Americans will never give up their guns.

A place to bring a contemplative / Dharmic perspective and opinions to current events and politics.
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DooDoot
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Re: Americans will never give up their guns.

Post by DooDoot » Thu Feb 22, 2018 3:08 am

For me, the reasoning in this video is unsound & not particularly convincing. The amount of people using mental health (which is from where the statistics derive) is probably dependent upon the availability & affordability of mental health services. Just as the official US statistics say the unemployment rate is 4.1% when it is, in reality, much higher, I imagine the mental health statistics are similar. This said, the speaker made a relevant point about Trump reducing mental health funding.

Virgo
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Re: Americans will never give up their guns.

Post by Virgo » Thu Feb 22, 2018 3:32 am

DooDoot wrote:
Thu Feb 22, 2018 3:08 am
For me, the reasoning in this video is unsound & not particularly convincing. The amount of people using mental health (which is from where the statistics derive) is probably dependent upon the availability & affordability of mental health services. Just as the official US statistics say the unemployment rate is 4.1% when it is, in reality, much higher, I imagine the mental health statistics are similar. This said, the speaker made a relevant point about Trump reducing mental health funding.
You know the specific statistics, but I do not, so I will not comment.

Kevin

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manas
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Re: Americans will never give up their guns.

Post by manas » Thu Feb 22, 2018 7:03 pm

Would this infringe upon the Second Amendment?

1. Firearms can only be owned by persons 18 years and older.
2. Applicant must pass a police and mental health check first.

What would be wrong with that? I can't see what the big deal is. In my country, that's only the beginning...there are more hoops to jump through, including being an active member of a shooters' club, and having a safe / vault embedded in the floor or other solid structure (the expense of which makes it difficult for low-income earners to own a firearm at all).
Knowing this body is like a clay jar,
securing this mind like a fort,
attack Mara with the spear of discernment,
then guard what's won without settling there,
without laying claim.

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retrofuturist
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Re: Americans will never give up their guns.

Post by retrofuturist » Fri Feb 23, 2018 12:15 am

Greetings,

Image

Metta,
Paul. :)
"Do not force others, including children, by any means whatsoever, to adopt your views, whether by authority, threat, money, propaganda, or even education." - Ven. Thich Nhat Hanh

"The uprooting of identity is seen by the noble ones as pleasurable; but this contradicts what the whole world sees." (Snp 3.12)

"One discerns wrong view as wrong view, and right view as right view. This is one's right view." (MN 117)

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No_Mind
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Re: Americans will never give up their guns.

Post by No_Mind » Fri Feb 23, 2018 12:40 am

As a teacher I find lot of trouble with the concept of arming teachers. It is our task to teach, not shoot. And how will a teacher look with a Sig Sauer in a pistol belt.

What if a student dies in crossfire from the teacher's gun? He/she will be shattered. But US schools should have an armed guard given the recent spate of shootings.

:namaste:
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lyndon taylor
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Re: Americans will never give up their guns.

Post by lyndon taylor » Fri Feb 23, 2018 2:17 am

The Parkland school had an armed guard on duty and he didn't do shxt!!
18 years ago I made one of the most important decisions of my life and entered a local Cambodian Buddhist Temple as a temple boy and, for only 3 weeks, an actual Therevada Buddhist monk. I am not a scholar, great meditator, or authority on Buddhism, but Buddhism is something I love from the Bottom of my heart. It has taught me sobriety, morality, peace, and very importantly that my suffering is optional, and doesn't have to run my life. I hope to give back what little I can to the Buddhist community, sincerely former monk John

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DNS
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Re: Americans will never give up their guns.

Post by DNS » Fri Feb 23, 2018 3:18 am

lyndon taylor wrote:
Fri Feb 23, 2018 2:17 am
The Parkland school had an armed guard on duty and he didn't do shxt!!
That and the fact that police were called 39 times to his house for various domestic issues and mental health issues. He should never have been allowed to have any gun, not just an AR-15. There is lots of blame to throw around (gun laws, gun availability, poor background checks, age of 18 allowed for rifle purchases in Florida, police not stopping him from purchasing firearms, FBI not stopping him), but most notably the Sheriff's dept and local police who knew he was trouble.
No_Mind wrote:
Fri Feb 23, 2018 12:40 am
As a teacher I find lot of trouble with the concept of arming teachers. It is our task to teach, not shoot. And how will a teacher look with a Sig Sauer in a pistol belt.
Ideally yes, a teacher's task is to teach, not shoot. But what about the task of protecting the students? The students' task is to learn and study, not to be killed by a madman or to fear being shot or killed by a madman.
What if a student dies in crossfire from the teacher's gun? He/she will be shattered. But US schools should have an armed guard given the recent spate of shootings.
I don't think any of the proposals for teachers to be armed call for forcing them to be armed. I believe the proposals are for some teachers to do so on a voluntary basis and only after they pass background checks on themselves, pass gun safety courses, etc.

From a utilitarian perspective, a few armed teachers stopping an active shooter before he kills any students or before he kills too many, results in fewer deaths. It takes a long time for police to arrive on a scene and by that time, numerous fatalities would have already occurred.

I know, from a Buddhist perspective all killing is bad; but we're not talking about arahants here, just ordinary worldlings trying to save the most number of lives. And theoretically at least, a teacher could aim for incapacitating the shooter, not killing (shooting in the leg or at least lower torso) and then the intention would be non-lethal.

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retrofuturist
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Re: Americans will never give up their guns.

Post by retrofuturist » Fri Feb 23, 2018 3:22 am

:goodpost:

:thumbsup:

Metta,
Paul. :)
"Do not force others, including children, by any means whatsoever, to adopt your views, whether by authority, threat, money, propaganda, or even education." - Ven. Thich Nhat Hanh

"The uprooting of identity is seen by the noble ones as pleasurable; but this contradicts what the whole world sees." (Snp 3.12)

"One discerns wrong view as wrong view, and right view as right view. This is one's right view." (MN 117)

Justsit
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Re: Americans will never give up their guns.

Post by Justsit » Fri Feb 23, 2018 1:48 pm

So wait...the answer to having too many guns is to have more guns?

The logic escapes me.

How many guns will be enough? We already have 330 million here.
:guns: :guns: :guns: :guns: :guns: :guns: :guns: :guns: :guns: :guns: :guns: :guns: :guns: :guns: :guns: :guns: :guns: :guns: :guns: :guns: :guns: :guns: :guns: :guns: :guns: :guns: :guns: :guns: :guns: :guns: :guns: :guns: :guns: :guns: :guns: :guns: :guns: :guns: :guns: :guns: :guns: :guns: :guns: :guns: :guns: :guns: :guns: :guns: :guns: :guns: :guns: :guns: :guns: :guns: :guns: :guns: :guns: :guns: :guns: :guns: :guns: :guns: :guns: :guns:

denise
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Re: Americans will never give up their guns.

Post by denise » Fri Feb 23, 2018 3:09 pm


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Mr Man
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Re: Americans will never give up their guns.

Post by Mr Man » Fri Feb 23, 2018 3:40 pm

retrofuturist wrote:
Fri Feb 23, 2018 12:15 am
Greetings,

Image

Metta,
Paul. :)

What does the cartoon even mean?

Justsit
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Re: Americans will never give up their guns.

Post by Justsit » Fri Feb 23, 2018 3:48 pm

Mr Man wrote:
Fri Feb 23, 2018 3:40 pm
What does the cartoon even mean?
I think it's supposed to mean the kid will go shoot up the school with no armed guards; therefore, kids are safer in schools with guards.

Why not just take the gun out of the kid's hands?

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Mr Man
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Re: Americans will never give up their guns.

Post by Mr Man » Fri Feb 23, 2018 5:40 pm

Hi Justit
Justsit wrote:
Fri Feb 23, 2018 3:48 pm
Mr Man wrote:
Fri Feb 23, 2018 3:40 pm
What does the cartoon even mean?
I think it's supposed to mean the kid will go shoot up the school with no armed guards; therefore, kids are safer in schools with guards.
But don't the perpetrators of these mass shootings normally have an association with the school that they attack? The message is dishonest.
Justsit wrote:
Fri Feb 23, 2018 3:48 pm

Why not just take the gun out of the kid's hands?
Exactly.

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Pseudobabble
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Re: Americans will never give up their guns.

Post by Pseudobabble » Fri Feb 23, 2018 5:41 pm

Justsit wrote:
Fri Feb 23, 2018 3:48 pm
Mr Man wrote:
Fri Feb 23, 2018 3:40 pm
What does the cartoon even mean?
Why not just take the gun out of the kid's hands?
Follow this logic until only one entity has the guns: the State. What makes the State more trustworthy than any individual? Nothing.
"Does Master Gotama have any position at all?"

"A 'position,' Vaccha, is something that a Tathagata has done away with. What a Tathagata sees is this: 'Such is form, such its origination, such its disappearance; such is feeling, such its origination, such its disappearance; such is perception...such are fabrications...such is consciousness, such its origination, such its disappearance.'" - Aggi-Vacchagotta Sutta


'Dust thou art, and unto dust thou shalt return.' - Genesis 3:19

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