Brahmaviharas as a main meditation Practice?

The cultivation of calm or tranquility and the development of concentration
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Akashad
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Brahmaviharas as a main meditation Practice?

Post by Akashad » Thu Jul 05, 2018 2:46 pm

Hi,

I'm thinking of changing my practice from Anapanasati to Brahmaviharas.I am just curious has anyone ever taken Brahmavihara as their main object? What were the results. I'm interested in long term brahmavihara practice.Like for the rest of this life.If this is your meditation object not as a secondary meditation.Taking it as your main meditation object or as a vehicle to insight instead of the breath.How did you find it?

Kind regards,

Akasha

befriend
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Re: Brahmaviharas as a main meditation Practice?

Post by befriend » Thu Jul 05, 2018 3:26 pm

I practiced metta for 3 hour sessions 3 days in a row. As my sole practice. When I stopped on the 4th day my hindrances exploded I felt like a heroin addict. Because what Samatha does is temporarily suppress the hindrances. But when you stop they all just burst out like a jack in the box. My late teacher told me a story of a practitioner who only practiced Samatha his whole life he stopped at one point and the defilements came up so strong he killed someone. That's why serenity and insight should be practiced in conjunction. Stable the mind with love then watch everything arise and pass.
Take care of mindfulness and mindfulness will take care of you.

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Crazy cloud
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Re: Brahmaviharas as a main meditation Practice?

Post by Crazy cloud » Thu Jul 05, 2018 3:47 pm

I haven't taken intentionally to BV, but general practice lead me into an intensive period of deep BV practice (3 months), and the power and effects of that practice left me speechless - now practice is "normal" again, but the result of doing this has been harvested.

But I didn't choose it, it arises when everything was ready here
If you didn't care
What happened to me
And I didn't care for you

We would zig-zag our way
Through the boredom and pain
Occasionally glancing up through the rain

Wondering which of the
Buggers to blame
And watching for pigs on the wing
- Roger Waters

dharmacorps
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Re: Brahmaviharas as a main meditation Practice?

Post by dharmacorps » Thu Jul 05, 2018 5:51 pm

Sole practice of the Brahmavihara's is recognized in the canon as not being the path of the Buddha. The Buddha in a past life taught, promoted and practiced the Brahmavihara's as a sole vehicle, and all that it resulted in was a pleasant next birth, but not freedom from suffering. I'd recommend at least blending breath meditation and the Brahmaviharas. Personally, I do about 30 minutes of good will or equanimity meditation daily followed by 30-40 minutes of breath meditation. I have traditionally had a lot of problems with ill will, aversion, etc so I find its a good antidote to some of that at least :)

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_anicca_
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Re: Brahmaviharas as a main meditation Practice?

Post by _anicca_ » Fri Jul 06, 2018 12:26 am

The brahmaviharas are just used to counter another unwholesome state (for instance, metta to counter ill-will) and they aren't meant as a main practice.

The abhidhamma describes the brahmaviharas as only being useful for people of a certain temperament.

However, a kamatthana - like anapanasati or the various forms of vipassana - are suitable for all temperaments.
"A virtuous monk, Kotthita my friend, should attend in an appropriate way to the five clinging-aggregates as inconstant, stressful, a disease, a cancer, an arrow, painful, an affliction, alien, a dissolution, an emptiness, not-self."

:buddha1:

http://vipassanameditation.asia

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Re: Brahmaviharas as a main meditation Practice?

Post by salayatananirodha » Fri Jul 06, 2018 4:11 am

It worked quite well for the bodhisatta.

“Monks, don’t be afraid of acts of merit. This is a synonym for what is blissful, desirable, pleasing, endearing, charming–i.e., acts of merit. I directly know that, having long performed meritorious deeds, I long experienced desirable, pleasing, endearing, charming results. Having developed a mind of good will for seven years, then for seven eons of contraction & expansion I didn’t return to this world. Whenever the eon was contracting, I entered the [realm of] Radiance. Whenever the eon was expanding, I reappeared in an empty Brahma-abode. There I was Brahma, the Great Brahma, the Unconquered Conqueror, Total Seer, Wielder of Power. Then for thirty-six times I was Sakka, ruler of the gods. For many hundreds of times I was a king, a wheel-turning emperor, a righteous king of Dhamma, conqueror of the four corners of the earth, maintaining stable control over the countryside, endowed with the seven treasures1 –to say nothing of the times I was a local king. The thought occurred to me, ‘Of what action of mine is this the fruit, of what action the result, that I now have such great power & might?’ Then the thought occurred to me, ‘This is the fruit of my three [types of] action, the result of three types of action, that I now have such great power & might: i.e., generosity, self-control, & restraint.’”
- Iti 22

Pay careful attention to the karaniya metta sutta. Don't diffuse too much your boundless, radiating love by dividing it among yourself and friends, neutrals and hostiles. This mental construction greatly limits the absorption you may reach from this practice.
bodom found these,
https://www.accesstoinsight.org/tipitak ... .than.html
https://www.accesstoinsight.org/tipitak ... .than.html
I can't remember where else mettā and jhānas are taught together, but this paper well explains.
http://seeingthroughthenet.net/wp-conte ... _Heart.pdf
If you want to be free of suffering, this will do that for you.

I hope you don't mind my inclusion of the karaniya mettā sutta, as it is just perfect and contains instructions oft overlooked.
Screen Shot 2018-07-05 at 23.07.59.png
16. 'In what has the world originated?' — so said the Yakkha Hemavata, — 'with what is the world intimate? by what is the world afflicted, after having grasped at what?' (167)

17. 'In six the world has originated, O Hemavata,' — so said Bhagavat, — 'with six it is intimate, by six the world is afflicted, after having grasped at six.' (168)

- Hemavatasutta


links:
https://www.ancient-buddhist-texts.net/index.htm
http://thaiforestwisdom.org/canonical-texts/
http://seeingthroughthenet.net/
https://www.dhammatalks.org/index.html

Baranek13
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Re: Brahmaviharas as a main meditation Practice?

Post by Baranek13 » Thu Jan 17, 2019 8:11 pm

I am very interested in Brahmaviharas and trying to practice them a lot. For me the first three are pretty separate from upekkha. Upekkha feels for me like peace born from wisdom. It is a readiness for action if needed (panna).
So I can fit all my practice into Brahmaviharas as practicing upekkha involves 4 Noble Truths and understanding of Dukkha anicca anatta and Eightfold path.
I also noticed that serenity is a sublime form of all of them in the same time. At least that’s my feeling :slight_smile:
I also substitute them for feeling connected with peaceful goodness. Love and Peace.
This practice brings me a lot of happiness which feels pure, not brought by sensuality.

Love and Peace:-)
“You are your own teacher. Looking for teachers can’t solve your own doubts. Investigate yourself to find the truth - inside, not outside. Knowing yourself is most important.”
― Ajahn Chah

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Re: Brahmaviharas as a main meditation Practice?

Post by retrofuturist » Thu Jan 17, 2019 9:30 pm

Greetings Akasha,
Akashad wrote:
Thu Jul 05, 2018 2:46 pm
Taking it as your main meditation object or as a vehicle to insight instead of the breath. How did you find it?
Preferable, actually.

The instructions I have used are found in AN 4.126.
"Monks, there are these four types of individuals to be found existing in the world. Which four?

"There is the case where an individual keeps pervading the first direction — as well as the second direction, the third, & the fourth — with an awareness imbued with good will. Thus he keeps pervading above, below, & all around, everywhere & in every respect the all-encompassing cosmos with an awareness imbued with good will: abundant, expansive, immeasurable, free from hostility, free from ill will. He regards whatever phenomena there that are connected with form, feeling, perception, fabrications, & consciousness, as inconstant, stressful, a disease, a cancer, an arrow, painful, an affliction, alien, a disintegration, an emptiness, not-self. At the break-up of the body, after death, he reappears in conjunction with the devas of the Pure Abodes. This rebirth is not in common with run-of-the-mill people.

"Again, there is the case where an individual keeps pervading the first direction — as well as the second direction, the third, & the fourth — with an awareness imbued with compassion... appreciation... equanimity. Thus he keeps pervading above, below, & all around, everywhere & in every respect the all-encompassing cosmos with an awareness imbued with equanimity: abundant, expansive, immeasurable, free from hostility, free from ill will. He regards whatever phenomena there that are connected with form, feeling, perception, fabrications, & consciousness, as inconstant, stressful, a disease, a cancer, an arrow, painful, an affliction, alien, a disintegration, an emptiness, not-self. At the break-up of the body, after death, he reappears in conjunction with the devas of the Pure Abodes. This rebirth is not in common with run-of-the-mill people.

"These are four types of individuals to be found existing in the world."
Metta,
Paul. :)
"The uprooting of identity is seen by the noble ones as pleasurable; but this contradicts what the whole world sees." (Snp 3.12)

"It is natural that one who knows and sees things as they really are is disenchanted and dispassionate." (AN 10.2)

“Truth does not change according to our ability to stomach it.” (Flannery O'Connor)

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Sabbe_Dhamma_Anatta
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Re: Brahmaviharas as a main meditation Practice?

Post by Sabbe_Dhamma_Anatta » Wed Jan 23, 2019 4:51 pm

Once, some great monk (not remember who) said:
When you are alone, live with vipassana.
When you are in company, live with metta.
Exquisitely simple.

Metta,
🅢🅐🅑🅑🅔 🅓🅗🅐🅜🅜🅐 🅐🅝🅐🅣🅣🅐
  • "the one thing all the mistaken views have in common is the assump­tion that the self exists" ~ DN1
  • "It is an entirely and perfectly foolish idea" ~ MN22
  • The No-self doctrine is found only in the teaching of the Buddha.
  • No-self (anatta) means that there is no permanent, unchanging entity in anything animate or inanimate. ~ SN22.59

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Re: Brahmaviharas as a main meditation Practice?

Post by Sabbe_Dhamma_Anatta » Thu Jan 24, 2019 12:05 pm

Oh, my bad! :-)
The actual saying (literaly translated) is:
When you are alone, live with mindfulness.
When you are in company, live with metta.

(Yaw Sayadaw - Ashin Sirainda Bhivamsa ) Tipitakadhara
https://m.facebook.com/notes/phillip-py ... 290636009/

That being said, in the above sentence, "mindfulness" is not just "any" mindfulness. It implies "Satipatthana Vipassana". https://www.accesstoinsight.org/lib/aut ... el370.html

So, what I snatched from memory:
When you are alone, live with vipassana.
When you are in company, live with metta.
still seems essentially (and luckily) correct :-)

Metta,
🅢🅐🅑🅑🅔 🅓🅗🅐🅜🅜🅐 🅐🅝🅐🅣🅣🅐
  • "the one thing all the mistaken views have in common is the assump­tion that the self exists" ~ DN1
  • "It is an entirely and perfectly foolish idea" ~ MN22
  • The No-self doctrine is found only in the teaching of the Buddha.
  • No-self (anatta) means that there is no permanent, unchanging entity in anything animate or inanimate. ~ SN22.59

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Aloka
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Re: Brahmaviharas as a main meditation Practice?

Post by Aloka » Sat Jan 26, 2019 4:28 pm

Here's an interview with Bhikkhu Analayo about cultivating the Brahma Viharas:


https://www.buddhistinquiry.org/article ... maviharas/




:anjali:

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ancientbuddhism
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Re: Brahmaviharas as a main meditation Practice?

Post by ancientbuddhism » Sat Jan 26, 2019 7:57 pm

They are great for those with “issues”. Otherwise satipaṭṭhāna will get you there for sure.
I say, beware of all enterprises that require new clothes, and not rather a new wearer of clothes.” – Henry David Thoreau, Walden, 1854

Secure your own mask before assisting others. – NORTHWEST AIRLINES (Pre-Flight Instruction)

A Handful of Leaves

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Re: Brahmaviharas as a main meditation Practice?

Post by Manopubbangama » Mon Jan 28, 2019 3:23 pm

My understanding is that the Brahmaviharas and Jhanas were practiced before the Buddha and that they lead to heaven in isolation, but combined with vipassana can lead to nibanna.
Buddhists, beware of spiritual transvestites.

Baranek13
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Re: Brahmaviharas as a main meditation Practice?

Post by Baranek13 » Mon Feb 04, 2019 10:39 am

Aloka wrote:
Sat Jan 26, 2019 4:28 pm
Here's an interview with Bhikkhu Analayo about cultivating the Brahma Viharas:


https://www.buddhistinquiry.org/article ... maviharas/




:anjali:
Thank you for that, very clear and interesting:)

Pre-Buddhist Jhāna and Brahmavihāra Practice
The early Buddhist texts in fact recurrently refer to the practice of the jhānas and of the
brahmavihāras as pre-Buddhist forms of practice. This stands in contrast to the development of
liberating insight, which the same texts clearly consider the specific discovery of a Buddha.

it seems safe to
conclude that in early Buddhist thought neither the jhānas nor the brahmavihāras constitute an
independent path to liberation. At the same time, however, the texts equally clearly highlight
the substantial contribution that the jhānas and/or the brahmavihāras can make to progress to
the final goal.
The fact
“You are your own teacher. Looking for teachers can’t solve your own doubts. Investigate yourself to find the truth - inside, not outside. Knowing yourself is most important.”
― Ajahn Chah

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Re: Brahmaviharas as a main meditation Practice?

Post by budo » Mon Feb 04, 2019 10:58 am

Brahma Viharas can take you all the way to non-return, assuming you see and practice according to right view.

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