Victims of Communism

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The Thinker
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Re: Victims of Communism

Postby The Thinker » Mon May 15, 2017 10:01 am

Both capitalism and communism are products of the mind, they are linked to the core, all political ideals are impermanent, socialism can exist for longer with right intention, unfortunately capitalism likes to remain ignorant of the truth and disables public services , whilst investing public( poor mans money) into their self interest and non moral goal?
"Watch your heart, observe. Be the observer, be the knower, not the condition" Ajahn Sumedho volume5 - The Wheel Of Truth

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Will
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Re: Victims of Communism

Postby Will » Sun Jul 16, 2017 11:06 pm

Anti-Nazism is common and accepted, yet anti-Communism is not very popular. Prager gives several reasons why this is so.

phpBB [video]
A man should not judge a man, for he harms himself very quickly, that man who judges a man.
Only I or someone like me can assess a man. --- Buddha in the Surangamasamadhi Sutra

Circle5
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Re: Victims of Communism

Postby Circle5 » Mon Jul 17, 2017 2:48 pm

That is a great video. As a victim of communism myself, I've been annoyed by this total lack of awareness about communism that I've seen particularly on buddhist forums. It feels like being a jew on a nazist forum.

I would suggest to those claiming "capitalism and liberal democracy also have blood on their hands" to go live in communism somewhere and see how it is. But I don't mean as a tourist staying there 7 days. Nope, you need to live there for a couple of years in 1.500$ pib per capita, with the posibility to end up in a labor camp or jail for almost anything, with every little aspect of your life controlled by the state, a state for which you are just a number, not a human.

Nazism was infinitely better than communism. First of all, it considered people humans not numbers. A government that considers you a number will bring a lot of problems, for example it might say "demolish these people houses and built a flatblock on top of them. Then, move these people in this flatblock in apartments as big as a box. And nope, they can't move to another neighbourhood cause they live close to this factory and we don't want to lose money with transportation of these drones. It they don't like it, put them in the labor camp.". Or it can say "this person is unemployed. Put this person in super toxic factory starting from tomorrow and if he doesn't like it, put him in the labor camp. We need this drone to be productive".

Besides being just a number with zero human rights, there is the problem of living in 1.500$ pib per capita. Being so poor is much worse than people think. It's not like you have a normal life just like in the west but you have this little starvation problem and that's all. Nope, you're having problems with every aspect of your life due to this 1.500$ pib per capita. For example your school is a hellhole. Your hospital is a hellhole. Your home is a hellhole. Your city is a hellhole.

But poverty was never the biggest issue in communism. It was a small problem compared to oppression. Imagine having every aspect of your life controled by the state. The books you are allowed to read being carefully selected. Your TV running just 2 hours a day of communist propaganda and very rarely, a communist propaganda movie. Imagine the risk of getting in the labor camp for anything, even trivial things or even unjustly. For example maybe you disturbed an important person and eneded up in the labor camp. Or maybe a neighbour that hates you lied something about you to the police. This was the biggest problem in communism, the constant fear that your life can be destroyed any moment, knowing there is no justice that could save you. Every neighbor or colleague at work you had was like a policeman, he would snitch to the police about that bad joke you said when you were drunk and get you in the labor camp. Even family members snitched on other family members. And at every job, at least one of the people was an undercover policeman.

And this were problems for normal people with "good roots". People with "bad roots" had it even worse. They could not get promoted at their jobs for example and were highly discriminated by the state. Communist killed or put in labor camps all rich people and intellectuals. If you were a son of an intellectual, you had "bad roots". Only people from peasant or working class family had "good roots" and possibility of getting promoted.

This is much worse than nazism. Nazism only killed a small part of intellectuals and rich people, only those that were jewsish. Communism killed all rich people and intellectuals indiscriminately of their ethnicity. That's one of the reasons why nazism only killed 6 million while communism killed 100 million. Nazism also did not impovrish people or make their life living hell. It also treated people like humans, not like numbers. There is no possibility of comparing nazism and communism in terms of evilness.
Last edited by Circle5 on Mon Jul 17, 2017 2:53 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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Will
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Re: Victims of Communism

Postby Will » Mon Jul 17, 2017 2:51 pm

Which 'workers paradise' nation did you live in Circle5?
A man should not judge a man, for he harms himself very quickly, that man who judges a man.
Only I or someone like me can assess a man. --- Buddha in the Surangamasamadhi Sutra

Circle5
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Re: Victims of Communism

Postby Circle5 » Mon Jul 17, 2017 3:10 pm

Romania, a western country at that time that had a functional democracy since 1862. Communism had 10% support when it was imposed on us by Russia. They also took Rep. Moldova from us and made it part of URSS. To this day Romania has not unified with Rep. Moldova as Germany has done because Russia does not allow it. And people are still claiming it's the US that are imperialist.... Western countries disolved their colonial empires after WW 2, Russia was the only power to enlarge it's colonial empire and even steal land from other independent states. It is the only power who still refuses to free it's colonies. And when was the last time we heard an anti-imperialist from US complain about this ?

Even after the fall of communism, there are huge problems that remain. Eastern european countries that switched to capitalism got to 10.000$ pib per capita which is better than 1.500$, but far away from western europe. And there are big problems with establishing a functional democracy. There is a bitter fight between corrupt oligarchs and reformist, anti-corruption forces that is not always won. Some times the pro-corruption forces win. And we are speaking here about estern europe that is part of the EU, the other part is in infinitely worse shape. For example Rep. Moldova and Ukraine continued with communist ideas and are standing today at 1.800$ pib per capita. A piece of africa in the middle of europe. And of course they are controlled by totally corrupt political forces.

Let us all imagine how this world would have been without communism. Look at how important a country like Japan is, economically, culturally, etc. for asia. Look at how important USA and EU are. Imagine if estern europe + Russia + China would be just like USA, EU or Japan. Wouldn't that be an incredible world ? Now we need to wait another 100 years for that and it's unlikely it will happen since Russia, China and a number of other countries have dictatorships that don't look like stepping down too soon. And a totalitarian system means big breaks on economic development due to corruption. They will never be like a western country.

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Dhammomhi
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Re: Victims of Communism

Postby Dhammomhi » Sat Jul 22, 2017 8:35 am

i wish i had the time or patience to read this entire thread, but i don't. however, the historical movement known as communism, while being diverse, is often very divergent from communism in political theory, which is also diverse; marx's theory greatly differs from bakunin's, whose also differs from kropotkin's. i would just say one ventures into wrong speech when lumping all theories and practices of communism into one conglomeration (there is a lot of nasty right-wing propaganda also out there)


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