The teachings of Ven. Waharaka Abhayaratanalankara Thero

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SarathW
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Re: The teachings of Ven. Waharaka Abhayaratanalankara Thero

Post by SarathW » Thu Aug 30, 2018 11:54 pm

We should message PureDhamma
PureDhamma is Lal's website.
“As the lamp consumes oil, the path realises Nibbana”

SarathW
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Re: The teachings of Ven. Waharaka Abhayaratanalankara Thero

Post by SarathW » Thu Aug 30, 2018 11:57 pm

But the Buddha said that Nibbana exists
But Buddha warned not to objectified it.
“As the lamp consumes oil, the path realises Nibbana”

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Coëmgenu
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Re: The teachings of Ven. Waharaka Abhayaratanalankara Thero

Post by Coëmgenu » Fri Aug 31, 2018 12:01 am

SarathW wrote:
Thu Aug 30, 2018 11:54 pm
We should message PureDhamma
PureDhamma is Lal's website.
...coincidence?

I do hope Lal corrects that page. So he doesn't accidentally quote from it again.

The typo is here

https://puredhamma.net/key-hidden-dhamm ... ical-link/
如無為,如是難見、不動、不屈、不死、無漏、覆蔭、洲渚、濟渡、依止、擁護、不流轉、離熾焰、離燒然、流通、清涼、微妙、安隱、無病、無所有、涅槃。
Like this is the uncreated, like this is that which is difficult to realize, with no moving, no bending, no dying. Utterly lacking secretions and smothered in the dark, it is the island shore. Where there is ferrying, it is the crossing. It is dependency's ceasing, it is the end of circulating transmissions. It is the exhaustion of the flame, it is the ending of the burning. Flowing openly, pure and cool, with secret subtlety, and calm occultation, lacking ailment, lacking owning, nirvāṇa.
Asaṁskṛtadharmasūtra, Sermon on the Uncreated Phenomenon, T99.224b7, Saṁyuktāgama 890

James Tan
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Re: The teachings of Ven. Waharaka Abhayaratanalankara Thero

Post by James Tan » Fri Aug 31, 2018 2:54 am

Coëmgenu wrote:
Thu Aug 30, 2018 11:13 pm
Lal wrote:
Thu Aug 30, 2018 6:00 pm
Nicolas said, regarding what is meant by “sabbe dhammā anattā?”:
No dhammas are you, no dhammas belong to you, you are not in any dhamma, etc.
Wow. That sounds like a Zen riddle! That is all I can say about that.
Sounds like Theravāda Buddhism to me.
Lal wrote:
In the mean time, I made a mistake saying "Here is the problem: The sutta begins with: "katamo ca bhikkhave, anattō?"

That is not how the sutta starts. It starts as: "“Atthañca vo, bhikkhave, desessāmi anatthañca. Taṃ suṇātha … pe … katamo ca, bhikkhave, anattho?" I had just copied the relevant part from the sutta.
How did you cut and paste that text and still manage to conveniently delete an H to match your line of argumentation?

From :
https://puredhamma.net/key-hidden-dhamm ... ical-link/



14. Note that atta is sometimes spelled out as “attha” (with an “h”) in many texts and each may imply mundane or deeper meaning. For example, the old Sinhala commentaries are called “atthakathā“. It means “accounts about the truth” (“kathā” means “story”)


PS :
You can notice how they equating it with the sinhalese where they Inserted an H , according to their website . This is not a matter of typo .
:reading:

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Coëmgenu
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Re: The teachings of Ven. Waharaka Abhayaratanalankara Thero

Post by Coëmgenu » Fri Aug 31, 2018 3:56 am

James Tan wrote:
Fri Aug 31, 2018 2:54 am
You can notice how they equating it with the sinhalese where they Inserted an H , according to their website . This is not a matter of typo .
I know. Unfortunately the moderation here would rather protect them and let them continue to publish fake Buddhavacana with Sinhala-inspired typos here.

I should just start pushing Mahayana Buddhavacana here. It's just as fake as this stuff. We'll see how quickly I get shut down.

I reported his falsification to the moderators, but alas. With the knowledge that they have the blessing of the moderation staff to spread their unique interpretations, I am off. Yet another reason not to use this forum as a resource.
如無為,如是難見、不動、不屈、不死、無漏、覆蔭、洲渚、濟渡、依止、擁護、不流轉、離熾焰、離燒然、流通、清涼、微妙、安隱、無病、無所有、涅槃。
Like this is the uncreated, like this is that which is difficult to realize, with no moving, no bending, no dying. Utterly lacking secretions and smothered in the dark, it is the island shore. Where there is ferrying, it is the crossing. It is dependency's ceasing, it is the end of circulating transmissions. It is the exhaustion of the flame, it is the ending of the burning. Flowing openly, pure and cool, with secret subtlety, and calm occultation, lacking ailment, lacking owning, nirvāṇa.
Asaṁskṛtadharmasūtra, Sermon on the Uncreated Phenomenon, T99.224b7, Saṁyuktāgama 890

justindesilva
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Re: The teachings of Ven. Waharaka Abhayaratanalankara Thero

Post by justindesilva » Fri Aug 31, 2018 4:20 am

Coëmgenu wrote:
Fri Aug 31, 2018 3:56 am
James Tan wrote:
Fri Aug 31, 2018 2:54 am
You can notice how they equating it with the sinhalese where they Inserted an H , according to their website . This is not a matter of typo .
I know. Unfortunately the moderation here would rather protect them and let them continue to publish fake Buddhavacana with Sinhala-inspired typos here.

I should just start pushing Mahayana Buddhavacana here. It's just as fake as this stuff. We'll see how quickly I get shut down.

I reported his falsification to the moderators, but alas. With the knowledge that they have the blessing of the moderation staff to spread their unique interpretations, I am off. Yet another reason not to use this forum as a resource.
There are many highly qualified buddhist priests who argue with Waharaka abayalankara system effeciently. Yet Lal and the clan keep going. The buddhists who support this new version are not many. On u tube many argue cleverly on the falsifications of this Waharaka explanations on anicca and anatta.

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Coëmgenu
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Re: The teachings of Ven. Waharaka Abhayaratanalankara Thero

Post by Coëmgenu » Fri Aug 31, 2018 4:34 am

justindesilva wrote:
Fri Aug 31, 2018 4:20 am
Coëmgenu wrote:
Fri Aug 31, 2018 3:56 am
James Tan wrote:
Fri Aug 31, 2018 2:54 am
You can notice how they equating it with the sinhalese where they Inserted an H , according to their website . This is not a matter of typo .
I know. Unfortunately the moderation here would rather protect them and let them continue to publish fake Buddhavacana with Sinhala-inspired typos here.

I should just start pushing Mahayana Buddhavacana here. It's just as fake as this stuff. We'll see how quickly I get shut down.

I reported his falsification to the moderators, but alas. With the knowledge that they have the blessing of the moderation staff to spread their unique interpretations, I am off. Yet another reason not to use this forum as a resource.
There are many highly qualified buddhist priests who argue with Waharaka abayalankara system effeciently. Yet Lal and the clan keep going. The buddhists who support this new version are not many. On u tube many argue cleverly on the falsifications of this Waharaka explanations on anicca and anatta.
Hmmmm. Sounds like Pure Damna to me.
如無為,如是難見、不動、不屈、不死、無漏、覆蔭、洲渚、濟渡、依止、擁護、不流轉、離熾焰、離燒然、流通、清涼、微妙、安隱、無病、無所有、涅槃。
Like this is the uncreated, like this is that which is difficult to realize, with no moving, no bending, no dying. Utterly lacking secretions and smothered in the dark, it is the island shore. Where there is ferrying, it is the crossing. It is dependency's ceasing, it is the end of circulating transmissions. It is the exhaustion of the flame, it is the ending of the burning. Flowing openly, pure and cool, with secret subtlety, and calm occultation, lacking ailment, lacking owning, nirvāṇa.
Asaṁskṛtadharmasūtra, Sermon on the Uncreated Phenomenon, T99.224b7, Saṁyuktāgama 890

James Tan
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Re: The teachings of Ven. Waharaka Abhayaratanalankara Thero

Post by James Tan » Fri Aug 31, 2018 5:00 am

Coëmgenu wrote:
Fri Aug 31, 2018 3:56 am
James Tan wrote:
Fri Aug 31, 2018 2:54 am
You can notice how they equating it with the sinhalese where they Inserted an H , according to their website . This is not a matter of typo .
I know. Unfortunately the moderation here would rather protect them and let them continue to publish fake Buddhavacana with Sinhala-inspired typos here.

I should just start pushing Mahayana Buddhavacana here. It's just as fake as this stuff. We'll see how quickly I get shut down.

I reported his falsification to the moderators, but alas. With the knowledge that they have the blessing of the moderation staff to spread their unique interpretations, I am off. Yet another reason not to use this forum as a resource.
I think this is not about different schools Thought problem , it is about translation ! And the followers could be Misled and mistaken for it.

Dhamma Wheel site has a sister forum Dharma wheel for Mahayana and Vajrayana , to be fair , they are quite liberal to accommodate differences .
Although I don't like moderation over there which is worst than I expected .
Of course , in term of Authenticity Resources that is another matter . Flexibility here is better than sutta site no offense imo .

Sometimes , we need to be considerate for others as long as they are not out of evil intention but we may think they are Misled in certain ways. Give people some chances even at the end they still stick to their opinion .
We don't know in the future if they could alter their perspectives .
:reading:

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Coëmgenu
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Re: The teachings of Ven. Waharaka Abhayaratanalankara Thero

Post by Coëmgenu » Fri Aug 31, 2018 5:50 am

James Tan wrote:
Fri Aug 31, 2018 5:00 am
Coëmgenu wrote:
Fri Aug 31, 2018 3:56 am
James Tan wrote:
Fri Aug 31, 2018 2:54 am
You can notice how they equating it with the sinhalese where they Inserted an H , according to their website . This is not a matter of typo .
I know. Unfortunately the moderation here would rather protect them and let them continue to publish fake Buddhavacana with Sinhala-inspired typos here.

I should just start pushing Mahayana Buddhavacana here. It's just as fake as this stuff. We'll see how quickly I get shut down.

I reported his falsification to the moderators, but alas. With the knowledge that they have the blessing of the moderation staff to spread their unique interpretations, I am off. Yet another reason not to use this forum as a resource.
I think this is not about different schools Thought problem , it is about translation ! And the followers could be Misled and mistaken for it.

Dhamma Wheel site has a sister forum Dharma wheel for Mahayana and Vajrayana , to be fair , they are quite liberal to accommodate differences .
Although I don't like moderation over there which is worst than I expected .
Of course , in term of Authenticity Resources that is another matter . Flexibility here is better than sutta site no offense imo .

Sometimes , we need to be considerate for others as long as they are not out of evil intention but we may think they are Misled in certain ways. Give people some chances even at the end they still stick to their opinion .
We don't know in the future if they could alter their perspectives .
It makes sense for Mahāyānikāḥ to be more loosey goosey with their Buddhavacana. The Buddha, to a Mahāyānika, is a consensus of a group of people (i.e. the Buddhas, in the plural). To the older tradition, the Buddha is a particular historical person who did and did not say certain things.
如無為,如是難見、不動、不屈、不死、無漏、覆蔭、洲渚、濟渡、依止、擁護、不流轉、離熾焰、離燒然、流通、清涼、微妙、安隱、無病、無所有、涅槃。
Like this is the uncreated, like this is that which is difficult to realize, with no moving, no bending, no dying. Utterly lacking secretions and smothered in the dark, it is the island shore. Where there is ferrying, it is the crossing. It is dependency's ceasing, it is the end of circulating transmissions. It is the exhaustion of the flame, it is the ending of the burning. Flowing openly, pure and cool, with secret subtlety, and calm occultation, lacking ailment, lacking owning, nirvāṇa.
Asaṁskṛtadharmasūtra, Sermon on the Uncreated Phenomenon, T99.224b7, Saṁyuktāgama 890

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DooDoot
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Re: The teachings of Ven. Waharaka Abhayaratanalankara Thero

Post by DooDoot » Fri Aug 31, 2018 5:54 am

SarathW wrote:
Thu Aug 30, 2018 11:57 pm
But Buddha warned not to objectified it.
Where? :shrug:

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mikenz66
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Re: The teachings of Ven. Waharaka Abhayaratanalankara Thero

Post by mikenz66 » Fri Aug 31, 2018 5:59 am

Hi Coëmgenu,
Coëmgenu wrote:
Fri Aug 31, 2018 3:56 am
I reported his falsification to the moderators, but alas. With the knowledge that they have the blessing of the moderation staff to spread their unique interpretations, I am off. Yet another reason not to use this forum as a resource.
We really should return to the topic, but I would like to emphasise that the moderation policy here is that we don't adjudicate over doctrinal points. The policy is that we leave it up to members to discuss doctrinal points (as long as it is polite and without personal attacks and so on).

It would not be practical to adjudicate over doctrine, even if we wanted to. Members here follow a range of interpretations of Dhamma, ranging from strict adherence to the Classical Commentaries, through a variety of modern interpretations, of which Ven. Waharaka Abhayaratanalankara Thero's interepretation is just one of many. Mention any of the famous modern teachers/commentators/translators and you will find some members who think that they are misguided and others who think that they have the only true interpretation of the Dhamma.

Various members have pointed out their objections to Ven. Waharaka Abhayaratanalankara Thero's and/or Lal's interpretations of them. That should allow other interested members to make up their own mind.

:heart:
Mike

Lal
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Re: The teachings of Ven. Waharaka Abhayaratanalankara Thero

Post by Lal » Fri Aug 31, 2018 6:02 am

I can see that I am unwittingly contributing to piling up a lot of anger and thus more and more Ariya upavada in many people here. So, I will stop participating in this forum.

I just want to say that I did not barge in to this forum. I was invited by David Snyder initially to participate in the Dhammawheel forums in general; I stopped for a while when I faced a similar situation as now. Then later on, I was again asked by the Sudheethadheera Thero from Sri Lanka to help out with the questions on this particular thread, because he received a request from someone commenting on this thread.

Hopefully, at least some people will benefit from what I have written.

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Coëmgenu
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Re: The teachings of Ven. Waharaka Abhayaratanalankara Thero

Post by Coëmgenu » Fri Aug 31, 2018 6:02 am

mikenz66 wrote:
Fri Aug 31, 2018 5:59 am
Hi Coëmgenu,
Coëmgenu wrote:
Fri Aug 31, 2018 3:56 am
I reported his falsification to the moderators, but alas. With the knowledge that they have the blessing of the moderation staff to spread their unique interpretations, I am off. Yet another reason not to use this forum as a resource.
We really should return to the topic, but I would like to emphasise that the moderation policy here is that we don't adjudicate over doctrinal points. The policy is that we leave it up to members to discuss doctrinal points (as long as it is polite and without personal attacks and so on).

It would not be practical to adjudicate over doctrine, even if we wanted to. Members here follow a range of interpretations of Dhamma, ranging from strict adherence to the Classical Commentaries, through a variety of modern interpretations, of which Ven. Waharaka Abhayaratanalankara Thero's interepretation is just one of many. Mention any of the famous modern teachers/commentators/translators and you will find some members who think that they are misguided and others who think that they have the only true interpretation of the Dhamma.

Various members have pointed out their objections to Ven. Waharaka Abhayaratanalankara Thero's and/or Lal's interpretations of them. That should allow other interested members to make up their own mind.

:heart:
Mike
The issue was the lying. He changed the Pāli words to suit his ends. It's not really an issue of interpretation of doctrine.

I am going to start subtly doctoring my Pāli and we'll see if anyone stops me. Maybe I'll start pretending Mahayana scriptures are suttas.
Last edited by Coëmgenu on Fri Aug 31, 2018 6:18 am, edited 1 time in total.
如無為,如是難見、不動、不屈、不死、無漏、覆蔭、洲渚、濟渡、依止、擁護、不流轉、離熾焰、離燒然、流通、清涼、微妙、安隱、無病、無所有、涅槃。
Like this is the uncreated, like this is that which is difficult to realize, with no moving, no bending, no dying. Utterly lacking secretions and smothered in the dark, it is the island shore. Where there is ferrying, it is the crossing. It is dependency's ceasing, it is the end of circulating transmissions. It is the exhaustion of the flame, it is the ending of the burning. Flowing openly, pure and cool, with secret subtlety, and calm occultation, lacking ailment, lacking owning, nirvāṇa.
Asaṁskṛtadharmasūtra, Sermon on the Uncreated Phenomenon, T99.224b7, Saṁyuktāgama 890

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DooDoot
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Re: The teachings of Ven. Waharaka Abhayaratanalankara Thero

Post by DooDoot » Fri Aug 31, 2018 6:04 am

Lal wrote:
Fri Aug 31, 2018 6:02 am
I can see that I am unwittingly contributing to piling up a lot of anger...
Maybe change your attitude & post with joy & non-attachment; enjoying the spirit of discussion, debate & different views. :smile:

SarathW
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Re: The teachings of Ven. Waharaka Abhayaratanalankara Thero

Post by SarathW » Fri Aug 31, 2018 8:04 am

DooDoot wrote:
Fri Aug 31, 2018 6:04 am
Lal wrote:
Fri Aug 31, 2018 6:02 am
I can see that I am unwittingly contributing to piling up a lot of anger...
Maybe change your attitude & post with joy & non-attachment; enjoying the spirit of discussion, debate & different views. :smile:
Agree.
Nobody has to quit the forum.
This is just another view.
It is not I me or myself.
Last edited by SarathW on Fri Aug 31, 2018 8:15 am, edited 1 time in total.
“As the lamp consumes oil, the path realises Nibbana”

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