,
Who is subdued and lives perfectly equanimous,
Who truly knowing is wholly freed,
Supremely tranquil and equipoised?
He who repays an angry man in kind
Is worse than the angry man;
Who does not repay anger in kind,
He alone wins the battle hard to win.
He promotes the weal of both,
His own, as well as of the other.
Knowing that the other man is angry,
He mindfully maintains his peace
And endures the anger of both,
His own, as well as of the other,
Even if the people ignorant of true wisdom
Consider him a fool thereby."
When the Lord proclaimed this, the brahman Akkosa Bharadvaja said this to the Blessed One: "Wonderful, indeed, O Venerable Gotama! Herewith I go to the Venerable Gotama for refuge, to his Teaching and to his Holy Order of Monks. Most venerable sir, may I have the privilege to receive at the hands of the revered Lord Gotama the initial monastic ordination and also the higher ordination of a bhikkhu."

And the brahman Akkosa Bharadvaja received at the hands of the Blessed One the initial monastic ordination and he also received the higher ordination of a bhikkhu. And within a short time of his ordination, the Venerable Akkosa Bharadvaja, living alone, secluded, diligent, zealous and unrelenting, reached that incomparable consummation of holiness for which sons of noble families, having totally abandoned the household life, take to the life of homelessness. With direct knowledge he realized the ultimate, then and there, and lived having access to it. He saw with his supernormal vision: "Ceased is rebirth, lived is the holy life, completed is the spiritual task and henceforth there is nothing higher to be achieved."

The Venerable Akkosa Bharadvaja, indeed, became one of the Arahats.
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Re: OpenDhamma Hot Topic Posts being Reviewed

Post by Sanghamitta » Mon Mar 05, 2012 7:51 pm

Fede wrote:Taking the unilateral decision to lock a thread without consulting or advising the OP that it is being considered is authoritarian and bad mannered.
I wish to voice my strongest objection. this is curtailing free speech.
you are moderators, not censors.

the fact that this has caused such heated debate is indicative of several things:
One, women are definitely poorly represented here, and the invitation to increase the number of female members, which was suggested by a male member to a female one, is frankly, patronising and in poor taste.

Two, the matter is obviously of sufficient importance to arouse an awful lot of feeling and comment amongst even buddhists - allegedly followers the most peace-loving and undivided religion currently manifesting on the planet. how quickly this is forgotten.

Three, Buddhism and all it teaches has obviously taught men nothing.
Men still question whether the Buddha was really sexist, and what they should do about addiction to porn.
both of which indicate a very samsaric and insulting attitude to women.
:goodpost:
What with this and Vepacittas posts that must cover the views of about 50% of the female membership. Do you want to repeat your assertion that the problem is me David ?
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Re: OpenDhamma Hot Topic Posts being Reviewed

Post by DNS » Mon Mar 05, 2012 8:00 pm

Well, up until that post by Fede is was only you on the attack of Dhamma Wheel and its moderator team. But now okay, it is you and Fede.

Look at Yana's posts. She was just expressing some personal experience issues regarding men and that is how Fede started too in the other thread. Now you and Fede have turned the direction toward the mod staff.

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Re: OpenDhamma Hot Topic Posts being Reviewed

Post by Modus.Ponens » Mon Mar 05, 2012 8:06 pm

This is somewhat ridiculous. I think I've seen every topic that was ever locked in this forum since the begining to see if there was censorship or other bad moderation actions. Until now, none of those topics have been wrongly closed (although sometimes it's a bit preventive of potential verbal fights). The topics that were just closed were closed by the same reason as every other topic was closed: verbal violence. I cannot see any dictatorship here.
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Re: OpenDhamma Hot Topic Posts being Reviewed

Post by SDC » Mon Mar 05, 2012 8:42 pm

Have we all forgotten the reality of what we are involved in here in this life? That whatever we think we are - male/female, black/white, gay/straight, smart/stupid, old/young, good/bad, etc - doesn't mean an effing thing? I think we are all showing how serious we are taking our "selves".

I don't think the topic should be locked. If we all want to prove to each other how much we are dependent on the idea of ourselves then so be it. It will be a great learning experience for all on exactly what we are doing wrong.

Who knows? I may be taking my self quite seriously be writing this post. :tongue:

[/end self righteous rant]

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Re: OpenDhamma Hot Topic Posts being Reviewed

Post by Khalil Bodhi » Mon Mar 05, 2012 8:49 pm

Well, this topic is still open...rant on.
To avoid all evil, to cultivate good, and to cleanse one's mind — this is the teaching of the Buddhas.
-Dhp. 183

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Re: OpenDhamma Hot Topic Posts being Reviewed

Post by Reductor » Mon Mar 05, 2012 8:53 pm

Yana wrote:i'm sorry..my name is Yana..i'm new to this forum so i don't know what's going on..i didn't even know you can lock a post..i thought that lock symbol meant it's secure or something..i know it's stupid but bear with me..

I don't know where else to post this but i just wanted to say right now my original post was not meant to stir up or instigate any form of gender bashing...or division..it was to seek help in getting rid of the wrong views that i have personally struggled with.Personally,if it's even relevant anymore,at this point..this struggle was to let go of the residual feeling of fear and anxiety towards men accumulated through years of holding onto these wrong views.This is the main reason i posted my original question/post.

you see..I needed help to "Stop" hating men.Not "Reasons Why I Hate Men".

and i'm really sorry it's turned out the way it has.

PS.Please dont tell me to stop apologizing,this is not possible.I feel like **** right now. and don't tell me i'm giving the male members a free pass.this is not true! :(
Hi yana.

You made your post in good faith, so what more could have been done by you? Certainly you are not responsible for the rest of us.

Just continue practicing and posting.

Take care.

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Re: OpenDhamma Hot Topic Posts being Reviewed

Post by Vepacitta » Mon Mar 05, 2012 9:13 pm

Yana, please don't apologise, you have done nothing wrong.

It's just that when I mentioned that your aversion towards men wasn't totally 'out there' that a crap storm arose. And was not about to back down. Nor were the other gals here.

Many (not all but most of 'em) guys don't like it when a woman is strong willed, or smarter or right - at least on a certain point. I've seen even the nicest guys get pretty damnably nasty.

I'm seeing it here - I find David's behaviour toward Fede particularly respulsive - and what makes it so utterly vile is that it is crafted in a way as to make him seem 'reasonable' and her seem 'hysterical and angry' Read some Solzhenitzyn or Kafka or Orwell for other instances like this.

As to - I can't remember who- Bodom - Khalil Bodhi ?? whoever's answer which was - well why don't you just leave? The ultimate "F-YOU" answer. Let's not address anything, let's not wonder whether there may be a point to this - let's just recommend that they leave - which you put in a way that seems 'reasonable'

V.
Last edited by Vepacitta on Mon Mar 05, 2012 9:20 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: OpenDhamma Hot Topic Posts being Reviewed

Post by Khalil Bodhi » Mon Mar 05, 2012 9:17 pm

Vepacitta,

That wasn't Bodom, that was me and I certainly didn't intend to say that anyone should leave. I am simply trying to understand the motives behind such nastiness. And, as I said earlier, if I found a place and its people so contemptible I wouldn't stay. But then, I'm not really a fighter. I wish you all the best but ask that we keep it clean and respectable. Mettaya.
To avoid all evil, to cultivate good, and to cleanse one's mind — this is the teaching of the Buddhas.
-Dhp. 183

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Re: OpenDhamma Hot Topic Posts being Reviewed

Post by Vepacitta » Mon Mar 05, 2012 9:24 pm

Sorry Bodom.

I am a fighter and I don't like being told to 'keep it clean', implying that I am using dirty tactics or words.

We women are sick of this - sick to DEATH of this - and that's why we seem so 'nasty'. We are not nasty - we are just telling it like it is - and I guess you can't take it, hear it or comprehend it.

Pretty sad, actually,

V.

NB: But no worries, after tonight, I won't be around for a long while, so you can all breathe a sigh of relief and live in your own illusions about how great and 'tolerant' you are.
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Re: OpenDhamma Hot Topic Posts being Reviewed

Post by Reductor » Mon Mar 05, 2012 9:39 pm

Hey vepacitta.

In your first post on yana's topic you compared the good men among us to dogs. And such good men are few, in your estimation. What you must think of the rest of us!

If such talk doesn't smake of bigotry, then I don't know what talk would.

So be a fighter if you like. But in this case your words, and position, seem pretty deplorable.

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Re: OpenDhamma Hot Topic Posts being Reviewed

Post by Kenshou » Mon Mar 05, 2012 9:40 pm

It feels like anything short of an admission that men are vile demons who are the sole cause of all that is bad, is intolerance or ignorance. Any counterexamples are called misogyny, or just "not getting it".

There's just no room for productive conversation when things have been brought to such extremes.

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Re: OpenDhamma Hot Topic Posts being Reviewed

Post by Khalil Bodhi » Mon Mar 05, 2012 9:44 pm

Thank you everyone for your participation in this thread but it, too, has reached the point of no return. I apologize for any hurt feelings or other harm I may have contributed in this and other threads and encourage any one who feels the need to PM me. Sukhita hontu. :heart:
To avoid all evil, to cultivate good, and to cleanse one's mind — this is the teaching of the Buddhas.
-Dhp. 183

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