Muslims, Islam, U.S.A and Europe

A place to bring a contemplative / Dharmic perspective and opinions to current events and politics.
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paul
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Muslims, Islam, U.S.A and Europe

Post by paul » Thu Nov 30, 2017 12:17 am

Muslim population to grow in Europe:
http://www.pewforum.org/2017/11/29/euro ... opulation/

I posted the above link not to be alarmist, but rather as an extension of the idea of future diversity which I believe will accommodate different religious groups including Muslims, postulated in this post below in another thread. In any case the above research shows that the Muslim percentage of populations will be moderate.

In 2016 Barack Obama stated correctly that “we are living in the most peaceful era in human history and the world has never been less violent”. Continuity of this trend will allow a diversity of beliefs to coexist and grow more idiosyncratic side-by-side with each other. This is shown for example by the anti-evolution Christians in the US deep south, whose influence is as strong as ever, and who have successfully passed bills against science education into legislation, allowing them to live within society but maintain their own belief system, including that the world is 7000 years old etc. Theravada countries like Myanmar I think will show the lead in allowing minorities to flourish within their territories. This is looking forward toward the future and not perpetuating mediaeval attitudes from the past. Diversity will allow all the possible religious expressions of humanity to flourish, in accord with what has been recognised as the Anthropocene, or age dominated by human influence. Anthropocentrism, the belief that humans are the most significant entity of the universe, finds concord with Buddhist cosmology where of the three spheres of existence, the human realm is the most favourable destination for advancement:

“Let us human beings apply ourselves wholeheartedly and take up the unique opportunity given by our present birth. In the round of samsara it is extremely rare to rise above the realms of woe, where the way out of suffering cannot be followed, and a human birth is even more favorable to awakening than birth in the realm of the gods. Devas envy us our place, ostensibly so low on the cosmic scale, and wish to be reborn as humans. The Buddha Sasana still thrives, the Dhamma is available in full, there are excellent teachers who are true disciples of the Master, and we are on the best plane for striving.”—-“Teacher of the Devas”, Jootla.
The anthropocentric implication that humans are superior to animals also finds resonance in Theravada cosmology, and Buddhist ideas are converging with the global direction, evidenced by the societal adoption of mindfulness.
Last edited by paul on Thu Nov 30, 2017 3:35 am, edited 6 times in total.

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DooDoot
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Re: Muslims, Islam and Europe

Post by DooDoot » Thu Nov 30, 2017 1:54 am

Muslim population to grow in Europe, as cultivated by European governments (who should bear any warranted blame rather than Muslims).
paul wrote:
Thu Nov 30, 2017 12:17 am
In 2016 Barack Obama stated correctly that “we are living in the most peaceful era in human history and the world has never been less violent”.
It is said Obama is the most militaristic president in US history, based on the number of days of war & numbers of wars.
Before he took office in 2008, Barack Obama vowed to end America’s grueling conflicts in Iraq and Afghanistan. During his second term, he pledged to take the country off what he called a permanent war footing.

But Obama leaves a very different legacy as he prepares to hand his commander-in-chief responsibilities to Donald Trump. U.S. military forces have been at war for all eight years of Obama’s tenure, the first two-term president with that distinction. He launched airstrikes or military raids in at least seven countries: Afghanistan, Iraq, Syria, Libya, Yemen, Somalia and Pakistan.

Yet the U.S. faces more threats in more places than at any time since the Cold War, according to U.S. intelligence. For the first time in decades, there is at least the potential of an armed clash with America’s largest adversaries, Russia and China.

http://www.latimes.com/projects/la-na-pol-obama-at-war/
Last edited by DooDoot on Thu Nov 30, 2017 6:01 am, edited 5 times in total.

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retrofuturist
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Re: Muslims, Islam and Europe

Post by retrofuturist » Thu Nov 30, 2017 2:26 am

Greetings,
DooDoot wrote:
Thu Nov 30, 2017 1:54 am
Muslim population to grow in Europe, as cultivated by European governments.
A related article...

How George Soros Singlehandedly Created The European Refugee Crisis - And Why

Metta,
Paul. :)
"Do not force others, including children, by any means whatsoever, to adopt your views, whether by authority, threat, money, propaganda, or even education." - Ven. Thich Nhat Hanh

"The uprooting of identity is seen by the noble ones as pleasurable; but this contradicts what the whole world sees." (Snp 3.12)

"One discerns wrong view as wrong view, and right view as right view. This is one's right view." (MN 117)

Garrib
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Re: Muslims, Islam and Europe

Post by Garrib » Thu Nov 30, 2017 4:31 am

retrofuturist wrote:
Thu Nov 30, 2017 2:26 am
Greetings,
DooDoot wrote:
Thu Nov 30, 2017 1:54 am
Muslim population to grow in Europe, as cultivated by European governments.
A related article...

How George Soros Singlehandedly Created The European Refugee Crisis - And Why

Metta,
Paul. :)
Paul, my friend,

I urge you to consider choosing better sources. Please don't be offended.

Respectfully,

Brad

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retrofuturist
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Re: Muslims, Islam and Europe

Post by retrofuturist » Thu Nov 30, 2017 4:32 am

Greetings,
Garrib wrote:
Thu Nov 30, 2017 4:31 am
I urge you to consider choosing better sources. Please don't be offended.
Nothing wrong with Zero Hedge (other than perhaps you not liking it?). Much better to find fault with content, than using lazy ad-hominem smears against publications...

(I'm more than happy to find more sources if that's what you really want 8-) )

Metta,
Paul. :)
"Do not force others, including children, by any means whatsoever, to adopt your views, whether by authority, threat, money, propaganda, or even education." - Ven. Thich Nhat Hanh

"The uprooting of identity is seen by the noble ones as pleasurable; but this contradicts what the whole world sees." (Snp 3.12)

"One discerns wrong view as wrong view, and right view as right view. This is one's right view." (MN 117)

Garrib
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Re: Muslims, Islam and Europe

Post by Garrib » Thu Nov 30, 2017 4:54 am

retrofuturist wrote:
Thu Nov 30, 2017 4:32 am
Greetings,
Garrib wrote:
Thu Nov 30, 2017 4:31 am
I urge you to consider choosing better sources. Please don't be offended.
Nothing wrong with Zero Hedge (other than perhaps you not liking it?). Much better to find fault with content, than using lazy ad-hominem smears against publications...

(I'm more than happy to find more sources if that's what you really want 8-) )

Metta,
Paul. :)
I should have known better than to say anything! - To be honest, I kind of like having the opportunity to direct metta to people whose political views and media diets are quiet different than mine. So...carry on! :hug:

Dhamma Wheel is really a very unique "place" on the web. :smile:

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retrofuturist
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Re: Muslims, Islam and Europe

Post by retrofuturist » Thu Nov 30, 2017 4:58 am

Greetings Garrib,
Garrib wrote:
Thu Nov 30, 2017 4:54 am
I should have known better than to say anything! - To be honest, I kind of like having the opportunity to direct metta to people whose political views and media diets are quiet different than mine. So...carry on! :hug:
That's a very good and refreshing attitude to have, Garrib.
Garrib wrote:
Thu Nov 30, 2017 4:54 am
Dhamma Wheel is really a very unique "place" on the web. :smile:
Indeed... I spoke of that recently here.

I'll take it you don't want to hear more about the exploits of George Soros, but if you ever do, you know where to find me.

:lol:

Metta,
Paul. :)
"Do not force others, including children, by any means whatsoever, to adopt your views, whether by authority, threat, money, propaganda, or even education." - Ven. Thich Nhat Hanh

"The uprooting of identity is seen by the noble ones as pleasurable; but this contradicts what the whole world sees." (Snp 3.12)

"One discerns wrong view as wrong view, and right view as right view. This is one's right view." (MN 117)

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L.N.
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Re: Muslims, Islam and Europe

Post by L.N. » Thu Nov 30, 2017 5:00 am

Are you serious?
Zero Hedge's content has been classified as "alt-right", anti-establishment, conspiratorial, and economically pessimistic, and has been criticized for presenting extreme and sometimes pro-Russian views.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Zero_Hedge

I didn't think intelligent people actually believed this alt-right crap.
Sire patitthitā Buddhā
Dhammo ca tava locane
Sangho patitthitō tuiham
uresabba gunākaro


愿众佛坐在我的头顶, 佛法在我的眼中, 僧伽,功德的根源, 端坐在我的肩上。

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DooDoot
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Re: Muslims, Islam and Europe

Post by DooDoot » Thu Nov 30, 2017 5:38 am

L.N. wrote:
Thu Nov 30, 2017 5:00 am
I didn't think intelligent people actually believed this alt-right crap.
I thought all people, which i assume includes alt-right, just want to be treated as regular human beings, presumably with dignity and respect?

As for the refugee crisis, it is a serious issue, particularly if you are a refugee, from the wars engineered by the supposed US 'left-wing' in Libya or Syria.
Noam Chomsky has argued that the Western military intervention into Libya was a clear breach of UNSCR 1973 since it nullified the attempts for a ceasefire that were put forward by the resolution and welcomed by Gaddafi. As he puts it, "NATO powers (France and Britain in the lead and the United States following) violated the resolution, radically, and became the air force of the rebels. Nothing in the resolution justified that. It did call for “all necessary steps” to protect civilians, but there’s a big difference between protecting civilians and being the air force for the rebels.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/United_Na ... ution_1973

chownah
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Re: Muslims, Islam and Europe

Post by chownah » Thu Nov 30, 2017 6:09 am

Seems like the refugee situation is likely to get worse instead of better if the climate changes continue to happen and every indication is that they will continue to happen.

When african droughts caused millions to migrate previously these migrants were mosty settled in confined areas in africa (or they died). Now many of these people see what the future will bring in africa and they are finding their way to europe. Is this bad? Should they be locked up in african compounds instead?

chownah

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Sam Vara
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Re: Muslims, Islam and Europe

Post by Sam Vara » Thu Nov 30, 2017 6:45 am

chownah wrote:
Thu Nov 30, 2017 6:09 am
When african droughts caused millions to migrate previously these migrants were mosty settled in confined areas in africa (or they died). Now many of these people see what the future will bring in africa and they are finding their way to europe. Is this bad?
chownah
Yes, very bad. It puts enormous pressure on European counties, culture, and infrastructure, and those left behind in Africa tend to be those less able to cope, thereby causing a vicious spiral.
Should they be locked up in african compounds instead?
Not unless Africans themselves think this is a good solution, although a compound might be preferable to life in some countries. Far better to tackle the climate change, if possible, and the means of staying put with that climatic change if not. And there are many other reasons why Africans migrate. War and breakdown of civil authority seems to be a big one. So does the relative poverty perceived by Africans, who now have (due to botched Western interventions in the north of the continent) more opportunities to make their way to Europe by crossing failed states with no ability to stop them.

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Mr Man
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Re: Muslims, Islam and Europe

Post by Mr Man » Thu Nov 30, 2017 7:59 am

retrofuturist wrote:
Thu Nov 30, 2017 4:32 am

Nothing wrong with Zero Hedge (other than perhaps you not liking it?). Much better to find fault with content, than using lazy ad-hominem smears against publications...

Hi Paul
The content does not support the headline, which is fairly obviously way off the mark. It is also off topic to the OP. Perhaps if you wish to discuss that article you should start a new thread.

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Dharmasherab
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Re: Muslims, Islam and Europe

Post by Dharmasherab » Thu Nov 30, 2017 12:55 pm

I am not even a European but we cant deny the truth.

How Islam Is Destroying Europe

binocular
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Re: Muslims, Islam and Europe

Post by binocular » Thu Nov 30, 2017 3:15 pm

DooDoot wrote:
Thu Nov 30, 2017 1:54 am
Muslim population to grow in Europe, as cultivated by European governments (who should bear any warranted blame rather than Muslims).
Not just European governments, but idealistic, welcome-all, politically correct European people, and lukewarm European people who don't stand for anything.

Even a popular Catholic blogger here laments that it's very likely that Islam will soon take over Europe, and that a crucial factor for this is that European Christians (Catholics and others alike) are lukewarm in their religion, complacent, which makes them easy to be displaced by others who have stronger stances and practices.
Every person we save is one less zombie to fight. -- World War Z

alfa
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Re: Muslims, Islam and Europe

Post by alfa » Thu Nov 30, 2017 3:48 pm

Everything changes, becomes something else. This is Buddhism 101.

Nothing stays the same - not the individual, not things, certainly not countries and cultures.

Society is not some fixed, static thing. Not a stone but a river.

People are being alarmist with respect to what is really a natural phenomenon.

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