Fake News

A place to bring a contemplative / Dharmic perspective and opinions to current events and politics.
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Pseudobabble
Posts: 617
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Location: London

Re: Fake News

Post by Pseudobabble » Tue Feb 20, 2018 4:01 pm

alan wrote:
Sun Feb 18, 2018 2:08 am
Who does not? But I will be proven correct.
You may find this of interest:
Cula-viyuha Sutta wrote:'Those who teach a doctrine other than this
are lacking in purity,
imperfect.'
That's what the many sectarians say,
for they're smitten with passion
for their own views.
'Only here is there purity,'
that's what they say.
'In no other doctrine
is purity,' they say.
That's how the many sectarians
are entrenched,
speaking firmly there
concerning their own path.
Speaking firmly concerning your own path,
what opponent here would you take as a fool?
You'd simply bring quarrels on yourself
if you said your opponent's a fool
with an impure doctrine.
"Does Master Gotama have any position at all?"

"A 'position,' Vaccha, is something that a Tathagata has done away with. What a Tathagata sees is this: 'Such is form, such its origination, such its disappearance; such is feeling, such its origination, such its disappearance; such is perception...such are fabrications...such is consciousness, such its origination, such its disappearance.'" - Aggi-Vacchagotta Sutta


'Dust thou art, and unto dust thou shalt return.' - Genesis 3:19

'Some fart freely, some try to hide and silence it. Which one is correct?' - Saegnapha

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lyndon taylor
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Re: Fake News

Post by lyndon taylor » Tue Feb 20, 2018 5:05 pm

There's nothing shadier than trying to use Buddhism to justify right wing political views IMHO
18 years ago I made one of the most important decisions of my life and entered a local Cambodian Buddhist Temple as a temple boy and, for only 3 weeks, an actual Therevada Buddhist monk. I am not a scholar, great meditator, or authority on Buddhism, but Buddhism is something I love from the Bottom of my heart. It has taught me sobriety, morality, peace, and very importantly that my suffering is optional, and doesn't have to run my life. I hope to give back what little I can to the Buddhist community, sincerely former monk John

http://trickleupeconomictheory.blogspot.com/

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Sam Vara
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Re: Fake News

Post by Sam Vara » Tue Feb 20, 2018 6:35 pm

lyndon taylor wrote:
Tue Feb 20, 2018 5:05 pm
There's nothing shadier than trying to use Buddhism to justify right wing political views IMHO
Are left-wing or centrist views OK, though? Are they equally or less shady? I only ask...

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retrofuturist
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Re: Fake News

Post by retrofuturist » Tue Feb 20, 2018 10:54 pm

Greetings,

Donald Trump gave a $500,000 speech paid for by a Kremlin bank, and his private foundation had accepted $145 million from Vladi­mir Putin-linked oligarchs and their Western business partners!

:jawdrop:

Oh no, wait, that's #FakeNews ... it was actually Hillary.

:lol:

Oh, by the way... how's that #FakeNews Trump-Russia collusion narrative going?

Image

Thought so. It was nothing but aversion, desperation and mendacious vitriol from the outset.

:toilet:

Metta,
Paul. :)
"Do not force others, including children, by any means whatsoever, to adopt your views, whether by authority, threat, money, propaganda, or even education." - Ven. Thich Nhat Hanh

"The uprooting of identity is seen by the noble ones as pleasurable; but this contradicts what the whole world sees." (Snp 3.12)

"One discerns wrong view as wrong view, and right view as right view. This is one's right view." (MN 117)

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lyndon taylor
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Re: Fake News

Post by lyndon taylor » Wed Feb 21, 2018 12:07 am

Sam Vara wrote:
Tue Feb 20, 2018 6:35 pm
lyndon taylor wrote:
Tue Feb 20, 2018 5:05 pm
There's nothing shadier than trying to use Buddhism to justify right wing political views IMHO
Are left-wing or centrist views OK, though? Are they equally or less shady? I only ask...
In that right wing views are the antithesis of what Buddhism stands for I would say yes, you are right.
18 years ago I made one of the most important decisions of my life and entered a local Cambodian Buddhist Temple as a temple boy and, for only 3 weeks, an actual Therevada Buddhist monk. I am not a scholar, great meditator, or authority on Buddhism, but Buddhism is something I love from the Bottom of my heart. It has taught me sobriety, morality, peace, and very importantly that my suffering is optional, and doesn't have to run my life. I hope to give back what little I can to the Buddhist community, sincerely former monk John

http://trickleupeconomictheory.blogspot.com/

chownah
Posts: 7334
Joined: Wed Aug 12, 2009 2:19 pm

Re: Fake News

Post by chownah » Wed Feb 21, 2018 2:48 am

retrofuturist wrote:
Tue Feb 20, 2018 10:54 pm
Greetings,

Donald Trump gave a $500,000 speech paid for by a Kremlin bank, and his private foundation had accepted $145 million from Vladi­mir Putin-linked oligarchs and their Western business partners!

:jawdrop:

Oh no, wait, that's #FakeNews ... it was actually Hillary.
This is not a reply to retrofuturist.

Retrofuturist has presented fake news.....it was not hillary who gave the speech or received the money. A link found in his reference points to another wash-post article which summarizes by saying:
Assessment: Yes, the foundation received money and Bill Clinton was paid to give a speech, but there’s no evidence the Clintons were paid by Russians to push through the uranium deal.
Having said that; I fully support all efforts to investigate any and all actions of the clintons past and present.........no need to present fake news making false accusations like retrofuturist has done.
chownah

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lyndon taylor
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Re: Fake News

Post by lyndon taylor » Wed Feb 21, 2018 5:05 am

Seems the people spouting the fake news are the ones claiming everything else is fake news, and their fake news is the real news, in Buddhism this is called delusion.
18 years ago I made one of the most important decisions of my life and entered a local Cambodian Buddhist Temple as a temple boy and, for only 3 weeks, an actual Therevada Buddhist monk. I am not a scholar, great meditator, or authority on Buddhism, but Buddhism is something I love from the Bottom of my heart. It has taught me sobriety, morality, peace, and very importantly that my suffering is optional, and doesn't have to run my life. I hope to give back what little I can to the Buddhist community, sincerely former monk John

http://trickleupeconomictheory.blogspot.com/

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Pseudobabble
Posts: 617
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Location: London

Re: Fake News

Post by Pseudobabble » Wed Feb 21, 2018 6:43 am

lyndon taylor wrote:
Wed Feb 21, 2018 5:05 am
Seems the people spouting the fake news are the ones claiming everything else is fake news, and their fake news is the real news, in Buddhism this is called delusion.
And you seem curiously certain you know the difference.
"Does Master Gotama have any position at all?"

"A 'position,' Vaccha, is something that a Tathagata has done away with. What a Tathagata sees is this: 'Such is form, such its origination, such its disappearance; such is feeling, such its origination, such its disappearance; such is perception...such are fabrications...such is consciousness, such its origination, such its disappearance.'" - Aggi-Vacchagotta Sutta


'Dust thou art, and unto dust thou shalt return.' - Genesis 3:19

'Some fart freely, some try to hide and silence it. Which one is correct?' - Saegnapha

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Kusala
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Re: Fake News

Post by Kusala » Fri Feb 23, 2018 10:37 am

lyndon taylor wrote:
Wed Feb 21, 2018 12:07 am
Sam Vara wrote:
Tue Feb 20, 2018 6:35 pm
lyndon taylor wrote:
Tue Feb 20, 2018 5:05 pm
There's nothing shadier than trying to use Buddhism to justify right wing political views IMHO
Are left-wing or centrist views OK, though? Are they equally or less shady? I only ask...
In that right wing views are the antithesis of what Buddhism stands for I would say yes, you are right.
Perhaps the parable of the blind men and the elephant is a reminder that the Dhamma is neither left nor right...

Image
Image

"He, the Blessed One, is indeed the Noble Lord, the Perfectly Enlightened One;
He is impeccable in conduct and understanding, the Serene One, the Knower of the Worlds;
He trains perfectly those who wish to be trained; he is Teacher of gods and men; he is Awake and Holy. "

--------------------------------------------
"The Dhamma is well-expounded by the Blessed One,
Apparent here and now, timeless, encouraging investigation,
Leading to liberation, to be experienced individually by the wise. "

alan
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Location: Miramar beach, Fl.

Re: Fake News

Post by alan » Sat Feb 24, 2018 4:47 am

Not fake.
rsz_11screen_shot_2018-02-23_at_60454_pm.png
rsz_11screen_shot_2018-02-23_at_60454_pm.png (174.81 KiB) Viewed 484 times

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Leeuwenhoek2
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Re: Fake News

Post by Leeuwenhoek2 » Sat Feb 24, 2018 9:24 pm

Pseudobabble wrote:
Wed Feb 21, 2018 6:43 am
Responding to:
  • Seems the people spouting the fake news are the ones claiming everything else is fake news, and their fake news is the real news, in Buddhism this is called delusion.
And you seem curiously certain you know the difference.
It seems quite possible that those who complain about "fake news" may themselves be spreading fake stories. Of course.
The wise would early on ask the ancient question: "who checks up on the checkers"?

I say that talking about "fake news" in the abstract -- without making specific reference (with URL's please) to a) actual stories or claims as well as to b) the "fact checkers" AND c) the people who "debunk" the fact checkers -- is a path to delusion. Without reference to specific news stories just talking about "news" (in the abstract) as being "fake" (in the abstract) is it's own type of unreality. That is, abstractions are generalizations. Generalizations are only "real" as statistical predictions. We only know how accurate predictions are by checking them against specific cases. Talking about politics in such a "grounded" way requires a certain discipline.

One thing that stands out for me when reading "fact checking" websites is how often the "facts" seem to require a certain degree of interpretation and judgement. It's OK to use judgement but it tends to become divisive when you don't explicitly acknowledge your assumptions and interpretations. A person who is transparent in this way can talk about very controversial, so-called "divisive" issues in a way that isn't divisive. (That's my personal take on precepts about non-divisive speach).

The default position should be that persons on both or all sides of an issue and all political parties tend to spin the facts. That is, assume the problem is roughly symmetrical where each side manifests the problem somewhat differently but in approximately the same amount. Political psychology studies that actively look for this symmetrical pattern usually find it. That often means that the experiment has to get input from psychologists and political experts from a diversity of political leanings.

Some examples of symmetrical bias. Men and women both tend to rate themselves as above average on a number of traits. But the traits that men rate themselves high on are different than the traits women rate themselves on. Another variation: voters often express concern that other people are, or will be, taken in or overly swayed by their least favorite political candidate BUT they themselves are not.

alan
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Location: Miramar beach, Fl.

Re: Fake News

Post by alan » Fri Mar 02, 2018 2:09 am

Hope Hicks resigns, one day after talking to the Congress investigating Russia connections. Coincidence?
Well, she was only telling "White Lies".
White lies are Ok, right?

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retrofuturist
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Re: Fake News

Post by retrofuturist » Fri Mar 02, 2018 2:49 am

Greetings Alan,

Don't get your hopes up about Gates and Manafort. In fact, you're not going to like what it's actually about...

Podesta Group one of the companies mentioned in Manafort indictment: report

Trump-Russia collusion is fake news. Even your mate Schiffty has to acknowledge he's got nothing on Trump.

All the best.

Metta,
Paul. :)
"Do not force others, including children, by any means whatsoever, to adopt your views, whether by authority, threat, money, propaganda, or even education." - Ven. Thich Nhat Hanh

"The uprooting of identity is seen by the noble ones as pleasurable; but this contradicts what the whole world sees." (Snp 3.12)

"One discerns wrong view as wrong view, and right view as right view. This is one's right view." (MN 117)

alan
Posts: 3087
Joined: Wed Sep 30, 2009 12:14 am
Location: Miramar beach, Fl.

Re: Fake News

Post by alan » Fri Mar 02, 2018 3:14 am

Trump--Russia collusion is totally real.
And, if Podesta had anything to do with the Russians, that proves that there are only two Americans you can trust:
Alan Hoelzle, and Adam Schiff.

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Pseudobabble
Posts: 617
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Location: London

Re: Fake News

Post by Pseudobabble » Fri Mar 02, 2018 8:04 am

alan wrote:
Fri Mar 02, 2018 3:14 am
Trump--Russia collusion is totally real.
And, if Podesta had anything to do with the Russians, that proves that there are only two Americans you can trust:
Alan Hoelzle, and Adam Schiff.
If your grandad doesn't eat porridge, that proves he's no true Scotsman.
"Does Master Gotama have any position at all?"

"A 'position,' Vaccha, is something that a Tathagata has done away with. What a Tathagata sees is this: 'Such is form, such its origination, such its disappearance; such is feeling, such its origination, such its disappearance; such is perception...such are fabrications...such is consciousness, such its origination, such its disappearance.'" - Aggi-Vacchagotta Sutta


'Dust thou art, and unto dust thou shalt return.' - Genesis 3:19

'Some fart freely, some try to hide and silence it. Which one is correct?' - Saegnapha

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