Race, IQ and Idenity politics: A debate.

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No_Mind
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Re: Race, IQ and Idenity politics: A debate.

Post by No_Mind » Thu Apr 12, 2018 3:40 pm

lyndon taylor wrote:
Thu Apr 12, 2018 2:15 pm
Total nonsense, IQ tests are culture dependent and favour the race and class of the people that made the IQ test, being a good farmer requires high IQ, but that doesn't mean someone raised in a farming community in the third world is going to score high on a test designed and administered by city dwelling white folk.
Actually Lyndon ... IQ tests depend on signs and not numbers .. you could substitute $ with a banana and & with an apple if you wish .. I am not that artistic .. no reason why a farmer or historian should not be able to solve this type of problem

$ + $ = 18

$ × & + & = 100

# + $ + $ + & = & + & + & + &

what is value of #

Anybody? .. Something really simple here ..

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Last edited by No_Mind on Thu Apr 12, 2018 3:59 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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chownah
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Re: Race, IQ and Idenity politics: A debate.

Post by chownah » Thu Apr 12, 2018 3:57 pm

No_Mind wrote:
Thu Apr 12, 2018 3:40 pm
lyndon taylor wrote:
Thu Apr 12, 2018 2:15 pm
Total nonsense, IQ tests are culture dependent and favour the race and class of the people that made the IQ test, being a good farmer requires high IQ, but that doesn't mean someone raised in a farming community in the third world is going to score high on a test designed and administered by city dwelling white folk.
Actually Lyndon ... IQ tests depend on signs and not numbers .. you could substitute $ with a banana and & with an apple if you wish .. I am not that artistic .. no reason why a farmer or historian should not be able to solve this type of problem

$ + $ = 18

$ * & + & = 100 (note * means multiplication)

# + $ + $ + & = & + & + & + &

what is value of #

Anybody? .. Something really simple here ..

:namaste:
12 This is a question base on mathematical notion and exposure/familiarity/understanding of mathematical notation is a cultural variable so you have in fact shown that this sort of test is culturally dependent....you have proven lyndon taylor's point.
chownah

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Re: Race, IQ and Idenity politics: A debate.

Post by Mr Man » Thu Apr 12, 2018 3:57 pm

22 edit or 12 maybe 😄

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Re: Race, IQ and Idenity politics: A debate.

Post by No_Mind » Thu Apr 12, 2018 4:06 pm

chownah wrote:
Thu Apr 12, 2018 3:57 pm
12 This is a question base on mathematical notion and exposure/familiarity/understanding of mathematical notation is a cultural variable so you have in fact shown that this sort of test is culturally dependent....you have proven lyndon taylor's point.
chownah
If drawn it will look sort of like this .. yes little bit of math but if you see this one is more logic and observation power than math at end

Image

No contest for this one. It is from internet so answer is easily accessible.

And most other IQ questions have nothing to do with math .. no reason why a ballet dancer or bus driver would not be able to solve it .. has nothing to do with city folk (this part @ Lyndon)

Finger : Hand

which one is most suitable comparison

A) Chair : Table

B) Truck : Car

C ) Eye : Ear

D ) Blade : Razor


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Last edited by No_Mind on Thu Apr 12, 2018 4:26 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Race, IQ and Idenity politics: A debate.

Post by santa100 » Thu Apr 12, 2018 4:18 pm

Circle5 wrote:There have been many studies trying to find out how much % of IQ is dependent on genetics and how much is dependent on environment. Best of such studies are those done on twins. This is a difficult thing to measure, but some good studies regarding this have indeed been made.

... Things such as "tiger mom" or "going to a good school" or etc. do not have any impact on IQ.
Well, then let's wait til we can see any concrete scientific evidence that cleanly segregate out nature vs nurture before jumping to your conclusion above.

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Re: Race, IQ and Idenity politics: A debate.

Post by Circle5 » Thu Apr 12, 2018 6:13 pm

Indeed, G (general inteligence) tests have nothing to do with math. Take for example the only good IQ test avaliable on the internet: www.IQtest.dk
Nothing at all involving math. A person from any country will have equal chance at the test.

What is strange here is how some people could think that all human races or populations on earth have equal IQ. It's such a stupid idea. Has anyone ever thought that all dogs have equal average IQ ? That german shepards are not smarter than the rest ? Has anyone though that all great apes have equal average IQ ? All birds equal average IQ ? What would be the probability of that ? How on earth could one even imagine such a thing ? And if that wasn't enough, how could a population that has not even invented the wheel have the same average IQ as others ???

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Re: Race, IQ and Idenity politics: A debate.

Post by santa100 » Thu Apr 12, 2018 6:48 pm

What is even stranger here is how some people could think that certain human race or population have higher IQ than the rest while it's so apparent that the bricks used to build our 21st century human civilization house were shaped and molded by the hands of people of all races.

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Re: Race, IQ and Idenity politics: A debate.

Post by DNS » Thu Apr 12, 2018 7:55 pm

Circle5 wrote:
Thu Apr 12, 2018 6:13 pm
Indeed, G (general inteligence) tests have nothing to do with math. Take for example the only good IQ test avaliable on the internet: www.IQtest.dk
Nothing at all involving math. A person from any country will have equal chance at the test.

What is strange here is how some people could think that all human races or populations on earth have equal IQ. It's such a stupid idea. Has anyone ever thought that all dogs have equal average IQ ? That german shepards are not smarter than the rest ? Has anyone though that all great apes have equal average IQ ? All birds equal average IQ ? What would be the probability of that ? How on earth could one even imagine such a thing ? And if that wasn't enough, how could a population that has not even invented the wheel have the same average IQ as others ???
Yes, of course there are differences, even wide differences among individuals, but when you start talking about large groups, the differences between groups go way lower. Obviously someone like Magnus Carlsen or Kasparov have very high IQ, but that doesn't make every other Norwegian or Russian have high IQ like them. There are big differences among individuals, but they start to go away when you start comparing large groupings of people.

The fact that some groups allegedly score lower than others certainly has some to do with the testing. A person who is raised on a subsistence farm, learns everything about subsistence farming and nothing else, never goes to school, never learns basic math, not even arithmetic will always score lower than someone who has finished at least high school in a developed nation. Many tests do include basic math and arithmetic type functions.

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Re: Race, IQ and Idenity politics: A debate.

Post by Circle5 » Thu Apr 12, 2018 11:30 pm

DNS wrote:
Thu Apr 12, 2018 7:55 pm
The fact that some groups allegedly score lower than others certainly has some to do with the testing. A person who is raised on a subsistence farm, learns everything about subsistence farming and nothing else, never goes to school, never learns basic math, not even arithmetic will always score lower than someone who has finished at least high school in a developed nation. Many tests do include basic math and arithmetic type functions.
But as others have pointed out, white kids already outperform black kids by the age of 9 to 12 months. These differences are present ever since that age up. You test them at 2 year old, 3 years, 4 years, the difference is still there. So one can not blame this on school or anything of that sort.

The fact that some groups have not invented the wheel or some have never built any cities (except great zimbabwe that is basically a wall as big as a supermarket) is real life evidence of this difference. Let's stop and think about the invention of the wheel. How did it happen ? Some wiseguy probably saw a round little rock spinning down a hill or something. Then he made the connection. He started making something similar out of wood. Then he made the second connection about how this could be used for transportation. The wheel was discovered in many places by independent groups that could not communicate with one another.

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Re: Race, IQ and Idenity politics: A debate.

Post by No_Mind » Fri Apr 13, 2018 12:26 am

Circle5 wrote:
Thu Apr 12, 2018 11:30 pm
But as others have pointed out, white kids already outperform black kids by the age of 9 to 12 months. These differences are present ever since that age up. You test them at 2 year old, 3 years, 4 years, the difference is still there. So one can not blame this on school or anything of that sort.
Are you saying some races are inherently superior? Some races are born intelligent? Wasn't there a big war about it back in 1939?

So after 75 years we are back to blond hair and blue eyes theory?

Fake news - how can you measure IQ at 9-12 months. Show the source or stop spreading racist, fake news.

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Last edited by No_Mind on Fri Apr 13, 2018 12:32 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Race, IQ and Idenity politics: A debate.

Post by retrofuturist » Fri Apr 13, 2018 12:31 am

Greetings,
No_Mind wrote:
Fri Apr 13, 2018 12:26 am
Are you saying some races are inherently superior? Some races are born intelligent? Wasn't there a big war about it back in 1939?
Lest there be any over-reaction, it's worth keeping in mind that what has been discussed in this topic are "distribution curves".

If one race were "inherently" superior in terms of intelligence, then the least intelligent person from the so-called superior race, would logically need to be more intelligent than the most intelligent person from the so-called inferior race.

I see no one making such claims.

Metta,
Paul. :)
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Re: Race, IQ and Idenity politics: A debate.

Post by No_Mind » Fri Apr 13, 2018 12:35 am

retrofuturist wrote:
Fri Apr 13, 2018 12:31 am
Greetings,
No_Mind wrote:
Fri Apr 13, 2018 12:26 am
Are you saying some races are inherently superior? Some races are born intelligent? Wasn't there a big war about it back in 1939?
Lest there be any over-reaction, it's worth keeping in mind that what has been discussed in this topic are "distribution curves".

If one race were "inherently" superior in terms of intelligence, then the least intelligent person from the so-called superior race, would logically need to be more intelligent than the most intelligent person from the so-called inferior race.

I see no one making such claims.

Metta,
Paul. :)
Circle5 wrote:
Thu Apr 12, 2018 11:30 pm
white kids already outperform black kids by the age of 9 to 12 months.
is an out and out racist comment

is this Stormfront or DW?

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Re: Race, IQ and Idenity politics: A debate.

Post by Circle5 » Fri Apr 13, 2018 12:52 am

No_Mind wrote:
Fri Apr 13, 2018 12:35 am
is an out and out racist comment

is this Stormfront or DW?

:namaste:
Studies also show that transracial adoptees from asian to white family have on average higher IQ than whites. The same applies for whites adopted by black family.

A race being superior to another ? It depends on what exactly are you measuring. A race can be superior in inteligenge to another race, something that can be measured with average IQs. A race can be superior if physical strenth than another race, a thing that can be measured through muscle-mass, height, etc. But a race being superior to another in general, that is not a claim I have ever made. Is a german shepard dog superior to a romanian mioritic sheperd ? No, they are just different, even though in some aspects one might be superior than the other on average.

"Superior" is also a politically charged word and an unnatural one to use. In everyday conversations, how often do you hear people say "a german shepard is superior to a mioritic sheppard ?" or "americans are superior in economic development than romanians or indians " ?
Last edited by Circle5 on Fri Apr 13, 2018 12:57 am, edited 1 time in total.

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Re: Race, IQ and Idenity politics: A debate.

Post by No_Mind » Fri Apr 13, 2018 12:54 am

Circle5 wrote:
Fri Apr 13, 2018 12:52 am
No_Mind wrote:
Fri Apr 13, 2018 12:35 am
is an out and out racist comment

is this Stormfront or DW?

:namaste:
Studies also show that transracial adoptees from asian to white family have on average higher IQ than whites. The same applies for whites adopted by black family.

A race being superior to another ? It depends on what exactly are you measuring. A race can be superior in inteligenge to another race, something that can be measured with average IQs. A race can be superior if physical strenth than another race, a thing that can be measured through muscle-mass, height, etc. But a race being superior to another in general, that is not a claim I have ever made. Is a german shepard dog superior to a romanian mioritic sheperd ? No, they are just different, even though in some aspects one might be superior than the other on average.
Show sources

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Re: Race, IQ and Idenity politics: A debate.

Post by No_Mind » Fri Apr 13, 2018 1:02 am

Circle5 wrote:
Thu Apr 12, 2018 11:30 pm
But as others have pointed out, white kids already outperform black kids by the age of 9 to 12 months. These differences are present ever since that age up. You test them at 2 year old, 3 years, 4 years, the difference is still there. So one can not blame this on school or anything of that sort.
There’s still no good reason to believe black-white IQ differences are due to genes

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