Can´t solve this one

General discussion of issues related to Theravada Meditation, e.g. meditation postures, developing a regular sitting practice, skillfully relating to difficulties and hindrances, etc.
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2600htz
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Can´t solve this one

Post by 2600htz » Sat Aug 28, 2010 12:55 am

Hello everyone.

Been meditating around 8 months - 1hrs every day.
Two methods i have tried, in a basic way:

a.- pay attention in one area of nose and lips, feeling the breath in the area (without analytical speech) (my first 4 months and recently retaken)
b.- understanding i inhale/exhale it was short/long, not paying attention to a specific area (with analytical speech: that was a inhalation, that was a long one, that was a short one) (last 4 months)

What i get from:

a.-PROS: seclusion, my mind cant be paying attention to a feeling in one area plus giving me troubles :), i experience great feelings, pleasant sensations, a lot.
CONS: i dont know if im understading the breath completely (can be done without analytical speech?, just by feeling?), feel maybe like cheating? i mean not really letting go...

b.-PROS: i sure i understand what my breath its doing (because of analytical speech: that was a long one, the previous was a short one), im able to try letting go (something arise, i try releasing that almost like a parallel process)
CONS: a lot of unpleseant feelings arising, feeling kinda uncomfortable (ofcourse mixed with some pleasants),at the end maybe loosing the battle against unpleasant feelings, not close to the surreal experience of method a.-



Any recommendation, experience, comment ????????????????????????, i feel between two worlds, unable to arm a "definitive package" !!!

Thanks a lot

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jcsuperstar
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Re: Can´t solve this one

Post by jcsuperstar » Sat Aug 28, 2010 1:04 am

Who or where are you learning meditation from?
สัพเพ สัตตา สุขีตา โหนตุ

the mountain may be heavy in and of itself, but if you're not trying to carry it it's not heavy to you- Ajaan Suwat

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Goofaholix
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Re: Can´t solve this one

Post by Goofaholix » Sat Aug 28, 2010 1:08 am

Method a sounds correct.

You can add to it noticing whether the breath was short or long, you can notice whatever else arises in your mind and body, there is no need to add analytical speech to it, just noticing is enough.
“Peace is within oneself to be found in the same place as agitation and suffering. It is not found in a forest or on a hilltop, nor is it given by a teacher. Where you experience suffering, you can also find freedom from suffering. Trying to run away from suffering is actually to run toward it.” ― Ajahn Chah

lojong1
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Re: Can´t solve this one

Post by lojong1 » Sat Aug 28, 2010 1:39 am

I was told once by a gentle old Indian Satipatthana practitioner that attention specifically at the nose tip leads only to Deva-realm (where Devas "experience great feelings, pleasant sensations, a lot").

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Modus.Ponens
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Re: Can´t solve this one

Post by Modus.Ponens » Sat Aug 28, 2010 2:14 am

In my opinion, the anapanasati sutta's instructions are to be taken sequentialy. They are not a collection of separate objects of concentration. If you folow the instructions sequentialy with enough time for each step, you will progress trough the jhanas.
"He turns his mind away from those phenomena and, having done so, inclines his mind to the property of deathlessness: 'This is peace, this is exquisite — the resolution of all fabrications; the relinquishment of all acquisitions; the ending of craving; dispassion; cessation; Unbinding.' " - Jhana Sutta

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jcsuperstar
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Re: Can´t solve this one

Post by jcsuperstar » Sat Aug 28, 2010 3:12 am

oh and to add, i think if you want to note long or short, this is fine. some people just do "in and out" or count etc, these are sorta "baby steps" to get you to focus more clearly, one pointedly until you don't need noting anymore. but my question still remains , and the reason i ask is because many styles or teachers have you do certain things in "their" system and we could give you advice that easily confuses you later on if you're working in a specific system.
สัพเพ สัตตา สุขีตา โหนตุ

the mountain may be heavy in and of itself, but if you're not trying to carry it it's not heavy to you- Ajaan Suwat

Moggalana
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Re: Can´t solve this one

Post by Moggalana » Sat Aug 28, 2010 9:59 am

I'm using method b, but without the analytical speech. Just knowing is enough in my experience.
Ajahn Brahm wrote: When you focus on the breath, you focus on the experience of the breath happening now. You experience `that which tells you what the breath is doing', whether it is going in or out or in between. Some teachers say to watch the breath at the tip of the nose, some say to watch it at the abdomen and some say to move it here and then move it there. I have found through experience that it does not matter where you watch the breath. In fact it is best not to locate the breath anywhere! If you locate the breath at the tip of your nose then it becomes nose awareness, not breath awareness, and if you locate it at your abdomen then it becomes abdomen awareness. Just ask yourself the question right now, "Am I breathing in or am I breathing out?" How do you know? There! That experience which tells you what the breath is doing, that is what you focus on in breath meditation. Let go of concern about where this experience is located; just focus on the experience itself.
http://www.jhanagrove.org.au/meditation.html" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
Let it come. Let it be. Let it go.

2600htz
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Re: Can´t solve this one

Post by 2600htz » Sat Aug 28, 2010 3:48 pm

jcsuperstar wrote:Who or where are you learning meditation from?
Hi, only reading material by my own.

Thank you all for answers.

PeterB
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Re: Can´t solve this one

Post by PeterB » Sat Aug 28, 2010 4:38 pm

I see Matias that there is a Goenka Vipassana centre about 50 kms from Santiago.

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