Romania just legalized corruption

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Twilight
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Romania just legalized corruption

Post by Twilight »

In my country, the socialist voted in power under a month ago just passed a law through executive order with the following contents:

IMPORTANT PROBLEMS:

- abuse in function (like giving contracts for 100 times the normal amount) - decriminalized under 50.000 euro. This means that if you steal 500.000 euro, you need to split it into 10 contract and in case you are caught, you get just a fine. Not only this, but you are not even banned from public functions. So you can continue to be a mayer or hospital manager or etc. no matter how much you steal

- influence traffic - decriminalized - again, you just get a fine. Speaking of witch, in US this is perfectly legal and is called "lobby" so don't look from the high chair on us

- denouncing is no longer possible after 6 months in the case of corruption problems. This is extremely important because most of the corruption cases were based on denounces made by others already having problems.

- gratiation - 3000 detainees, most of them for corruption problems, will be gratiated very soon.

- amnesty - those already investigated for abuse in function, taffic on influence etc. will be amnestiated

Smaller problems:

- conflict of interest (hiring your relatives in goverment positions) - no longer illegal.

- neglect in function - no longer illegal

- favoring the criminal - no longer illegal in case it is a relative up to grade 2 (all extended family)

- those who were charged for vote fraud (and the already mentioned abuse in function) are no longer banned from holding prime-minister position. This was put in because the leader of the socialist party was already convincted to 2 years suspension for vote fraud (many villages in his county had 180% vote presence - not even doing it smoothly) and is investigated for a lot of abuse in function problems. The guy stolen a couple of million euros during his career. And he could not be himself the prim-minister because of that and had to put a close friend

- many other smaller but nevertheless important law modifications that I have not listed


There have been huge protests for over a week now in all cities even very small ones, biggest protest ever since the 89' revolution. But the socialist arrogantly continue to dismiss them and claim they are politically motivated. And they just passed the executive order for this set of laws yesterday night. They said they will go ahead no matter how much the protests continue.

So yea. Trump or Hillary don't look too bad after you read this. And just imagine how hilarious it is watching the pro-socialist TV channels justifying all of this and claiming the others are the bad guys
You'll have a better chance finding a moderate rebel in Ildib than finding a buddhist who ever changed his views. Views are there to be clung to. They are there to be defended with all one's might. Whatever clinging one will removed in regards to sense pleasures by practicing the path - that should be compensated with increased clinging to views. This is the fundamental balance of the noble 8thfold path. The yin and yang.
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Twilight
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Re: Romania just legalized corruption

Post by Twilight »

Some background about how we got to this: In the 90's, there were laws in place only that they were not respected because the justice system was subordinated to the politicians. This was a period where you could do things like: give a whole historical mountain resort worth 650 million for free to a socialist senator that used to be a bodyguard at a hotel over there and nobody even investigated you. The 90's were the wild west. After going into EU in 2007 and after much pressure from society, there were incredible reforms made in the justice system. And the DNA (anti-corruption department) was created. Also a bunch of good guys happened to get to rule it. 1/3 of the last parliament is under investigation, half of the last cabinet + the prime minister under investigation (witch means 92% chance of going to jail) There were people from all political parties put in jail and even many people from the justice system itself, including the chief of the anti-crime department. But the socialist were the most affected because they are the dictionary deffinition of corruption. If there would be olympics for corruptions they would win it. So they were openly pro-corruption from the start, having a narrative about "we are turning into a police state" and things like that while the other parties had an anti-corruption narrative.

Since this DNA is independent and can not be destroyed through a simple executive order (not to mention the EU wound jump on us), all they could do was simply modify the law and make corruption legal. So this is how we got to legalizing corruption.

In the past, the socialist made an attempt in 2012 to remove the president illegally. And the EU, US and everybody jumped very hard on us. So you can't just destroy the DNA through executive order, you need to follow some procedures or we get excluded from the EU. And since they could not do that, they simply passed an executive order legalizing corruption and nobody can complain that they did not respect the procedures.
You'll have a better chance finding a moderate rebel in Ildib than finding a buddhist who ever changed his views. Views are there to be clung to. They are there to be defended with all one's might. Whatever clinging one will removed in regards to sense pleasures by practicing the path - that should be compensated with increased clinging to views. This is the fundamental balance of the noble 8thfold path. The yin and yang.
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Consciousness and no-self explained in drawings: link
How stream entry is achieved. Mahasi / Zen understanding vs Sutta understanding: link
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retrofuturist
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Re: Romania just legalized corruption

Post by retrofuturist »

Greetings Twilight,

I wish you and your fellow citizens all the best in the battle against corruption in Romania.

Governments should exist to serve the people, not exploit them for personal advantage.

Metta,
Paul. :)
"The uprooting of identity is seen by the noble ones as pleasurable; but this contradicts what the whole world sees." (Snp 3.12)

"It is natural that one who knows and sees things as they really are is disenchanted and dispassionate." (AN 10.2)

"Overcome the liar by truth." (Dhp 223)
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Twilight
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Re: Romania just legalized corruption

Post by Twilight »

I wish you and your fellow citizens all the best in the battle against corruption in Romania.
Are you making fun of us ? :)))))))))


I just googled and see it's already world news: https://www.google.ro/webhp?sourceid=ch ... corruption
You'll have a better chance finding a moderate rebel in Ildib than finding a buddhist who ever changed his views. Views are there to be clung to. They are there to be defended with all one's might. Whatever clinging one will removed in regards to sense pleasures by practicing the path - that should be compensated with increased clinging to views. This is the fundamental balance of the noble 8thfold path. The yin and yang.
----------
Consciousness and no-self explained in drawings: link
How stream entry is achieved. Mahasi / Zen understanding vs Sutta understanding: link
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retrofuturist
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Re: Romania just legalized corruption

Post by retrofuturist »

Greetings Twilight,
Twilight wrote:Are you making fun of us ?
No.

Metta,
Paul. :)
"The uprooting of identity is seen by the noble ones as pleasurable; but this contradicts what the whole world sees." (Snp 3.12)

"It is natural that one who knows and sees things as they really are is disenchanted and dispassionate." (AN 10.2)

"Overcome the liar by truth." (Dhp 223)
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Twilight
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Re: Romania just legalized corruption

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I'm really losing hope. Now that corruption is legal, there is no way anybody is making it illegal again. First of all, the socialist just got elected and will rule for 4 years with the president having little power against them. If others will take power after 4 years, they will probably make modifications but I don't think they'll make it as before. There will take at least a decade to make corruption illegal again.

I can't believe such a thing can really happen. There is probably no country in the world where corruption was simply made legal through emergency decree. What could you possibly do worse than that as a politician ??? The socialist tried pushing the gratiation&amnesty law in the past so I expected them to gratiate politicians in jail and amnesty those investigated at one point. But I never really expected to do this but also legalize corruption. If there would be such a thing as corruption olympics the romanian socialist would rig it.

The insidiously corrupt socialist leader who is 50% responsible for this is almost laughing when speaking on TV. You can clearly see he is amused himself. When he is asked about "what problems could this laws bring in terms of corruption", you can clearly see he is sometimes keeping himself from laughing.
You'll have a better chance finding a moderate rebel in Ildib than finding a buddhist who ever changed his views. Views are there to be clung to. They are there to be defended with all one's might. Whatever clinging one will removed in regards to sense pleasures by practicing the path - that should be compensated with increased clinging to views. This is the fundamental balance of the noble 8thfold path. The yin and yang.
----------
Consciousness and no-self explained in drawings: link
How stream entry is achieved. Mahasi / Zen understanding vs Sutta understanding: link
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Twilight
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Re: Romania just legalized corruption

Post by Twilight »

When googling "romania legalized corruption" we get on first page:

Vice - Romania has essentially made political corruption legal

USAToday - In Romania, what's a little corruption ?

TheGuardian - Romanian PM to "press ahead" with corruption decrees as protests grow

RonPaul - Romania's "Great idea": Legalize corruption

Eurobserver - Romanian PM decriminalized political corruption


This is simply hilarious. And just take a moment and imagine what kind of things they are saying on the pro-socialist TV channels. Just take a moment to think about it. They're saying of course that the others are the bad guys and are trying to delegitimize the elected government. That they don't know how to lose an election. That we were already a police state. That we were told by the EU that our jails are overcrowded and that is why we needed to do this through an emergency decree very fast cause conditions in jail are inhumane. And of course been as aggressive as possible cause they always are super aggressive. If you think that MSNBC woman with short hair is annoying believe me socialist TV channels here are 10 times more aggressive and more annoying.
You'll have a better chance finding a moderate rebel in Ildib than finding a buddhist who ever changed his views. Views are there to be clung to. They are there to be defended with all one's might. Whatever clinging one will removed in regards to sense pleasures by practicing the path - that should be compensated with increased clinging to views. This is the fundamental balance of the noble 8thfold path. The yin and yang.
----------
Consciousness and no-self explained in drawings: link
How stream entry is achieved. Mahasi / Zen understanding vs Sutta understanding: link
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Twilight
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Re: Romania just legalized corruption

Post by Twilight »

BREAKING - There are hopes that something will happen. I have a feeling something will happen.

1) The protests are getting bigger and bigger by the day and they were already the biggest protest since the 89 revolution, bigger even than the protests of the economic crisis. More and more celebrities, politicians, foreign politicians etc. are siding with the protesters. Even people from inside the socialist party have started been against it and some have even resigned. Today, even the church who is insidiously corrupt and pro-socialist has sided with the protesters. This is a change because 2 days ago the church gave the signal that it is siding with the socialist. Since the protest got so big and everybody in the country is against this, people are tying to side with the protesters to gain image.

2) The socialist leader has shown signs of mentally cracking. One time, he was walking with 20 reporters around him in the parliament while other parliamentaries were shouting at him and protesting. One was shouting "will you do it, will you pass the emergency decree" and he shouted back "I'll do your mother too". Another sign was during an interview in Switzerland. When he was asked about "the fight against corruption" he said "I am tired of this bullshit about corruption we keep hearing for 27 years. I came here to be asked important questions about the governing of the country". He knows his political life in on the line and he is not prime-minister himself. He is also investigated and guaranteed to get to jail if this legalize+amnesty+gratiation law does not pass. He could not care less about the socialist party, he only cares about himself and this law is destroying the socialist chances at next elections. He has strong control of the party but the socialist might just drop him at one point. He really misjudged this, never expecting such a vulcano to erupt. He knows the socialist will be quick to blame all of this on himself and drop him if the tension keeps getting higher and higher.

3) Another good thing is that the president did a brilliant move on the first days of protest. He went into the crowd, linking his image with anti-corruption from day 1. (he is quite corrupt himself so his image was not exactly anti-corruption before this) Everybody including me said it was a bad move cause it's not good for a president to be present at a protest. Actually it's even illegal and he can get suspended. The socialist were super vehement and promised to suspend him. But now giving how things have evolved, the president is basically unsuspendable no matter what he does. Last time a president was suspended by the corrupt socialist he won with 80% the referendum and then crushed the next elections. So if the socialist suspend the president they commit political suicide. So now the president can even do illegal things cause nobody will suspend him. Getting suspended is the best thing that could happen to him.

Like any romanian, I'm always very pessimistic when it comes to politics but 3 times in the recent past we were very close to doing something stupid and it was stopped last moment. All the time the people surprisingly rose up and stopped it. And this time it is bigger than anything before. Theoretically there is not much to do cause the emergency decree was already passed and the socialist have overwhealming majority in the parliament. But things are getting bigger and bigger and something might happen.
You'll have a better chance finding a moderate rebel in Ildib than finding a buddhist who ever changed his views. Views are there to be clung to. They are there to be defended with all one's might. Whatever clinging one will removed in regards to sense pleasures by practicing the path - that should be compensated with increased clinging to views. This is the fundamental balance of the noble 8thfold path. The yin and yang.
----------
Consciousness and no-self explained in drawings: link
How stream entry is achieved. Mahasi / Zen understanding vs Sutta understanding: link
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Twilight
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Re: Romania just legalized corruption

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I want to point out that romanians almost never protest. We don't have this american tradition of protesting about everything. Protest are very very rare here. But this gives so much more importance to the protest. When a protest happens, it always happens for a good reason, is usually apolitical and quickly tansforms into a mini-revolution. And they have a huge impact because of the highly colectivistic mentality that we inherited since the communist times and probably also because of the "revolution" mindset. People always have this mentality of "I have to be with the people, how could I be against the people ?", "omg, the people are rising, I have to be with the people". "The people" is probably the holiest word in Ro language. So when a protest happens everybody in the country is with the protest no matter what party they like. If "the people" are rising you have to be with the people.

So this is something very big happening. It's the biggest protest since the 89 revolution and is getting bigger by the day. Yesterday there were 150.000 people in Bucharest out of 2million population + protests in every city even very small ones despite been very cold outside cause of the winter.
You'll have a better chance finding a moderate rebel in Ildib than finding a buddhist who ever changed his views. Views are there to be clung to. They are there to be defended with all one's might. Whatever clinging one will removed in regards to sense pleasures by practicing the path - that should be compensated with increased clinging to views. This is the fundamental balance of the noble 8thfold path. The yin and yang.
----------
Consciousness and no-self explained in drawings: link
How stream entry is achieved. Mahasi / Zen understanding vs Sutta understanding: link
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retrofuturist
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Re: Romania just legalized corruption

Post by retrofuturist »

Greetings Twilight,

Thanks for the updates... I hope once a new equilibrium is found, it's a solution without corruption that maximizes the liberty of the Romanian people.

Metta,
Paul. :)
"The uprooting of identity is seen by the noble ones as pleasurable; but this contradicts what the whole world sees." (Snp 3.12)

"It is natural that one who knows and sees things as they really are is disenchanted and dispassionate." (AN 10.2)

"Overcome the liar by truth." (Dhp 223)
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Twilight
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Re: Romania just legalized corruption

Post by Twilight »

I hope too. I also wanted to say that even with all the anti-corruption magnificent success from 2012 onward, we still were doing bad with corruption. If I am not mistaken, we were number 49 in the world, one place above Cuba and one place below Jordan. Withing the EU, there is Greece - Bulgaria - Romania - Italy - Portugal in this order.

Also, the Bulgarians are having a protest right now in solidarity with Romania, something that never happened before. We are ages above them in terms of anti-corruption and have always been a model for them. And they do not want to see this happening and ruin their hopes too. Also, Rep.Moldova is also protesting in solidarity cause they are romanians too (stold by the soviets in WW2). Rep. Moldova is standing at 1800$ pib per capita (ro is at 10.000) and are the poorest country in europe, poorer even than the albanians. They are a piece of africa in the middle of europe and continue to vote communist even right now in 2017. They have just elected and anti-romanian communist president who announced yesterday he want's to change the moldavian flag (witch is almost the same as the romanian one) and replace it with a red flag. So at least there are other people doing worse than us.
You'll have a better chance finding a moderate rebel in Ildib than finding a buddhist who ever changed his views. Views are there to be clung to. They are there to be defended with all one's might. Whatever clinging one will removed in regards to sense pleasures by practicing the path - that should be compensated with increased clinging to views. This is the fundamental balance of the noble 8thfold path. The yin and yang.
----------
Consciousness and no-self explained in drawings: link
How stream entry is achieved. Mahasi / Zen understanding vs Sutta understanding: link
dzt
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Re: Romania just legalized corruption

Post by dzt »

I've heard just recently that your protests actually worked, and that the law was cancelled. Is it true?
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