I am determined to abstain from pornography

Buddhist ethical conduct including the Five Precepts (Pañcasikkhāpada), and Eightfold Ethical Conduct (Aṭṭhasīla).
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manas
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Re: I am determined to abstain from pornography

Post by manas » Thu Sep 16, 2010 9:33 pm

Thanks Bhante. :anjali: (I just read your name more carefully!). Btw I could never broach this subject to the Bhikkhus I know 'in the physical world', but I really appreciate that members of the Bhikkhu Sangha are here in this Forum to offer advice even about such difficult subjects as this one!

Regarding the mind finding satisfaction in the good rather than the bad, this is a gradual process for me, perhaps a lifelong one. Just as the Buddha says in the Dhammapada, my mind, due to the force of acquired habit (since time immemorial?) quite naturally and effortlessly glides towards sense pleasures (NO effort needed here!), but to experience the pleasure of meditation, effort IS needed! Waking up is hard to do, but now that the Buddha has shown me this much, just rolling over and going back to sleep seems a ghastly option...yet what the Buddha invites me to do (renunciation by seeing things as they really are) is difficult also. I'm sorry to sound like I'm complaining, it's just how I feel these days. (Btw I humbly bow to the Sakyan Sage, who holds up a Light for any who wish to see, and offers a Path to deliverance!)

Sincerely, 'manasikara'.
Knowing this body is like a clay jar,
securing this mind like a fort,
attack Mara with the spear of discernment,
then guard what's won without settling there,
without laying claim.

- Dhp 40

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Monkey Mind
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Re: I am determined to abstain from pornography

Post by Monkey Mind » Thu Sep 16, 2010 10:09 pm

manasikara wrote:Btw I could never broach this subject to the Bhikkhus I know 'in the physical world'
Why not? That is not meant as a criticism, but only to convey that I did broach this topic with monks. The guidance I received was very inspirational.
:anjali:
"As I am, so are others;
as others are, so am I."
Having thus identified self and others,
harm no one nor have them harmed.

Sutta Nipāta 3.710

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mikenz66
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Re: I am determined to abstain from pornography

Post by mikenz66 » Fri Sep 17, 2010 3:12 am

Yes, if you need advice on overcoming lust, monks are clearly one of the most useful sources for practical advice... :sage:

Though one of my teachers who ordained as a novice at about age 12 sometimes joked:
"There's no point in asking my advice about sex...". :tongue:

:anjali:
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Re: I am determined to abstain from pornography

Post by Pacific » Fri Sep 17, 2010 5:55 am

as I heard the other night in a discussion about this subject -- "it just doesn't lead to enlightenment" which is as good enough reason as one needs I reckon

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nyanasuci
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Re: I am determined to abstain from pornography

Post by nyanasuci » Fri Sep 17, 2010 4:02 pm

Hello,
manasikara wrote:Btw I could never broach this subject to the Bhikkhus I know 'in the physical world', but I really appreciate that members of the Bhikkhu Sangha are here in this Forum to offer advice even about such difficult subjects as this one!

In the Sangha of the Lord Buddha we do not have tabu topics (like in the Catholic monasteries). We are celibate and not born as saints, and therefore the theme about greed, hate and delusion is present here. The problem of our kilesas should be acknowledged and then one should seek for help from people who are skilled in the matter (which would be the Buddha, and other knowledgeable bhikkhus or bhikkhunis). So, do not feel intimidated when you approach a bhikkhu regarding problem of pornography or other tabu topics.

See also this video:

Bhikkhu Hiriko - Ñāṇasuci

The experts do not say that one is a sage in this world because of view, or learning, or knowledge, Nanda.
I call them sages who wander without association, without affliction, without desire.

The Buddha, Sn.V.8.2 (1078)


http://pathpress.org | http://nanavira.org | http://ajahnchah.org

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Aloka
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Re: I am determined to abstain from pornography

Post by Aloka » Fri Sep 17, 2010 6:14 pm

manasikara wrote:
PS, someone said that if it's a problem, 'just don't do it!' Respectfully, that's like telling an alcoholic or a smoker 'well just stop' and expecting that it's just that simple. You have to have been addicted to something on a chemical level to know how tough the process of freeing yourself is. At the moment of orgasm, dopamine and other neurochemicals get released in the brain, and an orgasm junkie is actually hooked on those chemicals, more than the physical sensation of about ten seconds duration. It's chemical, that's why its as tough as alcohol or smokes to give up.

I think that was me. I said ''Just don't watch it.''

With respect, one can give all manner of things up if one wants too strongly enough. I gave up smoking since I was 14, immediately, at the point I decided 'OK,thats it now. " I also gave up recreational drugs years ago in the same way.

I gave up having another boyfriend and sex (which I enjoyed) - just like that too - because I wanted to focus exclusively on Dhamma study and meditation in non-working hours.

You have to be determined ...and then just let the "addiction" go, with ease and relaxed optimism. :)

So, no, it doesn't have to be tough, it can be easy. It's dependent on one's mental attitude. No need to get mentally obsessed and attached...just meditate.

You have to make up your mind to stop watching the porn and replace that time with something non-sexual , instead of finding excuses to keep watching it.

The porn industry is known to be rife with crime and drugs and the sex they film is completely loveless and staged.

If its become a medical problem for you, then why not seek help from the medical profession ?

Anyway, hope you can find a solution and sending good wishes.

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nyanasuci
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Re: I am determined to abstain from pornography

Post by nyanasuci » Sat Sep 18, 2010 7:57 am

Even Pope Benedict XVI did give a recent comment on pornography:
Drugs, money, sex, pornography, alcohol ... these things are destructive and divisive.
(http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-11333448" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;)

Image

;)
Bhikkhu Hiriko - Ñāṇasuci

The experts do not say that one is a sage in this world because of view, or learning, or knowledge, Nanda.
I call them sages who wander without association, without affliction, without desire.

The Buddha, Sn.V.8.2 (1078)


http://pathpress.org | http://nanavira.org | http://ajahnchah.org

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Dmytro
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Re: I am determined to abstain from pornography

Post by Dmytro » Sat Sep 18, 2010 9:45 am

Hello,

These problems can be overcome with the help of proper tools.

The key resource needed to deal with any addiction is the time and space to reflect. In the case of porn, time and space between the thought and porn website.

Such a distance is provided by parental control services. I've found very useful the service http://www.opendns.com/" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;. It can block a range of websites, according to selected settings, including also those websites which can compromise computer security.

Another viable option is http://www1.k9webprotection.com/" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
(see the comparison at: http://www.techsupportalert.com/best-fr ... Filter.htm" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false; )

These services give you some time, and the rest is up to you.

Good luck!

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Moth
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Re: I am determined to abstain from pornography

Post by Moth » Sun Sep 19, 2010 8:13 am

The moment of lust--a sudden shift of consciousness where we suddenly feel overwhelmed and out of our own control. In this state of mind it is quite easy to make illogical mistakes, which I have often done. The real skill is experiencing this state of arousal and simply not acting upon it, watching it arise and watching it fade. However if we identify with it, if we make it a condition of "our self" then we are likely to fall victim to it. Do not despise it, do not venerate it, simple be impassive towards it.
Last edited by Moth on Wed Sep 22, 2010 10:56 pm, edited 2 times in total.
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manas
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Re: I am determined to abstain from pornography

Post by manas » Sun Sep 19, 2010 10:03 pm

Monkey Mind wrote:
manasikara wrote:Btw I could never broach this subject to the Bhikkhus I know 'in the physical world'
Why not? That is not meant as a criticism, but only to convey that I did broach this topic with monks. The guidance I received was very inspirational.
:anjali:
About that, I just meant that 'I would feel either 1.too embarrassed to mention it, or 2.would be concerned that I was 'stressing them out' with problems of lay life that they probably don't wish to have to recall or deal with (such as when married people ask for marital advice, which I would definitely not do - I would ask a skilled layperson instead, and leave the monks in peace!) For my part, I also meant absolutely no criticism of you at all, I was just referring to my own reticence in approaching monks these days.

I might add one thing though: When I first encountered Buddhism 20 years ago, completely and utterly green, I had several monks, some quite learned, show much compassion to me, allowing me to ask all kinds of questions (some of them quite silly) and patiently trying to guide me in the right direction. The irony is that now, those monks being now gone elsewhere (that's life), I am quite isolated in terms of Buddhist association (other than online forums such as this). I am not a very easy person to like or get to know, it seems. So my not visiting monks is so as to not disturb them.

metta. :anjali:
Knowing this body is like a clay jar,
securing this mind like a fort,
attack Mara with the spear of discernment,
then guard what's won without settling there,
without laying claim.

- Dhp 40

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Monkey Mind
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Re: I am determined to abstain from pornography

Post by Monkey Mind » Mon Sep 20, 2010 4:49 am

I was afraid that if I asked the monks questions about drinking alcohol, masturbation, and pornography, my questions would trigger a relapse in sensual desire. What if I show a monk my new iphone, and he suddenly disrobes in pursuit of the latest gadgets! I discovered that their resolve was amazing! Who better to learn from when trying to control my desires. Besides, it seems that Buddha wanted the monks to be available to the laity.
"As I am, so are others;
as others are, so am I."
Having thus identified self and others,
harm no one nor have them harmed.

Sutta Nipāta 3.710

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Khalil Bodhi
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Re: I am determined to abstain from pornography

Post by Khalil Bodhi » Mon Sep 20, 2010 8:49 am

Dmytro wrote:Hello,

These problems can be overcome with the help of proper tools.

The key resource needed to deal with any addiction is the time and space to reflect. In the case of porn, time and space between the thought and porn website.

Such a distance is provided by parental control services. I've found very useful the service http://www.opendns.com/" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;. It can block a range of websites, according to selected settings, including also those websites which can compromise computer security.

Another viable option is http://www1.k9webprotection.com/" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
(see the comparison at: http://www.techsupportalert.com/best-fr ... Filter.htm" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false; )

These services give you some time, and the rest is up to you.

Good luck!
Sadhu! Thanks Dmytro, I'm going to give opendns a try. I've used k9 in the past and although it's somewhat effective it did block some sites that I needed to use for work. Metta.
To avoid all evil, to cultivate good, and to cleanse one's mind — this is the teaching of the Buddhas.
-Dhp. 183

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tiltbillings
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Re: I am determined to abstain from pornography

Post by tiltbillings » Mon Sep 20, 2010 10:24 am

I wrote this reply to a msg was deleted by the time I got around to posting it. Of course, the name has been withheld:
XXX wrote:. . .

"meditation beats masturbation"
"don't knock masturbation. It's sex with someone I love"

But rather than get into contest with your lust, maybe try simply watching it, being with it, simply attending to the feeing of it without comment, without wanting it to stay or to go away. And it is at the moment when it stops that meditation "beats" masturbation. (There are way too many opportunities here for puns; I must behave myself.)
>> Do you see a man wise [enlightened/ariya] in his own eyes? There is more hope for a fool than for him.<< -- Proverbs 26:12

This being is bound to samsara, kamma is his means for going beyond. -- SN I, 38.

“Of course it is happening inside your head, Harry, but why on earth should that mean that it is not real?” HPatDH p.723

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manas
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Re: I am determined to abstain from pornography

Post by manas » Fri Sep 24, 2010 4:21 am

tiltbillings wrote:...it is at the moment when it stops that meditation "beats" masturbation. (There are way too many opportunities here for puns; I must behave myself.)
*chuckle* Yes, we need to stop; give our mind a good 'whack'; then get up, and put our hands to good use instead (performing wholesome kammas). ;)
Knowing this body is like a clay jar,
securing this mind like a fort,
attack Mara with the spear of discernment,
then guard what's won without settling there,
without laying claim.

- Dhp 40

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Vepacitta
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Re: I am determined to abstain from pornography

Post by Vepacitta » Sat Sep 25, 2010 1:00 pm

You could always set up a 'contest' like they did on Seinfeld ...
I'm your friendly, neighbourhood Asura

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