What life is like in pure abode?

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confusedlayman
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What life is like in pure abode?

Post by confusedlayman » Fri Jan 17, 2020 7:01 pm

No music,no dance, no video games, no sports... only focus on nibbana for long eons? No entertainment?
non-agitation is highest peace
living unaffected by other cause and condition to suffering is true bliss
not associating with stupid people is immediate peace
- CL (confused layman)

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Aloka
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Re: What life is like in pure abode?

Post by Aloka » Fri Jan 17, 2020 9:11 pm

confusedlayman wrote:
Fri Jan 17, 2020 7:01 pm
No music,no dance, no video games, no sports... only focus on nibbana for long eons? No entertainment?
A pure abode is a mental state, not a place where one dances around and plays loud music, football, and video games.

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Last edited by Aloka on Fri Jan 17, 2020 9:14 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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Ceisiwr
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Re: What life is like in pure abode?

Post by Ceisiwr » Fri Jan 17, 2020 9:14 pm

It sounds like you haven’t contemplated the drawbacks of sensual pleasures.
“Lust is a maker of signs. Aversion is a maker of signs. Delusion is a maker of signs.” MN 43

"Rooted in desire, friends, are all phenomena; originating in attention, are all phenomena”
— A. v. 106

char101
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Re: What life is like in pure abode?

Post by char101 » Sat Jan 18, 2020 6:00 am

confusedlayman wrote:
Fri Jan 17, 2020 7:01 pm
No music,no dance, no video games, no sports... only focus on nibbana for long eons? No entertainment?
Brahmas seeing humans enjoying sensual pleasure is like human seeing pigs enjoying bath in the mud.

sakyan
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Re: What life is like in pure abode?

Post by sakyan » Sun Jan 19, 2020 11:20 am

confusedlayman wrote:
Fri Jan 17, 2020 7:01 pm
No music,no dance, no video games, no sports... only focus on nibbana for long eons? No entertainment?
In the biographies of some modern Anagamis their mental state is stated as most subtle, peaceful and sublime. Their mind is concentrated and no thought of greed and hate pop up at all.

I would readily choose the pure abodes over the sensual realms any single day. Who doesn't want such a peaceful mind which has let go of greed and hate? These Ariyas really have nothing to worry for.

Even devas and brahmas might be thinking that these humans are made up of filth and flesh, yet they are overly attached to their body and kill each other for such coarse things.

dharmacorps
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Re: What life is like in pure abode?

Post by dharmacorps » Sun Jan 19, 2020 5:55 pm

Hard to describe the pure abodes, because by definition, nobody ever "comes back" from them. Even the Buddha never was reborn in the pure abodes. He did speak to what they were like because he attained knowledge of them after his enlightenment, but it was a curious situation where it was the only realm he did not have a rebirth in.

polo
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Re: What life is like in pure abode?

Post by polo » Tue Jan 21, 2020 12:55 pm

char101 wrote:
Sat Jan 18, 2020 6:00 am
confusedlayman wrote:
Fri Jan 17, 2020 7:01 pm
No music,no dance, no video games, no sports... only focus on nibbana for long eons? No entertainment?
Brahmas seeing humans enjoying sensual pleasure is like human seeing pigs enjoying bath in the mud.
Yes, you are right on the spot.Of course that is what really happen you know, how could be otherwise.
Oh, Brahmas is beyond sex, is it because they were born without sexual desires or they have overcome those desires. Appreciate if you could draw some light on this question.

char101
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Re: What life is like in pure abode?

Post by char101 » Tue Jan 21, 2020 2:00 pm

polo wrote:
Tue Jan 21, 2020 12:55 pm
char101 wrote:
Sat Jan 18, 2020 6:00 am
confusedlayman wrote:
Fri Jan 17, 2020 7:01 pm
No music,no dance, no video games, no sports... only focus on nibbana for long eons? No entertainment?
Brahmas seeing humans enjoying sensual pleasure is like human seeing pigs enjoying bath in the mud.
Yes, you are right on the spot.Of course that is what really happen you know, how could be otherwise.
Oh, Brahmas is beyond sex, is it because they were born without sexual desires or they have overcome those desires. Appreciate if you could draw some light on this question.
Gender is one of the 28 rupa in the abhidhamma so this could be answered based on what rupa appears in the brahma world.
In the Rupa-plane decads of nose, tongue, body, sex
and the material groups produced by food do not arise.

A Manual of Abhidhamma p.352
Genitals are used to reproduce, not for pleasure. The pleasure itself is just incentive biologically, to motivate creatures to reproduce. Brahmas are born spontaneously so there is no need for reproduction.

Rebirth in the Brahma world is gained via jhana development. Sensual pleasure is the main obstacle for the attainment of jhana. So it does not make sense if the Brahma world enjoy sensual pleasures. The happiness of jhana itself is beyond the pleasure from the senses.

auto
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Re: What life is like in pure abode?

Post by auto » Tue Jan 21, 2020 3:03 pm

char101 wrote:
Tue Jan 21, 2020 2:00 pm
Brahmas are born spontaneously so there is no need for reproduction.

Rebirth in the Brahma world is gained via jhana development. Sensual pleasure is the main obstacle for the attainment of jhana. So it does not make sense if the Brahma world enjoy sensual pleasures. The happiness of jhana itself is beyond the pleasure from the senses.
not spontaneously but spontaneously on its own accord or will. Svayam

Perhaps the close scientific term would be teleportation which also includes different realms of existence. Probably any being who is beyond the clutches of death can do it, the idea of birth and death doesn't apply anymore.
https://suttacentral.net/sn1.34/en/sujato wrote: “Among humans there are no sensual pleasures that are permanent. “Na santi kāmā manujesu niccā,
Humans(manu, son of brahma) by design doesn't have lasting peace/tranquility. As no access to 3rd jhana realms, which are free from the desire for rebirth to lower existence attainable through female womb.
https://suttacentral.net/sn1.34/en/sujato wrote: “The world’s pretty things aren’t sensual pleasures. “Na te kāmā yāni citrāni loke,
Greedy intention is a person’s sensual pleasure. Saṅkapparāgo purisassa kāmo;
The world’s pretty things stay just as they are, Tiṭṭhanti citrāni tatheva loke,
but a wise one removes desire for them. Athettha dhīrā vinayanti chandaṃ.
Purisa refer to males. And maybe, these 'pretty things' refer to females.

*Some sources say that all things on earth are yin(female). So understand the context, no female hating here. Correction I remember wrongly it is earth what is yin, and the things on earth are yang.. whatever..
Book:Teachings of an Authentic Taoist Immortal wrote:“No. It is not so simple and easy as that. What I said is that everything
on the earth is yang, though the earth itself is yin. We, as human
beings, are yang creatures, but we have yin energy as well. It is the
combination of the two that gives us life.
Also the 'womb' could refer to emptiness, void.

auto
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Re: What life is like in pure abode?

Post by auto » Wed Jan 22, 2020 12:54 pm

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pure_Abodes wrote:Since these devas rise from lower planes only due to the teaching of a Buddha, they can remain empty for very long periods if no Buddha arises.
https://suttacentral.net/sn1.39/en/sujato wrote: There are those who have found acceptance and peaceYe ca kho ariye dhamme,
in the noble teaching.Khantiyā upasamena upetā;
After giving up this human body,Pahāya mānusaṃ dehaṃ,
they swell the hosts of gods.”Devakāyaṃ paripūressantī”ti.
I wonder if the anāgāmi is human anymore, but a deva.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pure_Abodes wrote: (Brahma Sahampati, who appealed to the newly enlightened Buddha to teach, was an Anagami from a previous Buddha[1]).
hmm, can't find the Sutta right now, what tells thing like jhana generates beings. So I wonder, your past self or being you not identify with it anymore will still live on.

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