Gender and Sexuality report

A place to bring a contemplative / Dharmic perspective and opinions to current events and politics.
Justsit
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Re: Gender and Sexuality report

Post by Justsit » Tue Aug 23, 2016 2:30 am

My point was not about being "triggered," it was the fact that it is very disheartening to come to a Buddhist forum and find repeated threads disparaging a minority group via biased articles.

It is difficult enough experiencing bias and hatred in the "real world" without finding it here as well. That being said, I will move along and leave OP to his crusade.

May all beings be happy, peaceful, and free from suffering.

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Dan74
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Re: Gender and Sexuality report

Post by Dan74 » Tue Aug 23, 2016 2:42 am

Justsit wrote:My point was not about being "triggered," it was the fact that it is very disheartening to come to a Buddhist forum and find repeated threads disparaging a minority group via biased articles.

It is difficult enough experiencing bias and hatred in the "real world" without finding it here as well. That being said, I will move along and leave OP to his crusade.

May all beings be happy, peaceful, and free from suffering.
Hi Justsit :hello:

I hear you and a very wise response.

:bow:
_/|\_

chownah
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Re: Gender and Sexuality report

Post by chownah » Tue Aug 23, 2016 3:54 am

Justsit wrote:My point was not about being "triggered," it was the fact that it is very disheartening to come to a Buddhist forum and find repeated threads disparaging a minority group via biased articles.

It is difficult enough experiencing bias and hatred in the "real world" without finding it here as well. That being said, I will move along and leave OP to his crusade.

May all beings be happy, peaceful, and free from suffering.
I hear what you are saying and I'm glad you said it. I took a very very brief look at the article...I mean really brief...I just picked a couple of spots more or less at random and read a few paragraphs. I did not find what I would consider to be a major pattern of bias. From the extremely extremely small sampling that I made I found it to be informative about how sex and gender are viewed by people and societal groups....it seemed to present some science....I saw nothing offensive.

If it does have biases it would be good for people to point them out....I think people could learn alot about sex and gender if they read some of this....I found it boring because I have no problems or expectations about my sex or gender nor about the sex or gender of others so for me this whole thing is a non issue.
chownah

chownah
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Re: Gender and Sexuality report

Post by chownah » Tue Aug 23, 2016 3:27 pm

Here is an article discussing the sex and gender report link to in the original post.
http://www.cnsnews.com/commentary/ryan- ... and-gender
Title:
Nearly Everything the Media Tell You About Sexual Orientation and Gender Identity Is Wrong

Here is the introduction:
A major new report, published today in the journal The New Atlantis, challenges the leading narratives that the media has pushed regarding sexual orientation and gender identity.

Co-authored by two of the nation’s leading scholars on mental health and sexuality, the 143-page report discusses over 200 peer-reviewed studies in the biological, psychological, and social sciences, painstakingly documenting what scientific research shows and does not show about sexuality and gender.

The major takeaway, as the editor of the journal explains, is that “some of the most frequently heard claims about sexuality and gender are not supported by scientific evidence.”

Here are four of the report’s most important conclusions:

“The belief that sexual orientation is an innate, biologically fixed human property—that people are ‘born that way’—is not supported by scientific evidence.

“Likewise, the belief that gender identity is an innate, fixed human property independent of biological sex—so that a person might be a ‘man trapped in a woman’s body’ or ‘a woman trapped in a man’s body’—is not supported by scientific evidence.

“Only a minority of children who express gender-atypical thoughts or behavior will continue to do so into adolescence or adulthood. There is no evidence that all such children should be encouraged to become transgender, much less subjected to hormone treatments or surgery.

“Non-heterosexual and transgender people have higher rates of mental health problems (anxiety, depression, suicide), as well as behavioral and social problems (substance abuse, intimate partner violence), than the general population. Discrimination alone does not account for the entire disparity.”

The report, “Sexuality and Gender: Findings from the Biological, Psychological, and Social Sciences,” is co-authored by Dr. Lawrence Mayer and Dr. Paul McHugh. Mayer is a scholar-in-residence in the Department of Psychiatry at Johns Hopkins University and a professor of statistics and biostatistics at Arizona State University.

McHugh, whom the editor of The New Atlantis describes as “arguably the most important American psychiatrist of the last half-century,” is a professor of psychiatry and behavioral sciences at the Johns Hopkins University School of Medicine and was for 25 years the psychiatrist-in-chief at the Johns Hopkins Hospital. It was during his tenure as psychiatrist-in-chief at Johns Hopkins that he put an end to sex reassignment surgery there, after a study launched at Hopkins revealed that it didn’t have the benefits for which doctors and patients had long hoped.
---------------------------
Seems pretty legit to me...Johns Hopkins is pretty reputable I think. If people aren't sure then they could do a search on the authors and the journal they are being published in and see what you find but this is probably pretty unbiased I think.
chownah
P.S. I found this in Yahoo science news.
chownah

Justsit
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Re: Gender and Sexuality report

Post by Justsit » Tue Aug 23, 2016 6:04 pm

Chownah,

Perhaps you did not have a chance to read the articles I cited in my first post? They very effectively refute the bias found in McHugh's writing.

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Mr Man
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Re: Gender and Sexuality report

Post by Mr Man » Tue Aug 23, 2016 7:50 pm

I had taken Chownah's posts to be satirical.

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Bundokji
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Re: Gender and Sexuality report

Post by Bundokji » Tue Aug 23, 2016 10:02 pm

I have read the executive summary and the scanned through the links provided on this thread. Few thoughts arouse in my mind in relation to the underlying/hidden assumptions which sometimes goes unnoticed and unquestioned in such discussions, so the following is merely descriptive (not prescriptive) and should not be seen as neither condemning nor praising:

Science is a reliable source of information. If my belief system is supported by scientific evidence, then i am somehow justified in holding such beliefs. If i encounter a scientific research that contradicts with a strongly held belief, then the best antidote is to look for another research which refutes it, so i can remain secure/safe within my belief system. After all, scientists are smart and objective people who know what they are doing.

There are two selves: one is a social construct which does not really reflect who we really are, and the other is the underlying feelings and desires of the individual which is more genuine and real. To live a happy life, one should live according to his/her real self, and ignore what people want him to be.

We all deserve to be accepted as we are, without judgement or prejudice. As long as i am not hurting anyone or engaging in an illegal activity, then i am free to do whatever i want, and if people do not accept me for what i really am, they are insensitive and bigoted by definition. Only those who truly love us would accept all aspects of our being without expecting us to change.

Being vulnerable/fearful of rejection is justified and somehow expected. Human beings are fragile social animals so when one expresses a view (especially if its related to identity) then words should be carefully weighed.

People have rights, which are inherent to all human beings regardless of their nationality, religion, ethnic group, sexuality, gender, social status ..etc and discovering human rights is one of the best achievements of the civilized world.
And the Blessed One addressed the bhikkhus, saying: "Behold now, bhikkhus, I exhort you: All compounded things are subject to vanish. Strive with earnestness!"

This was the last word of the Tathagata.

chownah
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Re: Gender and Sexuality report

Post by chownah » Wed Aug 24, 2016 3:47 am

Justsit wrote:Chownah,

Perhaps you did not have a chance to read the articles I cited in my first post? They very effectively refute the bias found in McHugh's writing.
You are correct that I did not look at your links and I am sorry that I did not. Please accept my sincere apology for not having done that and also let me thank you for bringing that information to the discussion.
chownah
P.S. I'll just put the links here so that if someone doesn't see them in your post they will have a second chance at it:
https://thinkprogress.org/meet-the-doct ... .89kv5esbk

http://transadvocate.com/clinging-to-a- ... _13842.htm

chownah
Last edited by chownah on Wed Aug 24, 2016 4:01 am, edited 1 time in total.

chownah
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Re: Gender and Sexuality report

Post by chownah » Wed Aug 24, 2016 3:48 am

Mr Man wrote:I had taken Chownah's posts to be satirical.
I hope you enjoyed whatever humor you found in my posts. I assure you that they were not meant to be satirical.
chownah

chownah
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Re: Gender and Sexuality report

Post by chownah » Wed Aug 24, 2016 3:56 am

One of the issues that I would like to get more information on is what is the outlook for surgical gender reassignment patients as the years go by. I am not willing to spend the time to try to find this info because as I have said gender/sexuality is a non issue for me....but I would be really interested in finding out something about how satisfied they are or how has their self image changed over time what medical side effects arise, etc.
chownah

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Mr Man
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Re: Gender and Sexuality report

Post by Mr Man » Wed Aug 24, 2016 6:58 am

chownah wrote:
Mr Man wrote:I had taken Chownah's posts to be satirical.
I hope you enjoyed whatever humor you found in my posts. I assure you that they were not meant to be satirical.
chownah
Well when you said
I found it boring because I have no problems or expectations about my sex or gender nor about the sex or gender of others so for me this whole thing is a non issue.
I thought you were hinting at the reverse implication.

You also said
Seems pretty legit to me

Given the source of the article you had linked to (a catholic website republishing an article from a tea party website). Sources that I perceive to be fairly agenda driven

And
P.S. I found this in Yahoo science news


I thought you were drawing attention to how our positions are nowadays often formed/reinforced by a cursory search on the internet.

---

This, from the article you linked to, struck me
The regulations will force many physicians, hospitals, and other health care providers to participate in sex reassignment surgeries and treatments, even if doing so violates their moral and religious beliefs or their best medical judgment.
To what extent personal "moral and religious beliefs" should be allowed to shape how health care and society in general functions is another question.

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Dan74
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Re: Gender and Sexuality report

Post by Dan74 » Wed Aug 24, 2016 7:35 am

Mr Man wrote:
chownah wrote:
Mr Man wrote:I had taken Chownah's posts to be satirical.
I hope you enjoyed whatever humor you found in my posts. I assure you that they were not meant to be satirical.
chownah
Well when you said
I found it boring because I have no problems or expectations about my sex or gender nor about the sex or gender of others so for me this whole thing is a non issue.
I thought you were hinting at the reverse implication.

You also said
Seems pretty legit to me

Given the source of the article you had linked to (a catholic website republishing an article from a tea party website). Sources that I perceive to be fairly agenda driven

And
P.S. I found this in Yahoo science news


I thought you were drawing attention to how our positions are nowadays often formed/reinforced by a cursory search on the internet.

---

This, from the article you linked to, struck me
The regulations will force many physicians, hospitals, and other health care providers to participate in sex reassignment surgeries and treatments, even if doing so violates their moral and religious beliefs or their best medical judgment.
To what extent personal "moral and religious beliefs" should be allowed to shape how health care and society in general functions is another question.
:goodpost:

What a great commentary on how we read and form views, and this is chownah who is both well travelled intelligent and quite sensible. What hope does the humanity-at-large have I wonder...
_/|\_

chownah
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Joined: Wed Aug 12, 2009 2:19 pm

Re: Gender and Sexuality report

Post by chownah » Wed Aug 24, 2016 10:41 am

Dan74 wrote:
Mr Man wrote: Well when you said
I found it boring because I have no problems or expectations about my sex or gender nor about the sex or gender of others so for me this whole thing is a non issue.
I thought you were hinting at the reverse implication.

You also said
Seems pretty legit to me

Given the source of the article you had linked to (a catholic website republishing an article from a tea party website). Sources that I perceive to be fairly agenda driven

And
P.S. I found this in Yahoo science news


I thought you were drawing attention to how our positions are nowadays often formed/reinforced by a cursory search on the internet.

---

This, from the article you linked to, struck me
The regulations will force many physicians, hospitals, and other health care providers to participate in sex reassignment surgeries and treatments, even if doing so violates their moral and religious beliefs or their best medical judgment.
To what extent personal "moral and religious beliefs" should be allowed to shape how health care and society in general functions is another question.
:goodpost:

What a great commentary on how we read and form views, and this is chownah who is both well travelled intelligent and quite sensible. What hope does the humanity-at-large have I wonder...
Dan74,
I don't understand your comments. Can you please explain them?
chownah

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Dan74
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Re: Gender and Sexuality report

Post by Dan74 » Wed Aug 24, 2016 11:20 am

I've already engaged in meta-discussion, chownah, happy to continue in pm, but briefly I think it was about how we engage (or not) in issues such as these, read 'expert' opinion and form our own view.
_/|\_

chownah
Posts: 7419
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Re: Gender and Sexuality report

Post by chownah » Wed Aug 24, 2016 11:38 am

Mr Man wrote: You also said
Seems pretty legit to me

Given the source of the article you had linked to (a catholic website republishing an article from a tea party website). Sources that I perceive to be fairly agenda driven

And
P.S. I found this in Yahoo science news


I thought you were drawing attention to how our positions are nowadays often formed/reinforced by a cursory search on the internet.

---
Here is the portion of my previous post where you got the "seems pretty legit to me" quote:
Seems pretty legit to me...Johns Hopkins is pretty reputable I think. If people aren't sure then they could do a search on the authors and the journal they are being published in and see what you find but this is probably pretty unbiased I think.
chownah
P.S. I found this in Yahoo science news.
This comment is directed at the article which was presented in the OP which can be seen by my mentioning Johns Hopkins which is an affiliation of both of the authors. It is not a comment on the article which I found at yahoo news. I should have made this more obvious.
It is good that you are drawing attention to how our positions are nowadays often formed/reinforced by a cursory search on the internet. And your pointing out the origins of the yahoo article is also really excellent and something that people should check out more often especially when a controversial issue is being discussed. My own opinions on sex/gender issues has developed over a long period of time and after having been acquainted with people from many of the different possible sex/gender associations. Having known these people and having lightly tracked some of the research that has been done I find nothing controversial to get stirred up about....except for the attitudes of some people. That is why these things are basically a non-issue for me.

There is one issue I would like to find out about which is:
what is the outlook for surgical gender reassignment patients as the years go by. I am not willing to spend the time to try to find this info because as I have said gender/sexuality is a non issue for me....but I would be really interested in finding out something about how satisfied they are or how has their self image changed over time what medical side effects arise, etc.
chownah
edit: One issue is whether the article in the OP is biased or not. There are some links presented which assert that it is. I have taken a look at one of those and I want to be clear that I have not taken a position on what it says....but it seems to have some things which seem to be valid arguements and some things which are perhaps not so valid. Do you think that anyone on this forum is going to discuss possible biases in an unbiased way? I really doubt it. Seems that most people who post on these issues just want to argue for their view....but maybe I am wrong.

You have not expressed any opinions or provided any input on the OP's article at all except to comment. Do you have anything to say about it? Do you have a position on the state of bias in the OP's article?
chownah
Last edited by chownah on Wed Aug 24, 2016 11:50 am, edited 1 time in total.

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