Trump. And why I hate him.

A place to bring a contemplative / Dharmic perspective and opinions to current events and politics.
alan
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Re: Trump. And why I hate him.

Post by alan » Sun Dec 31, 2017 3:30 am

"Patriots vs Globalists"?
Hey Retro, I think this could be a new thread. Maybe you can start it, and explain what you mean.

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Mkoll
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Re: Trump. And why I hate him.

Post by Mkoll » Sun Dec 31, 2017 2:55 pm

alan wrote:
Sat Dec 16, 2017 12:40 am
1) He refuses to recognize facts.
2) He is living in his own, separate reality, in which only he is great--all others are wrong.
3)He is debasing, through his very presence, but also his "tweets", the Presidency.
4) He is a God Dam Crazy Man, a complete narcissist, and also a pathological liar.
All of that is absolutely true.

But none of that is grounds for hating him. Even if a group of bandits were to saw you limb from limb with a 2-handed saw, blood gushing, sinews tearing, pain ripping, there would still be no grounds for hating them. There are no grounds for hating anyone whomseover, whatsoever in the Buddha's teachings. Instead, a mind of goodwill should be cultivated toward all beings, regardless of their characteristics. It's difficult to cultivate goodwill against the grain of ingrained ill-will, but one can bear with that difficulty and eventually overcome it.
Namo tassa bhagavato arahato samma sambuddhassa
Namo tassa bhagavato arahato samma sambuddhassa
Namo tassa bhagavato arahato samma sambuddhassa

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Sea Turtle
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Re: Trump. And why I hate him.

Post by Sea Turtle » Sun Dec 31, 2017 11:18 pm

Mkoll wrote:
Sun Dec 31, 2017 2:55 pm
alan wrote:
Sat Dec 16, 2017 12:40 am
1) He refuses to recognize facts.
2) He is living in his own, separate reality, in which only he is great--all others are wrong.
3)He is debasing, through his very presence, but also his "tweets", the Presidency.
4) He is a God Dam Crazy Man, a complete narcissist, and also a pathological liar.
All of that is absolutely true.

But none of that is grounds for hating him. Even if a group of bandits were to saw you limb from limb with a 2-handed saw, blood gushing, sinews tearing, pain ripping, there would still be no grounds for hating them. There are no grounds for hating anyone whomseover, whatsoever in the Buddha's teachings. Instead, a mind of goodwill should be cultivated toward all beings, regardless of their characteristics. It's difficult to cultivate goodwill against the grain of ingrained ill-will, but one can bear with that difficulty and eventually overcome it.
Such a sensible post. Very helpful reminder. I will keep focused on this.

:anjali:

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manas
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Re: Trump. And why I hate him.

Post by manas » Tue Jan 02, 2018 11:27 pm

Trump has many faults, but how about this for cold callousness? Would you have wanted someone who joked and laughed about a brutal murder, to be President?

Knowing this body is like a clay jar,
securing this mind like a fort,
attack Mara with the spear of discernment,
then guard what's won without settling there,
without laying claim.

- Dhp 40

chownah
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Re: Trump. And why I hate him.

Post by chownah » Wed Jan 03, 2018 2:44 am

manas wrote:
Tue Jan 02, 2018 11:27 pm
Trump has many faults, but how about this for cold callousness? Would you have wanted someone who joked and laughed about a brutal murder, to be President?

yyyhttps://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FmIRYvJQeHM
Just an explanation for everyone. This post is an example of a propogandistic technique which is being used alot these days by trump supporters (and others as well). It is called the "whatabout". It works like this. When someone is explaining what they think is wrong about trump or his policies the trump supporter will say "well what about thus and so....". This moves the conversation away from trumps faults and onto some elses faults. It is a way to dodge the issue by changing the discussion to another issue.
chownah

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Mr Man
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Re: Trump. And why I hate him.

Post by Mr Man » Wed Jan 03, 2018 8:16 am

DooDoot wrote:
Wed Jan 03, 2018 3:05 am
This thread is about Trump & not Putin. In short, while Trump still illegally has US troops uninvited in Syria, he stopped funding & supporting ISIS & allowed the Syrian to take back most of Syria.
Hi DooDoot

Was the US govt. funding ISIS at the time Trump became president and then Trump stopped that funding?

Did Trump allow "Syrian to take back most of Syria"?

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DooDoot
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Re: Trump. And why I hate him.

Post by DooDoot » Wed Jan 03, 2018 11:11 am

Mr Man wrote:
Wed Jan 03, 2018 8:16 am
Was the US govt. funding ISIS at the time Trump became president and then Trump stopped that funding?
I don't know the exact details but it appears the pin was obviously pulled on ISIS, who were supplied, armed & funded by the US-Alliance-Group (including Turkey, Saudi Arabia & Qatar).
Mr Man wrote:
Wed Jan 03, 2018 8:16 am
Did Trump allow "Syrian to take back most of Syria"?
Indirectly, it seems so. ISIS can't fight without weapons, money & logistical support.
Trump Ends Covert Aid to Syrian Rebels Trying to Topple Assad

President Trump has ended the clandestine American program to provide arms and supplies to Syrian rebel groups, American officials said, a recognition that the effort was failing and that the administration has given up hope of helping to topple the government of President Bashar al-Assad.

The decision came more than a month ago, the officials said, by which time the effort to deliver the arms had slowed to a trickle.

It was never publicly announced, just as the beginnings of the program four years ago were officially a secret, authorized by President Barack Obama through a “finding” that permitted the C.I.A. to conduct a deniable program. News of the troublesome program soon leaked out.

https://www.nytimes.com/2017/07/19/worl ... ebels.html
Trump 'ends programme to arm anti-Assad rebels' in move sought by Russia

'I think Putin will be thrilled' said one analyst

Donald Trump has reportedly decided to end the US’s funding and training of so-called moderate Syrian rebels opposed to Bashar al-Assad - something that has long been requested by Moscow.

The plan to train and equip rebels opposed to Mr Assad was started in 2013 under the administration of Barack Obama, as an effort to try and put pressure on the Syrian leader to step aside. While most of the heavy weapons and cash were provided by Saudi Arabia, the CIA took the lead in the training.

Now, it has been reported that Mr Trump has decided to cancel the programme, something that will likely be welcomed by Russia, which has for years supported the Assad regime.

http://www.independent.co.uk/news/world ... 49971.html

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manas
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Re: Trump. And why I hate him.

Post by manas » Wed Jan 03, 2018 11:41 am

chownah wrote:
Wed Jan 03, 2018 2:44 am
manas wrote:
Tue Jan 02, 2018 11:27 pm
Trump has many faults, but how about this for cold callousness? Would you have wanted someone who joked and laughed about a brutal murder, to be President?

yyyhttps://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FmIRYvJQeHM
Just an explanation for everyone. This post is an example of a propogandistic technique which is being used alot these days by trump supporters (and others as well). It is called the "whatabout". It works like this. When someone is explaining what they think is wrong about trump or his policies the trump supporter will say "well what about thus and so....". This moves the conversation away from trumps faults and onto some elses faults. It is a way to dodge the issue by changing the discussion to another issue.
chownah
chownah, I AM NO FAN OF TRUMP. I agree, he is a clear and present danger to not just America, but to the world. HOWEVER, he did prevent us from having to endure that cold woman as president, which is one of the few good things to come from him getting elected.
Knowing this body is like a clay jar,
securing this mind like a fort,
attack Mara with the spear of discernment,
then guard what's won without settling there,
without laying claim.

- Dhp 40

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DooDoot
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Re: Trump. And why I hate him.

Post by DooDoot » Wed Jan 03, 2018 11:46 am

manas wrote:
Wed Jan 03, 2018 11:41 am
I AM NO FAN OF TRUMP. I agree, he is a clear and present danger to not just America, but to the world.
This sounds like hysteria of Bhikkhu Bodhi. For me, America is a danger to America. The whole political system is out of control.


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Kim OHara
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Re: Trump. And why I hate him.

Post by Kim OHara » Wed Jan 03, 2018 11:53 am

While the Dems' candidate was admittedly not much of a Dem,, at least she wouldn't have done this ...
bigger.jpg
bigger.jpg (49.79 KiB) Viewed 575 times
:rolleye:

:toilet:

:jedi:
Kim

chownah
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Re: Trump. And why I hate him.

Post by chownah » Wed Jan 03, 2018 12:26 pm

manas wrote:
Wed Jan 03, 2018 11:41 am
chownah wrote:
Wed Jan 03, 2018 2:44 am
manas wrote:
Tue Jan 02, 2018 11:27 pm
Trump has many faults, but how about this for cold callousness? Would you have wanted someone who joked and laughed about a brutal murder, to be President?

yyyhttps://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FmIRYvJQeHM
Just an explanation for everyone. This post is an example of a propogandistic technique which is being used alot these days by trump supporters (and others as well). It is called the "whatabout". It works like this. When someone is explaining what they think is wrong about trump or his policies the trump supporter will say "well what about thus and so....". This moves the conversation away from trumps faults and onto some elses faults. It is a way to dodge the issue by changing the discussion to another issue.
chownah
chownah, I AM NO FAN OF TRUMP. I agree, he is a clear and present danger to not just America, but to the world. HOWEVER, he did prevent us from having to endure that cold woman as president, which is one of the few good things to come from him getting elected.
I'm glad that hillary is not president too but no matter how bad you think hillary is it does not make trump even a little bit better. You may want to talk about the better of two evils but that doesn't make either of the evils better......and "whataboutism" is a technique that trump supporters especially use alot (others use it too but not to the extremes that trump supporters do). Here is a link for anyone wanting to read up about "whataboutism". https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Whataboutism

Also, I might add that the video you brought is completely based on another propogandistic technique which is taking things out of context. The video is entirely made up of soundbites with no context for any of them. I was actually happy to see it though because I have been trying to find what the context was for the "we came, we saw, he died" comment that hillary made....and your video was the only one so far that I have seen that had even a hint of the context.....if you listen very carefully at the very beginning I think you will hear the other woman there say "so I mean that is the land of unconfirmed reports"......so it seems that all of those people who are telling you that this was hillary's reaction to khadafi's death seem to be completely wrong....it seems that they were chatting about the dynamic of unconfirmed reports. How often has it been said that this was hillary's response to khadafi's death?.....and how many times has it been pointed out that it really seems that it is not?
IF ANYONE HAS A LONGER CLIP OF THIS VIDEO PLEASE BRING IT AS I WOULD REALLY LIKE TO GET A BETTER UNDERSTANDING OF THE CONTEXT.

And....there is a video on the net which is presented as being hillary in a meeting when the news of an unconfirmed report (which I guess turned out to be true) of khadafi's death and she showed not callousness that I could see. Here is the video:

Doesn't seem to be what the people calling her evil make it out to be.
chownah

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Mr Man
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Re: Trump. And why I hate him.

Post by Mr Man » Wed Jan 03, 2018 12:53 pm

DooDoot wrote:
Wed Jan 03, 2018 11:11 am
Mr Man wrote:
Wed Jan 03, 2018 8:16 am
Was the US govt. funding ISIS at the time Trump became president and then Trump stopped that funding?
I don't know the exact details but it appears the pin was obviously pulled on ISIS, who were supplied, armed & funded by the US-Alliance-Group (including Turkey, Saudi Arabia & Qatar).
So there is nothing to support the idea that the US govt. was funding ISIS when Trump became president and that Trump stopped that funding?


DooDoot wrote:
Wed Jan 03, 2018 11:11 am
Mr Man wrote:
Wed Jan 03, 2018 8:16 am
Did Trump allow "Syrian to take back most of Syria"?
Indirectly, it seems so. ISIS can't fight without weapons, money & logistical support.
The articles you have linked to do not refer to US funding for ISIS.

Circle5
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Re: Trump. And why I hate him.

Post by Circle5 » Wed Jan 03, 2018 5:17 pm

Mr Man wrote:
Wed Jan 03, 2018 12:53 pm
DooDoot wrote:
Wed Jan 03, 2018 11:11 am
Mr Man wrote:
Wed Jan 03, 2018 8:16 am
Was the US govt. funding ISIS at the time Trump became president and then Trump stopped that funding?
I don't know the exact details but it appears the pin was obviously pulled on ISIS, who were supplied, armed & funded by the US-Alliance-Group (including Turkey, Saudi Arabia & Qatar).
So there is nothing to support the idea that the US govt. was funding ISIS when Trump became president and that Trump stopped that funding?
USA never supported ISIS. On the contrary, they went to great leanths to destroy it despite that thing indirectly helping Assad. 99% of people on the syriancivilwar reddit are keeping sides with Assad, and so do I, but you will see nobody claiming the things DootDot is doing, unless they are indoctrinated into Russia propaganda.

USA did back al-Aqaida on the idea that "the enemy of my enemy is my friend". But that stopped a couple of months before Trump won. First USA attacks against the rebels happened under Obama.

Besides that, Dootdoot does not have the slightest problem with supplying weapons to terrorist, he only has a problem with USA. If he would honestly have a problem with supplying weapons to islamic terrorist, he would also have a problem with Tranznistria and other area controlled by Russia that are the biggest weapons smuglers in the world, supplying all kind of terrorist across africa and the middle east.

But then again, why did I bother to respond to this criticism of USA ? It's not like Dootdot will ever answer a single question about Russia or god forbid, about Putin, without his response starting with "what about.... " :mrgreen: :mrgreen: :mrgreen:

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DooDoot
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Re: Trump. And why I hate him.

Post by DooDoot » Wed Jan 03, 2018 7:28 pm

Mr Man wrote:
Wed Jan 03, 2018 12:53 pm
So there is nothing to support the idea that the US govt. was funding ISIS when Trump became president and that Trump stopped that funding?
Nothing in what I posted from mainstream news articles: :shrug:
Trump Ends Covert Aid to Syrian Rebels Trying to Topple Assad

President Trump has ended the clandestine American program to provide arms and supplies to Syrian rebel groups, American officials said, a recognition that the effort was failing and that the administration has given up hope of helping to topple the government of President Bashar al-Assad.

The decision came more than a month ago, the officials said, by which time the effort to deliver the arms had slowed to a trickle.

It was never publicly announced, just as the beginnings of the program four years ago were officially a secret, authorized by President Barack Obama through a “finding” that permitted the C.I.A. to conduct a deniable program. News of the troublesome program soon leaked out.

https://www.nytimes.com/2017/07/19/worl ... ebels.html
Trump 'ends programme to arm anti-Assad rebels' in move sought by Russia

'I think Putin will be thrilled' said one analyst

Donald Trump has reportedly decided to end the US’s funding and training of so-called moderate Syrian rebels opposed to Bashar al-Assad - something that has long been requested by Moscow.

The plan to train and equip rebels opposed to Mr Assad was started in 2013 under the administration of Barack Obama, as an effort to try and put pressure on the Syrian leader to step aside. While most of the heavy weapons and cash were provided by Saudi Arabia, the CIA took the lead in the training.

Now, it has been reported that Mr Trump has decided to cancel the programme, something that will likely be welcomed by Russia, which has for years supported the Assad regime.

http://www.independent.co.uk/news/world ... 49971.html

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manas
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Re: Trump. And why I hate him.

Post by manas » Wed Jan 03, 2018 8:45 pm

Kim OHara wrote:
Wed Jan 03, 2018 11:53 am
While the Dems' candidate was admittedly not much of a Dem,, at least she wouldn't have done this ...
"My nuclear button is bigger than yours..." lol Trump is a boy in man's clothing - and a foolish one at that. Americans, how is the road to impeachment going? You need to get this buffoon out of office asap.

Before I leave this topic, which I feel is divisive for us all here, I will state for the record, I feel equally sickened by both Hillary Clinton, and Donald Trump. I find it sad that, out of hundreds of millions of citizens, these two were, in the end, presented to Americans as their options for President. Like in my own country, this isn't true democracy. I'm not sure what to call it.
adios, and with metta :anjali:
Last edited by manas on Wed Jan 03, 2018 9:06 pm, edited 3 times in total.
Knowing this body is like a clay jar,
securing this mind like a fort,
attack Mara with the spear of discernment,
then guard what's won without settling there,
without laying claim.

- Dhp 40

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