Antaradhana wrote: ↑Tue Jul 09, 2019 1:30 pm
budo wrote: ↑Tue Jul 09, 2019 1:05 pm
Antaradhana wrote: ↑Tue Jul 09, 2019 1:00 pm
Seeing light means access concentration.
According to whom?
This is indicated by many teachers, for example, Achan Li Dhammadharo.
If it's not in the suttas, then it's just speculation.
Antaradhana wrote: ↑Tue Jul 09, 2019 1:30 pm
Seeing light comes later and stabilizes around fourth jhana
According to whom?
According to the suttas.
We do know is that there are nimittas:
Samatha nimitta & Abyagga nimitta which arise together and lead to one pointedness and that Cittassa nimittaṃ comes after, which I already quoted first comes pleasure, then comes patterns of the mind (cittassa nimitta)
We know that the stock formula is:
"When he is gladdened, joy is born in him; being joyous in mind, his body becomes tranquil; his body being tranquil, he feels happiness; and the mind of him who is happy becomes concentrated.[9]"
"Conviction has stress & suffering as its prerequisite, joy has conviction as its prerequisite, rapture has joy as its prerequisite, serenity has rapture as its prerequisite, pleasure has serenity as its prerequisite, concentration has pleasure as its prerequisite, knowledge & vision of things as they actually are present has concentration as its prerequisite, disenchantment has knowledge & vision of things as they actually are present as its prerequisite, dispassion has disenchantment as its prerequisite, release has dispassion as its prerequisite, knowledge of ending has release as its prerequisite."
Piti -> Passadhi -> Sukha -> Jhanas -> Knowledge and Vision
And what fuels the arising of the awakening factor of immersion, or, when it has arisen, fully develops it?
Ko ca, bhikkhave, āhāro anuppannassa vā samādhisambojjhaṅgassa uppādāya, uppannassa vā samādhisambojjhaṅgassa: concentration as a constituent of enlightenment. (m.) bhāvanāya pāripūriyā?
There are things that are the foundation of serenity and freedom from distraction.
Atthi, bhikkhave, samathanimittaṃ abyagganimittaṃ.?
Frequent proper attention to them
Tattha yonisomanasikārabahulīkāro
—
fuels the arising of the awakening factor of immersion, or, when it has arisen, fully develops it.
ayamāhāro anuppannassa vā samādhisambojjhaṅgassa uppādāya, uppannassa vā samādhisambojjhaṅgassa bhāvanāya pāripūriyā.
Therefore light and vision comes after first jhana, the nimitta for first jhana is Samatha nimitta & Abyagga nimitta. Knowledge and Vision are abhinnas that come in fourth jhana.
First comes LIGHT then comes visions
“Mendicants, before my awakening—when I was still not awake but intent on awakening—I perceived light but did not see visions.
“pubbāhaṃ, bhikkhave, sambodhā anabhisambuddho bodhisattova samāno obhāsaññeva kho sañjānāmi, no ca rūpāni passāmi. (1)
- AN 8.64
MN 128 talks about losing light AND visions (4th jhana).
You only see dieties if you have fourth jhana
Then it occurred to me, ‘What if I were to both perceive light and see visions? Then my knowledge and vision would become even more purified.’
So after some time, living alone, withdrawn, diligent, keen, and resolute, I perceived light and saw visions. But I didn’t associate with those deities, converse, or engage in discussion.
Then it occurred to me, ‘What if I were to perceive light and see visions; and associate with those deities, converse, and engage in discussion? Then my knowledge and vision would become even more purified.’