The Truth About The Rohingya Lie

A place to bring a contemplative / Dharmic perspective and opinions to current events and politics.
User avatar
retrofuturist
Site Admin
Posts: 20130
Joined: Tue Dec 30, 2008 9:52 pm
Location: Melbourne, Australia
Contact:

Re: The Truth About The Rohingya Lie

Post by retrofuturist » Mon Dec 04, 2017 1:05 am

Greetings Kim,
Kim OHara wrote:
Mon Dec 04, 2017 12:55 am
And, as I said in a different earlier post, extraordinary claims require extraordinary proofs. The opinions of one unreliable commentator do not have the weight to counter mainstream narratives unless they demonstrate superior knowledge and can quote supporting evidence. I'm waiting ... but with no expectation that it will be forthcoming, because I don't think it exists.
Then that's the conclusion that people will come to for themselves, through their own intelligence and investigation. Let's respect the intellectual autonomy of others to come that (or some other) conclusion by themselves.

Metta,
Paul. :)
"Do not force others, including children, by any means whatsoever, to adopt your views, whether by authority, threat, money, propaganda, or even education." - Ven. Thich Nhat Hanh

"The uprooting of identity is seen by the noble ones as pleasurable; but this contradicts what the whole world sees." (Snp 3.12)

"One discerns wrong view as wrong view, and right view as right view. This is one's right view." (MN 117)

User avatar
Kusala
Posts: 754
Joined: Sun Jan 23, 2011 11:02 am

Re: The Truth About The Rohingya Lie

Post by Kusala » Mon Dec 04, 2017 1:21 am

Kim OHara wrote:
Sat Dec 02, 2017 3:56 am
Here's a thorough backgrounder from Al Jazeera - http://www.aljazeera.com/indepth/featur ... 42812.html - and it doesn't look much different from what's in the (responsible!) Western media.

:coffee:
Kim
Kim, please watch this short clip...a perfect example of "subliminal brain washing" by Al Jazeera.



Now watch the same video by AFP...



Context is everything...
Image

"He, the Blessed One, is indeed the Noble Lord, the Perfectly Enlightened One;
He is impeccable in conduct and understanding, the Serene One, the Knower of the Worlds;
He trains perfectly those who wish to be trained; he is Teacher of gods and men; he is Awake and Holy. "

--------------------------------------------
"The Dhamma is well-expounded by the Blessed One,
Apparent here and now, timeless, encouraging investigation,
Leading to liberation, to be experienced individually by the wise. "

pulga
Posts: 1320
Joined: Sun Nov 14, 2010 3:02 pm

Re: The Truth About The Rohingya Lie

Post by pulga » Mon Dec 04, 2017 1:49 am

There does seem to be a growing presence of Wahhabism in the region. ARSA is actually headquartered in Mecca.

The Rohingya Menace : A Conspiracy by Saudi and Pakistan ?

This doesn't mean that all Rohingyas are the cause of the crisis, but it does show that resolving it may be far more difficult than simply imposing sanctions on the Burmese government. These insurgencies when funded from abroad are difficult to quell.

chownah
Posts: 7550
Joined: Wed Aug 12, 2009 2:19 pm

Re: The Truth About The Rohingya Lie

Post by chownah » Mon Dec 04, 2017 2:16 am

pulga wrote:
Mon Dec 04, 2017 1:49 am
There does seem to be a growing presence of Wahhabism in the region. ARSA is actually headquartered in Mecca.
I'm not surprised.
The control of the rahkine region (where most of the rohingya live) has been unsettled for a very very long time.....one can say that it has never been settled. If you look at the existing roads leading to this area and look at the demographics of the area you will easily see that near the coast and on the west there is a concentration of rohingya (in this region they are the large majority) AND you will see that there are roads which make easy and quick connections to population centers in bangladesh (muslim).....and the connnection to myanmar is a single road with a circuitous route of much greater distance to connect to population centers in myanmar. Historically the burma gov't (now myanmar) has not been able to control this region and was not willing to dedicate the resources needed to control, regulate, and develop this region on a continuing basis. The region was and is mostly populated by muslims who if need be would just slip across the border into india (later pakistan and now bangladesh) to avoid the burmese crackdown. This was very easy for them to do because the route to india was well developed because this was how all of their commerce was carried out and their physical as well as spiritual culture came through this corridor.....importantly it did not come from burma.

From a historical, political, and cultural level this region more gracefully fits into bangladesh and not myanmar. There has been alot of back and forth on who exactly has controled the region but it has never been culturally burmese.

So, now that I have given a background let's look at recent events....like the last ten years or so. No one heard much about the rohingya for a very very long time.....and then in the news (at least the news here in thailand) was that people were kicking rohingya out of their villages.....some burning of houses....some deaths....NO MENTION OF ANY ROHINGYA RESISTANCE WHATEVER. Then as time went on there was news of monks being involved at the level of rhhetorically justifying the displacement of those rohningya....even to the point of encouraging it. Then as time went on there were reports of monks going with mobs of people who were displacing those rohingya people and burning thier homes....sort of like giving it the buddha's blessing. ALL THIS TIME THERE WAS NOT ONE WORD OF MENTION OF ANY ROHINGYA RESISTANCE EXCEPT for reports that there was some resistance (knives and clubs) made by locals in self defense as by this it was an ongoing thing. MANY PEOPLE WONDERED HOW LONG THIS MASSACRE WOULD CONTINUE BEFORE A JIHAD WAS STARTED AND BACKED BY JIHADISTS WORLD WIDE.

Well, now we know how long the people of myanmar could slaughter the rohingya people before a jihad was started by jihadists world wide.
chownah

chownah
Posts: 7550
Joined: Wed Aug 12, 2009 2:19 pm

Re: The Truth About The Rohingya Lie

Post by chownah » Mon Dec 04, 2017 2:30 am

Kusala,
please read this history to see why and how these children - and their parents, grandparents, and whole community- are indeed victims.
Kim OHara wrote:
Sat Dec 02, 2017 3:56 am
Here's a thorough backgrounder from Al Jazeera - http://www.aljazeera.com/indepth/featur ... 42812.html - and it doesn't look much different from what's in the (responsible!) Western media.

:coffee:
Kim
One is what one eats. Similarly, one is what one reads. and if one only reads hate-filled rubbish ...

chownah

P.S. There, retrofuturist. This is exactly the meaning of kim ohara's post...as almost anyone who is not blinded by their own idealogical identity can see. It is not an attack on an individual. It is a statement about the human condition.
chownah

P.P.S. Doesn't everyone think that it really is much better stylistically to leave it as it has traditionally been presented, namely "you are what you eat."?
chownah

User avatar
retrofuturist
Site Admin
Posts: 20130
Joined: Tue Dec 30, 2008 9:52 pm
Location: Melbourne, Australia
Contact:

Re: The Truth About The Rohingya Lie

Post by retrofuturist » Mon Dec 04, 2017 2:36 am

Greetings chownah,
chownah wrote:
Mon Dec 04, 2017 2:30 am
One is what one eats. Similarly, one is what one reads. and if one only reads hate-filled rubbish ...

...

P.S. There, retrofuturist. This is exactly the meaning of kim ohara's post...as almost anyone who is not blinded by their own idealogical identity can see. It is not an attack on an individual. It is a statement about the human condition.
chownah
Partaking in meta-discussion to imply that others are hate-filled garbage is not a classy move mate, so get off your high horse and get...

:focus:

Metta,
Paul. :)
"Do not force others, including children, by any means whatsoever, to adopt your views, whether by authority, threat, money, propaganda, or even education." - Ven. Thich Nhat Hanh

"The uprooting of identity is seen by the noble ones as pleasurable; but this contradicts what the whole world sees." (Snp 3.12)

"One discerns wrong view as wrong view, and right view as right view. This is one's right view." (MN 117)

chownah
Posts: 7550
Joined: Wed Aug 12, 2009 2:19 pm

Re: The Truth About The Rohingya Lie

Post by chownah » Mon Dec 04, 2017 3:07 am

Re: The Truth About The Rohingya Lie

If one only reads lies then ones ideas about the "truth" will be a lie.
chownah

User avatar
Kim OHara
Posts: 4999
Joined: Wed Dec 09, 2009 5:47 am
Location: North Queensland, Australia

Re: The Truth About The Rohingya Lie

Post by Kim OHara » Mon Dec 04, 2017 3:11 am

Kusala wrote:
Mon Dec 04, 2017 1:21 am
Kim OHara wrote:
Sat Dec 02, 2017 3:56 am
Here's a thorough backgrounder from Al Jazeera - http://www.aljazeera.com/indepth/featur ... 42812.html - and it doesn't look much different from what's in the (responsible!) Western media.

:coffee:
Kim
Kim, please watch this short clip...a perfect example of "subliminal brain washing" by Al Jazeera.

I watched it. I didn't believe the appallingly biased and heavy-handed commentary.
Now watch the same video by AFP...

I can't - it's blocked here.
Context is everything...
Indeed. Please read the history I linked to, so that you have a context which goes back more than a few months.
You need to understand that the beginnings of this conflict go a long way back and by defining a particular 'starting point' you can say - with apparent justification but no regard for the truth - that "the muslims started it" OR that "the Buddhists started it" - as you showed quite neatly.
Looking back over years and decades makes the truth much plainer. The Rohingya have been marginalised, abused and maltreated by the Buddhist majority of the country they were born in, and any particular event must be seen in that context. Their situation has parallels with that of the African slaves of the USA (and look how that played out!) or 'blackbirded' sugar plantation workers here in Northern Australia (who came out of it a bit better, although it took a while).

:namaste:
Kim

chownah
Posts: 7550
Joined: Wed Aug 12, 2009 2:19 pm

Re: The Truth About The Rohingya Lie

Post by chownah » Mon Dec 04, 2017 3:46 am

Kim ohara,
Thanks for that link. Only one thing I would like to clear up. The article claims that Suu Kyi is the defacto head of the gov't when in fact the military is the defacto head of the gov't....if what is meant by defacto head means who actually holds the power and who determines the possibilites of what can happen going forward.
chownah

User avatar
Kim OHara
Posts: 4999
Joined: Wed Dec 09, 2009 5:47 am
Location: North Queensland, Australia

Re: The Truth About The Rohingya Lie

Post by Kim OHara » Mon Dec 04, 2017 4:02 am

chownah wrote:
Mon Dec 04, 2017 3:46 am
Kim ohara,
Thanks for that link. Only one thing I would like to clear up. The article claims that Suu Kyi is the defacto head of the gov't when in fact the military is the defacto head of the gov't....if what is meant by defacto head means who actually holds the power and who determines the possibilites of what can happen going forward.
chownah
You're right, of course, and it seems to be the main reason the Rohingya are being treated so badly these days - no-one in government is stopping the excesses of local military commanders.

:namaste:
Kim

User avatar
pilgrim
Posts: 1544
Joined: Mon Oct 19, 2009 2:56 pm

Re: The Truth About The Rohingya Lie

Post by pilgrim » Mon Dec 04, 2017 6:03 am

Our views about any issue is inevitably the result of what we read and our sources of information. The Western paints a narrative that the Rohingya are helpless and innocent victims of violence. The Asian press, in various languages catering to the billions of Indians, Chinese and Asians however give the issue a different perspective. Neither India nor China, both of which have restive Muslim minorities have criticised Myanmar. Few of these articles are translated into English, but this article from a small Japanese outfit may give English readers an idea of the general narrative.

http://moderntokyotimes.com/?p=8028

User avatar
Kusala
Posts: 754
Joined: Sun Jan 23, 2011 11:02 am

Re: The Truth About The Rohingya Lie

Post by Kusala » Mon Dec 04, 2017 8:37 am

Kim OHara wrote:
Sat Dec 02, 2017 3:56 am
Here's a thorough backgrounder from Al Jazeera - http://www.aljazeera.com/indepth/featur ... 42812.html - and it doesn't look much different from what's in the (responsible!) Western media.

:coffee:
Kim
Al Jazeera?

"Al Jazeera has been criticized for being state media owned by Qatar.[1][16][17][18][19][20] In 2010, United States Department of State internal communications, released by WikiLeaks as part of the 2010 diplomatic cables leak, claim that the Qatar government manipulates Al Jazeera coverage to suit political interests.[21][22][23][24][25][26]"


https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Al_Jazeer ... _criticism
Image

"He, the Blessed One, is indeed the Noble Lord, the Perfectly Enlightened One;
He is impeccable in conduct and understanding, the Serene One, the Knower of the Worlds;
He trains perfectly those who wish to be trained; he is Teacher of gods and men; he is Awake and Holy. "

--------------------------------------------
"The Dhamma is well-expounded by the Blessed One,
Apparent here and now, timeless, encouraging investigation,
Leading to liberation, to be experienced individually by the wise. "

User avatar
Kusala
Posts: 754
Joined: Sun Jan 23, 2011 11:02 am

Re: The Truth About The Rohingya Lie

Post by Kusala » Mon Dec 04, 2017 10:22 am

pilgrim wrote:
Mon Dec 04, 2017 6:03 am
Our views about any issue is inevitably the result of what we read and our sources of information. The Western paints a narrative that the Rohingya are helpless and innocent victims of violence. The Asian press, in various languages catering to the billions of Indians, Chinese and Asians however give the issue a different perspective. Neither India nor China, both of which have restive Muslim minorities have criticised Myanmar. Few of these articles are translated into English, but this article from a small Japanese outfit may give English readers an idea of the general narrative.

http://moderntokyotimes.com/?p=8028
The so-called "Rohingya" oppressed by those evil Buddhists...

Image

Image
Image

"He, the Blessed One, is indeed the Noble Lord, the Perfectly Enlightened One;
He is impeccable in conduct and understanding, the Serene One, the Knower of the Worlds;
He trains perfectly those who wish to be trained; he is Teacher of gods and men; he is Awake and Holy. "

--------------------------------------------
"The Dhamma is well-expounded by the Blessed One,
Apparent here and now, timeless, encouraging investigation,
Leading to liberation, to be experienced individually by the wise. "

User avatar
lyndon taylor
Posts: 1835
Joined: Mon May 02, 2011 11:41 pm
Location: Redlands, US occupied Northern Mexico
Contact:

Re: The Truth About The Rohingya Lie

Post by lyndon taylor » Mon Dec 04, 2017 10:37 am

There are lies of course, but their being perpetrated by Buddhist apologists IMHO
18 years ago I made one of the most important decisions of my life and entered a local Cambodian Buddhist Temple as a temple boy and, for only 3 weeks, an actual Therevada Buddhist monk. I am not a scholar, great meditator, or authority on Buddhism, but Buddhism is something I love from the Bottom of my heart. It has taught me sobriety, morality, peace, and very importantly that my suffering is optional, and doesn't have to run my life. I hope to give back what little I can to the Buddhist community, sincerely former monk John

http://trickleupeconomictheory.blogspot.com/

User avatar
Kim OHara
Posts: 4999
Joined: Wed Dec 09, 2009 5:47 am
Location: North Queensland, Australia

Re: The Truth About The Rohingya Lie

Post by Kim OHara » Mon Dec 04, 2017 10:58 am

Kusala wrote:
Mon Dec 04, 2017 8:37 am
Kim OHara wrote:
Sat Dec 02, 2017 3:56 am
Here's a thorough backgrounder from Al Jazeera - http://www.aljazeera.com/indepth/featur ... 42812.html - and it doesn't look much different from what's in the (responsible!) Western media.

:coffee:
Kim
Al Jazeera?

"Al Jazeera has been criticized for being state media owned by Qatar.[1][16][17][18][19][20] In 2010, United States Department of State internal communications, released by WikiLeaks as part of the 2010 diplomatic cables leak, claim that the Qatar government manipulates Al Jazeera coverage to suit political interests.[21][22][23][24][25][26]"


https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Al_Jazeer ... _criticism
So you would rather trust http://nationalpost.com/news/canada/not ... ime-charge a 'Notorious Mississauga blogger known for anti-Muslim rants' :toilet:

Do me - and yourself - a favour: find me - and yourself - a history of the Rohingya in, say, the last 50 years from any reputable source - wikipedia, Encyclopedia Britannica, CNN, Reuters, BBC News, any European or Japanese university - and show us where it differs materially from Al Jazeera's account.
If you can do that - and I want more than a sentence taken out of context - I will take your position seriously. If not, not.

:namaste:
Kim

Locked

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 21 guests