Why i can not move to the second jhana from the first jhana?

General discussion of issues related to Theravada Meditation, e.g. meditation postures, developing a regular sitting practice, skillfully relating to difficulties and hindrances, etc.
User avatar
purple1
Posts: 110
Joined: Sat Oct 08, 2016 3:44 pm

Re: Why i can not move to the second jhana from the first jhana?

Post by purple1 » Fri Jan 27, 2017 5:58 am

Thank you very much for the advices, Dhammarelax and everybody who answered. I already know that the most important thing is do not wanting move to a higher jhana. Wanting is a hindrance. I try to focus on Nibbana as the goal. I let go wanting enter the higher jhanas. Sometimes i thinking about jhanas. Those are impermanent. It helped a lot. Someone wrote in this topic that wanting is a hindrance.

R1111 = rightviewftw
Posts: 1019
Joined: Thu Nov 12, 2015 4:17 am

Re: Why i can not move to the second jhana from the first jhana?

Post by R1111 = rightviewftw » Sat Jan 28, 2017 7:44 pm

Doesnt sound like a Samatha Jhana to me, what is the object of meditation when you are in the Jhana?
Any more information about the teacher? Lineage, tradition. First Jhana is entered by taking arisen sign, ie diamond, bodypart, a star etc, a stable mental formation as object, this is absorbtion, what you describe is what id probably call "access concentration" its close to Jhana, but hindrances arent supressed therefore no Sign has arisen. Id probably advice trying to have the breath "tranquilize" you more, each breath to make you more peaceful and delighted.

User avatar
purple1
Posts: 110
Joined: Sat Oct 08, 2016 3:44 pm

Re: Why i can not move to the second jhana from the first jhana?

Post by purple1 » Tue Feb 21, 2017 8:14 pm

R1111 wrote:Doesnt sound like a Samatha Jhana to me, what is the object of meditation when you are in the Jhana?
Any more information about the teacher? Lineage, tradition. First Jhana is entered by taking arisen sign, ie diamond, bodypart, a star etc, a stable mental formation as object, this is absorbtion, what you describe is what id probably call "access concentration" its close to Jhana, but hindrances arent supressed therefore no Sign has arisen. Id probably advice trying to have the breath "tranquilize" you more, each breath to make you more peaceful and delighted.
The meditation object is the breathing, as i wrote before. First jhana is i focus on the breath, thoughts comes and goes, but thoughts does not distract my mind. I feel joy. Second jhana is thoughts disappear and i focus on the breath without thougts, and i feel joy.

R1111 = rightviewftw
Posts: 1019
Joined: Thu Nov 12, 2015 4:17 am

Re: Why i can not move to the second jhana from the first jhana?

Post by R1111 = rightviewftw » Tue Feb 21, 2017 8:33 pm

purple1 wrote: The meditation object is the breathing, as i wrote before. First jhana is i focus on the breath, thoughts comes and goes, but thoughts does not distract my mind. I feel joy. Second jhana is thoughts disappear and i focus on the breath without thougts, and i feel joy.
Hi,
Respectfully, Im not interested in debating the definition of jhana at this moment.
I will however suggest that the progress to deeper concenteration however we may call these states at this moment is probabaly hindered by the 5 hindrances, i also suspect that it may be particularly doubt, so i suggest you can try not thinking about these things and just stick to the breath, you can see if you have doubt is present in your mind when you think about things as what stage ur at and why its not progressing, you can also note if you want it to progress and go back to tranquilizing yourself with in and out breaths. In any case i think its best not to think about these things for samadhi/samatha jhanas.

When thinking comes up just note it and go back to becoming joyious with each in and out breath, focus of the breath, know it as slow/fast, deep/shallow, peaceful, relaxing, certain and costant.
Last edited by R1111 = rightviewftw on Wed Feb 22, 2017 1:48 am, edited 3 times in total.

Caodemarte
Posts: 831
Joined: Fri May 01, 2015 3:21 pm

Re: Why i can not move to the second jhana from the first jhana?

Post by Caodemarte » Tue Feb 21, 2017 11:17 pm

purple1 wrote: The meditation object is the breathing, as i wrote before. First jhana is i focus on the breath, thoughts comes and goes, but thoughts does not distract my mind. I feel joy. Second jhana is thoughts disappear and i focus on the breath without thougts, and i feel joy.
I would think this might be described as access concentration, but, given my ignorance, might be any of the jhanas. Then again what does it matter what my ill informed view is from this distance or what precise definition thIs fits? I am sure you do not want to get hung up on the map to the detriment of the journey, the natural unfolding of the mind. As you say, that is just another hindrance. If you seeking a goal with even 1 per cent of your mind, it would seem you are not giving 100 per cent to the breath. Consult with a real life respected teacher in person for useful advice and don't worry. Good luck in any case.
Last edited by Caodemarte on Wed Feb 22, 2017 2:59 am, edited 2 times in total.


Post Reply

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 26 guests