Contemporary threats to free speech

A place to bring a contemplative / Dharmic perspective and opinions to current events and politics.
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retrofuturist
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Re: Contemporary threats to free speech

Post by retrofuturist » Fri Mar 17, 2017 11:02 am

Greetings pink_trike,

I'm not pretending anything. I said "within the parameters of the Terms of Service", and that's precisely where the line is drawn.

Also, it's worth remembering that David N Snyder is not obliged to provide anyone with a platform to speak. The ToS outline what speech he is prepared to host, and what he is not. It's not that complicated.

Lastly, I find the insinuation of "Orwellian modernspeak" to be rather faithless and unjustifiably cynical. I do understand that some people will complain wherever the line is drawn, but there is no deception or obfuscation here of what is permitted. In defining the Terms of Service we have been as transparent as possible for the benefit of both members and moderators.

Metta,
Paul. :)
"Do not force others, including children, by any means whatsoever, to adopt your views, whether by authority, threat, money, propaganda, or even education." - Ven. Thich Nhat Hanh

"The uprooting of identity is seen by the noble ones as pleasurable; but this contradicts what the whole world sees." (Snp 3.12)

"One discerns wrong view as wrong view, and right view as right view. This is one's right view." (MN 117)

chownah
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Re: Contemporary threats to free speech

Post by chownah » Fri Mar 17, 2017 12:15 pm

retrofuturist wrote:Greetings pink_trike,

I'm not pretending anything. I said "within the parameters of the Terms of Service", and that's precisely where the line is drawn.

Also, it's worth remembering that David N Snyder is not obliged to provide anyone with a platform to speak. The ToS outline what speech he is prepared to host, and what he is not. It's not that complicated.

Lastly, I find the insinuation of "Orwellian modernspeak" to be rather faithless and unjustifiably cynical. I do understand that some people will complain wherever the line is drawn, but there is no deception or obfuscation here of what is permitted. In defining the Terms of Service we have been as transparent as possible for the benefit of both members and moderators.

Metta,
Paul. :)
:goodpost:
The internet is a big place....room enough for anyone who wants to host what they think is a "truely free speech" forum.....good luck with that 'cause on the internet with "truely free speech" truely trolls rule.
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mikenz66
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Re: Contemporary threats to free speech

Post by mikenz66 » Fri Mar 17, 2017 8:41 pm

Yes a Free Speech forum would be a disaster. Useful forums are safe, supportive, places for respectful conversation about particular topics. More like halls or seminars than street corners.

:heart:
Mike

Buddha Vacana
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Re: Contemporary threats to free speech

Post by Buddha Vacana » Fri Mar 17, 2017 10:02 pm

Anyway the Buddha was never a die hard free speech proponent

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Re: Contemporary threats to free speech

Post by pink_trike » Sat Mar 18, 2017 5:54 am

retrofuturist wrote:Greetings pink_trike,

I'm not pretending anything. I said "within the parameters of the Terms of Service", and that's precisely where the line is drawn.

Also, it's worth remembering that David N Snyder is not obliged to provide anyone with a platform to speak. The ToS outline what speech he is prepared to host, and what he is not. It's not that complicated.

Lastly, I find the insinuation of "Orwellian modernspeak" to be rather faithless and unjustifiably cynical. I do understand that some people will complain wherever the line is drawn, but there is no deception or obfuscation here of what is permitted. In defining the Terms of Service we have been as transparent as possible for the benefit of both members and moderators.

Metta,
Paul. :)
I didn't dispute the need for Terms of Service that limit speech. I didn't complain about where the line is drawn. I didn't say that David is obliged to provide a free speech environment. I didn't say anything that implied discomfort or dislike of the TOS. I'm not sure why you're mentioning these things in your reply to me. This is what I said:

"The Terms of Service serves a purpose, but by no rational measure do they reflect what is standardly known and understood as 'freedom of speech'. Speech that is bound by terms that invoke silencing consequences obviously isn't 'free speech'."

My point was simply that speech that is regulated and terminated if exceeding the boundaries of regulation is by no stretch of imagination 'free speech". It defies the definition of free speech:

"The power or right to express one's opinions without censorship, restraint, or legal penalty."

To say, as you did, that there is free speech within the limits of the TOS (that clearly regulates, restrains, and penalizes) is, imo, Orwellian. Freedom of speech = regulated, restrained, and penalized speech. Why not call it what it is instead of turning language on it's head? :rolleye:
Vision is Mind
Mind is Empty
Emptiness is Clear Light
Clear Light is Union
Union is Great Bliss

- Dawa Gyaltsen

---

Disclaimer: I'm a non-religious practitioner of Theravada, Mahayana/Vajrayana, and Tibetan Bon Dzogchen mind-training.

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Re: Contemporary threats to free speech

Post by Phena » Sun Mar 19, 2017 9:26 am

Buddha Vacana wrote:Anyway the Buddha was never a die hard free speech proponent
Yes, he was more of an appropriate speech proponent.

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Re: Contemporary threats to free speech

Post by Buddha Vacana » Fri Apr 07, 2017 6:41 pm

The U.S. government has withdrawn its request ordering Twitter to identify a Trump critic
The legal battle between Twitter and the U.S. government is over, after the Department of Homeland Security withdrew its demand that the tech company release information to identify an account holder whose tweets are critical of President Trump on Twitter.

The tech company had filed a lawsuit Thursday to protest that order, saying that it violated the user's First Amendment right to free expression. Twitter confirmed Friday that it has dropped its suit. According to a Friday court filing, "[because] the summons has now been withdrawn, Twitter voluntary dismisses without prejudice all claims."

The Department of Homeland Security did not immediately respond to a request for comment.

Twitter filed the suit to protect the identity of a user who runs the @ALT_uscis feed -- an account that purports to tweet the thoughts of a federal worker from the U.S. Citizenship and Immigration Services. The two-month-old account is often critical of the Trump administration's immigration policies, particularly its plans to build a wall along the border with Mexico and its immigration travel ban.

Legal experts said that Twitter would have had a strong case had it gone to court, as the government had not provided compelling information on why it was necessary to identify the critic.

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Re: Contemporary threats to free speech

Post by retrofuturist » Sat Apr 08, 2017 12:16 pm

Greetings,

A couple of unfortunate incidents, from this week in Australia...

Palestinian activist's Australian visa cancelled on eve of speaking tour

Ayaan Hirsi Ali cancels Australian tour citing security concerns

Metta,
Paul. :)
"Do not force others, including children, by any means whatsoever, to adopt your views, whether by authority, threat, money, propaganda, or even education." - Ven. Thich Nhat Hanh

"The uprooting of identity is seen by the noble ones as pleasurable; but this contradicts what the whole world sees." (Snp 3.12)

"One discerns wrong view as wrong view, and right view as right view. This is one's right view." (MN 117)

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Re: Contemporary threats to free speech

Post by mikenz66 » Sat Apr 08, 2017 9:45 pm

Hmm...

Over this side of the ditch:
Rafeef Ziadah - Shades of anger

Rafeef Ziadah is a Palestinian spoken word poet and human rights activist born in Beirut, raised across several countries as a result of being one of thousands of stateless Palestinians; tertiary educated in Canada, she now lives in London. Her poems reflect both frustration and sorrow at the Palestinian struggle against occupation. The performances of her poems We Teach Life, Sir and Shades of Anger became viral sensations shortly after being released. Ziadah is in New Zealand for events in Christchurch, Wellington and Auckland (7th, 8th and 9th of April), where she will perform her work backed by original music compositions by Phil Monsour, and supported by local poets and Palestinian Dabke dancers.

http://www.radionz.co.nz/national/progr ... s-of-anger
We Teach Life:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aKucPh9xHtM

:heart:
Mike

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Re: Contemporary threats to free speech

Post by chownah » Fri Apr 21, 2017 3:16 pm

There is not much published biy the New York Post that I agree with but I think this article is worth a read.

If US campuses can’t protect free speech, they need new management
http://nypost.com/2017/04/20/if-us-camp ... anagement/

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Re: Contemporary threats to free speech

Post by cjmacie » Mon Apr 24, 2017 2:14 pm


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Re: Contemporary threats to free speech

Post by retrofuturist » Tue Apr 25, 2017 11:55 pm

Greetings,

Sean Hannity standing up to slander and other authoritarian attempts to harangue and silence conservative opinion...
Sean Hannity wrote:I have to start by addressing a well-orchestrated effort by the intolerant left in this country that is designed to silence every conservative voice and by any means necessary. Now, I’m speaking out tonight so that you, our audience, will understand what is really happening and what is at stake when it comes to freedom of speech in this country. Now, these tactics are right out of Saul Alinsky’s “Rule for Radicals” playbook.

Now, I’ve worked for radio for 30 years. I’ve been right here at the Fox News Channel for 21-and-a-half years. I’m very proud of that and during this time, there’ve always been efforts and attempts to smear and slander and besmirch me and other conservatives. But it has never been as intense and completely insane as it is right now.

Now, I want you to understand, every single minute, every single second I am on the air — radio, TV — there is somebody likely being paid, recording and monitoring every single word that comes out of my mouth all in the hopes that I may see something they can twist and distort and use against me and try to destroy my reputation and get my conservative voice off the air.

Now, it has only gotten worse in the age of President Trump. Now, it’s no secret I have been a supporter of the president and of course his policies. And quite simply, these liberal fascists — they can’t stand conservative voices.

Now for those of you who don’t know me well, I have a pretty thick skin. I call out people, I say things I give my point of view four hours a day. And for all these years, there has been this an unrelenting attack against me. But in light of recent events, I’ve come to the conclusion I can no longer remain silent and I can no longer let the left slander against me slide.

So, from now on, I want you to be informed of what I am doing and why I’m doing it. If there’s any person or group or any organization, any media outlet that slanders, lies about me, besmirch me and my character, I am going to be calling them out. At this point, enough is enough.

I have hired a team of some of the best attorneys in this country to work with me and on my behalf. Now, the breaking point came this weekend when an individual for over a decade has made the most outrageous, unfair, untrue allegations against me has now resurfaced making ridiculous and completely untrue claims.

Now, this person went on a radio show on Friday and made more unfounded accusations against me, which this person is now interestingly recanting after I made my statement, but it was only after I responded to these baseless and false smears. This is not the first time I have had to deal with this individual.

Now, this person has repeatedly spread lies about me. I’ll give you an example. Back in 2010, I was raising money for the Freedom Alliance, a charity that offers college scholarships to the children of killed veterans and their families. And in a blog post, the individual falsely accused me and members of the charity of skimming and stealing money that was donated.

This of course was easily proven false. And, in spite of the fact that we proved each and every single allegation to be untrue and inaccurate at the time, I was never given an apology. There is no correction that was issued.

Now, this person has made another slander accusation, and in response, I released this statement, which now the press has picked up, and I will read it for you:

"Let me be clear. The comments about me on a radio show this week by this individual are 100 percent false and a complete fabrication. This individual is a serial harasser who has been lying about me for well over a decade. The individual has a history of making provably false statements to get against me in an effort to slander, smear and besmirch my reputation.

The individual is not just slandered me over the years but also many people who this individual disagrees with. This individual desperately seeks attention by any means necessary including making unfounded personal attacks and using indefensible and outrageous political rhetoric.

My patience with this individual is over. I have retained a team of some of the finest and toughest lawyers in the country who are now in the process of laying out the legal course of action we will be taking against this individual.

Now, in this fiercely divided and vindictive climate, I will no longer allow slander to go unchallenged, as I see this to be a coordinated effort afoot to silence those with conservative views.

I will fight every single lie about me about any and all legal means available to me as an American."

Now, I want you to know, my audience, the importance of what is happening here. This is not about Sean Hannity. This is not about one person. There is now a coordinated attempt to silence the voice of every outspoken conservative in this country.

If we don’t stop it right now, there won’t be any conservative voices on radio or television left. Now, I’m not the only one that these liberal fascist routinely targeted. Like me, conservatives are monitored on radio and TV, every word they say — contrary to the alt radical left stated position — they’re so open-minded, liberals.

Not true. Liberal fascism is alive and well in America today. Their goal is simple: They want to shut up and shut down and silence all conservative voices by any means necessary.

Here is the difference: Unlike the left, I don’t have any problem with what the other side says. If you want to listen to liberals on radio or TV, read their articles, follow them on social media, go for it.

Now, I’ll call them out for the bias. I will explain why they were wrong. I will debate them. But I will never, ever say they should be silenced. And I won’t support boycotts to attack their advertisers, a roundabout way of silencing them.

So let me be clear tonight, everyone who is publicly supporting President Trump is a target. This is very political. We have seen repeatedly that the left knows no limits in these efforts.

They have gone after and attacked the first lady. They have attacked members of the president’s family, every White House advisor. They’ve even attacked his daughter and his 10-year-old son.

Now, ultimately their goal is to cause as much collateral damage as they can to anybody that supports the president. They have tried to undermine the outcome of this election since November 9.

Please note, this is not about me. This is about the left concocting boycotts all in an attempt to silence prominent conservative voices. If we don’t take a stand now, if we allow this to happen now, I am telling you, America as we know it — freedom of speech as we know it is over. Let’s stop the boycotts and its silencing of opposition voices.

Let all of Americans make their own decisions.
Metta,
Paul. :)
"Do not force others, including children, by any means whatsoever, to adopt your views, whether by authority, threat, money, propaganda, or even education." - Ven. Thich Nhat Hanh

"The uprooting of identity is seen by the noble ones as pleasurable; but this contradicts what the whole world sees." (Snp 3.12)

"One discerns wrong view as wrong view, and right view as right view. This is one's right view." (MN 117)

chownah
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Re: Contemporary threats to free speech

Post by chownah » Wed Apr 26, 2017 1:20 pm

Good that hannnity talks about free speech....bad that he weaponizes the discussion and then uses it for political purposes.....makes me wonder how sincere he is.
chownah

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Re: Contemporary threats to free speech

Post by retrofuturist » Thu Apr 27, 2017 12:44 am

Greetings,

Those ‘Snowflakes’ Have Chilling Effects Even Beyond the Campus
Academic intolerance is the product of ideological aggression, not a psychological disorder.
Student thuggery against non-leftist viewpoints is in the news again. Agitators at Claremont McKenna College, Middlebury College, and the University of California’s Berkeley and Los Angeles campuses have used threats, brute force and sometimes criminal violence over the past two months...
Campus intolerance is at root not a psychological phenomenon but an ideological one. At its center is a worldview that sees Western culture as endemically racist and sexist. The overriding goal of the educational establishment is to teach young people within the ever-growing list of official victim classifications to view themselves as existentially oppressed. One outcome of that teaching is the forceful silencing of contrarian speech.

...

Many observers dismiss such ignorant tantrums as a phase that will end once the “snowflakes” encounter the real world. But the graduates of the academic victimology complex are remaking the world in their image. The assumption of inevitable discrimination against women and minorities plagues every nonacademic institution today, resulting in hiring and promotion based on sex and race at the expense of merit.

...

Faculty and campus administrators must start defending the Enlightenment legacy of reason and civil debate. But even if dissenting thought were welcome on college campuses, the ideology of victimhood would still wreak havoc on American society and civil harmony. The silencing of speech is a massive problem, but it is a symptom of an even more profound distortion of reality.
Metta,
Paul. :)
"Do not force others, including children, by any means whatsoever, to adopt your views, whether by authority, threat, money, propaganda, or even education." - Ven. Thich Nhat Hanh

"The uprooting of identity is seen by the noble ones as pleasurable; but this contradicts what the whole world sees." (Snp 3.12)

"One discerns wrong view as wrong view, and right view as right view. This is one's right view." (MN 117)

pulga
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Re: Contemporary threats to free speech

Post by pulga » Thu Apr 27, 2017 1:55 am

With Ann Coulter's cancellation to talk at UC-Berkeley, I wonder whether Milo might be having second thoughts about his visit to the city next week.

Milo Yiannopoulos planning multi-day event in Berkeley 5/5

He seems to be as provocative as ever.

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