Yes, but no worries. Drugs will continue to be brought up ad infinitum on this forum alongside threads about rebirth, anatta, Nibbana, Mahayana vs. Theravada, and vegetarianism.Dhammomhi wrote:if this has been covered
Am I missing anything?
Yes, but no worries. Drugs will continue to be brought up ad infinitum on this forum alongside threads about rebirth, anatta, Nibbana, Mahayana vs. Theravada, and vegetarianism.Dhammomhi wrote:if this has been covered
Dhammomhi wrote:not really... i'm just so excited about my discoveries
if i didnt already say this i think using acid was a distraction that i've since recovered from
may all living beings be happy
I think that this is just about equivalent to saying that the wine in the sacrament in the communion ritual at the catholic church is equivalent to rampant unabashed alcoholism.Maitri wrote:Dhammomhi wrote:not really... i'm just so excited about my discoveries
if i didnt already say this i think using acid was a distraction that i've since recovered from
may all living beings be happy
Pfft, acid. I'm drunk on Kombucha right now
https://www.vice.com/en_us/article/mvx4 ... mbucha-511
Maitri wrote:I think that too many in the West get wrapped up in fitting the rules to themselves in a legalism borrowed from Christianity. The majority of Buddhists in the West are lay people and don't have to live the strict moral life of monastics. The rules aren't for punishment like the Mosaic law, but to train ourselves to develop greater wisdom and compassion.
Yes, the precepts do not permit intoxicants and coming from the Buddha we can have total confidence that following this precept is the best way to live. However, we can also relax a bit about the 5th precept and see it as training tools which lead to deeper insight and confidence in the Dhamma. Of course, I'm not talking about becoming drunk, stoned, or smashed all the time, but enjoying a glass of wine or a beer with friends isn't going to ruin our practice.
I'm wondering what your ideas are about what makes something unvirtuous and more specifically what is virtue and does this come from the buddha's teachings....or not.maranadhammomhi wrote:Maitri wrote:I think that too many in the West get wrapped up in fitting the rules to themselves in a legalism borrowed from Christianity. The majority of Buddhists in the West are lay people and don't have to live the strict moral life of monastics. The rules aren't for punishment like the Mosaic law, but to train ourselves to develop greater wisdom and compassion.
Yes, the precepts do not permit intoxicants and coming from the Buddha we can have total confidence that following this precept is the best way to live. However, we can also relax a bit about the 5th precept and see it as training tools which lead to deeper insight and confidence in the Dhamma. Of course, I'm not talking about becoming drunk, stoned, or smashed all the time, but enjoying a glass of wine or a beer with friends isn't going to ruin our practice.
Yes it will, unvirtuous & unskillful action will ruin our practice, virtue & the 5 precepts are the most basic standard expected of Buddhists & there is no reason they should not be undertaken. They are wholesome, their results are wholesome. Breaking them is unwholesome & so is its results.
I can't talk about your practice but I gave up a glass of wine or a beer with friends because at a certain point I began to see that that amount of alcohol did have a detrimental effect on my practice. I don't know if it was me becoming more sensitive to alcohol because of my practice or if it was because I went without alcohol long enough to become sensitive to its effects or if it was just a sensitivity which arose due to my body getting older.....but the fact is I could clearly see the negative effects of even one beer on my practice.enjoying a glass of wine or a beer with friends isn't going to ruin our practice.
i don't and i want to lose desire for such thingsmassara wrote:Well, if you want to drink, have hallucinations and enjoy sensual pleasures, go ahead and tell us how you intend to reach at least Anagami stage...
If all you want is just to live a better and peaceful life, that`s fine, but if what you want is to reach Nibbana, then you must follow the 5th precept and give up all these things.
The precept does cover a wider range than simply Alcohol with the clarifier "that lead to carelessness" and I understand the rule to mean "Recreational intoxicants that lead to carelessness" not using things as medically needed or for preservative means (which is an exception in the Vinaya).Dhammomhi wrote:it seems many jump on the line, interpreting the 5th precept to be more than just alcohol (fermented drinks), but to me there is a clear translation; there were drugs in the buddha's time, so i believe he would have stated clearly 'no drink and/or drugs'. and dont get me wrong, mind-altering drugs and drugs taken out of compulsion (i dont know if we should find disagreeable medicinal marijuana in all cases) are bad; i know all too well. just saying i think there is a reason he said alcohol and not alcohol/drugs....
if this has been covered delete the topic no worries or if i posted in wrong section let me know thx
EDIT: some great dialectics occurred and at this time now i believe all psychoactive drugs to violate the 5th precept, at least if taken for recreation (a layperson's 'enlightenment' quest is probably fake) https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Psychoactive_drug
lyndon taylor wrote:The wisdom of the Buddha's precept is very obvious to me, with 9 years of sobriety, my life has improved tenfold, I can't begin to express how important sobriety is for growth, I don't apply sobriety to things like coffee or even cigarettes, but there's no way I can classify marijuana as not an intoxicant, even medical marijuana uses should be the treatment of last resort, not the first thing you go to for. IMHO
1 year today for me!dharmacorps wrote:lyndon taylor wrote:The wisdom of the Buddha's precept is very obvious to me, with 9 years of sobriety, my life has improved tenfold, I can't begin to express how important sobriety is for growth, I don't apply sobriety to things like coffee or even cigarettes, but there's no way I can classify marijuana as not an intoxicant, even medical marijuana uses should be the treatment of last resort, not the first thing you go to for. IMHO
very well said. 4 years here