Should we consume food only as a medicine?

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_anicca_
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Re: Should we consume food only as a medicine?

Post by _anicca_ » Fri Apr 29, 2016 9:43 pm

SarathW wrote:
don't keep emotional food (high fat/salty/sugary processed foods usually) around the house
This is a very effective method.
If you do not have it, how do you eat!
They say, "It's easier to say no in the grocery store than at home."

:tongue:
"A virtuous monk, Kotthita my friend, should attend in an appropriate way to the five clinging-aggregates as inconstant, stressful, a disease, a cancer, an arrow, painful, an affliction, alien, a dissolution, an emptiness, not-self."

:buddha1:

http://vipassanameditation.asia

SarathW
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Re: Should we consume food only as a medicine?

Post by SarathW » Fri Apr 29, 2016 9:47 pm

It is not easy if you are shopping when you are hungry.
;)
“As the lamp consumes oil, the path realises Nibbana”

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Mkoll
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Re: Should we consume food only as a medicine?

Post by Mkoll » Sat Apr 30, 2016 12:51 am

SarathW wrote:It is not easy if you are shopping when you are hungry.
;)
That brings up another tip: don't do that. Also, make a grocery list and stick to it—an excellent cross-platform list app is Wunderlist.
Namo tassa bhagavato arahato samma sambuddhassa
Namo tassa bhagavato arahato samma sambuddhassa
Namo tassa bhagavato arahato samma sambuddhassa

SarathW
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Re: Should we consume food only as a medicine?

Post by SarathW » Sat Apr 30, 2016 2:54 am

Yes, making a list also a great idea.
It help you to avoid running to the super market all the time.
If you do not go, you will not buy.
It is safe for the road and the environment and to your wallet too . (less travel)
“As the lamp consumes oil, the path realises Nibbana”

lostitude
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Re: Should we consume food only as a medicine?

Post by lostitude » Mon May 02, 2016 4:48 pm

Mkoll wrote:
lostitude wrote:Besides, I'd like to know how you would go about making eating more utilitarian in people who use it as an emotional tool. Any ideas on this?
Thanks!
A powerful perception is the "repulsiveness of food," found e.g. at AN 7.46 (Sanna Sutta). However, this perception is for serious practitioners or those who aren't very attached to food. For most of us, food is a really strong attachment. I find this perception really difficult because I'm very attached to food. I choose to focus on other perceptions for now.

More realistic ideas are common and you've probably heard them before: eat until you're satisfied or full instead of stuffed, eat for the health benefits of the particular food and its benefit to your diet, tackle the emotional problems directly, don't keep emotional food (high fat/salty/sugary processed foods usually) around the house, uncouple food from associations that lead to overeating (e.g. watching TV while eating associates watching TV with eating so whenever you watch TV, the craving for food will come up), think of the consequences of emotional eating/overeating and how bad you'll feel after, eat foods that fill you up for longer (e.g. fiber adds bulk and fat slows down digestion), try to eat at regular times, and don't beat yourself up! There are probably a few more, but those are the big ones that come to mind.
Yes I have heard and even given such tips in the past... until I realised they are nothing more than avoidance tips. They help you avoid the real issue, but not solve it.
So I find them useful to some extent but they can, and sometimes do, backfire if frustration builds up, so they should not be viewed as a permanent solution. The problem will be solved the day when I can sit in front of TV after and exhausting day, feeling vaguely depressed and bored, and yet If I notice this candy bar that I enjoy, waiting over there on the table for someone to eat it, I won't feel the urge to eat it. Anything short of that is not a problem solved, it's a problem period. I get the impression that aside from a full-fledged psychotherapy, only something such as mindfulness can help. But even mindfulness requires you to be mindful when the urge comes... and I don't know how many years of practice that would take...

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Mkoll
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Re: Should we consume food only as a medicine?

Post by Mkoll » Mon May 02, 2016 6:56 pm

lostitude wrote:
Mkoll wrote:
lostitude wrote:Besides, I'd like to know how you would go about making eating more utilitarian in people who use it as an emotional tool. Any ideas on this?
Thanks!
A powerful perception is the "repulsiveness of food," found e.g. at AN 7.46 (Sanna Sutta). However, this perception is for serious practitioners or those who aren't very attached to food. For most of us, food is a really strong attachment. I find this perception really difficult because I'm very attached to food. I choose to focus on other perceptions for now.

More realistic ideas are common and you've probably heard them before: eat until you're satisfied or full instead of stuffed, eat for the health benefits of the particular food and its benefit to your diet, tackle the emotional problems directly, don't keep emotional food (high fat/salty/sugary processed foods usually) around the house, uncouple food from associations that lead to overeating (e.g. watching TV while eating associates watching TV with eating so whenever you watch TV, the craving for food will come up), think of the consequences of emotional eating/overeating and how bad you'll feel after, eat foods that fill you up for longer (e.g. fiber adds bulk and fat slows down digestion), try to eat at regular times, and don't beat yourself up! There are probably a few more, but those are the big ones that come to mind.
Yes I have heard and even given such tips in the past... until I realised they are nothing more than avoidance tips. They help you avoid the real issue, but not solve it.

So I find them useful to some extent but they can, and sometimes do, backfire if frustration builds up, so they should not be viewed as a permanent solution.
Is the glass half-full or half-empty? I can't solve the problem of getting sick from time to time, but I can do a darn good job of avoiding it by eating healthy, exercising, washing my hands, etc. And that's definitely better than getting sick more often. Same idea here.
lostitude wrote:The problem will be solved the day when I can sit in front of TV after and exhausting day, feeling vaguely depressed and bored, and yet If I notice this candy bar that I enjoy, waiting over there on the table for someone to eat it, I won't feel the urge to eat it. Anything short of that is not a problem solved, it's a problem period. I get the impression that aside from a full-fledged psychotherapy, only something such as mindfulness can help. But even mindfulness requires you to be mindful when the urge comes... and I don't know how many years of practice that would take...
Why is the candy bar there? Because you bought it and brought it home. Why are you depressed and bored? I don't know, but that is a condition for emotional eating so working on that will help.

Another way to look at it is: so what if you eat the candy bar? A daily candy bar indulgence is hardly a problem if you eat healthy and exercise.

You can figure out a sustainable approach that works for you.
Namo tassa bhagavato arahato samma sambuddhassa
Namo tassa bhagavato arahato samma sambuddhassa
Namo tassa bhagavato arahato samma sambuddhassa

lostitude
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Re: Should we consume food only as a medicine?

Post by lostitude » Mon May 02, 2016 8:43 pm

Of course, prctically speaking it all makes perfect sense, but why be content with only a half-full glass while it could/should be full?
Why be happy with painkillers when your headaches are caused by a tumor that can be removed? why spend your life walking with crutches after an accident when you can get reeducation to walk without them? etc.

Isn't what buddhism is all about? uprooting the causes of suffering instead of trying to make do with it?

on a sidenote, buying sweets for your kids and ending up eating half the bag before they get home is not unheard of :)

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Mkoll
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Re: Should we consume food only as a medicine?

Post by Mkoll » Tue May 03, 2016 2:11 am

lostitude wrote:Of course, prctically speaking it all makes perfect sense, but why be content with only a half-full glass while it could/should be full?
Why be happy with painkillers when your headaches are caused by a tumor that can be removed? why spend your life walking with crutches after an accident when you can get reeducation to walk without them? etc.

Isn't what buddhism is all about? uprooting the causes of suffering instead of trying to make do with it?
Ultimately, yes. But to really focus on that, you have to live either as a monastic or very close to it as a householder. But even more essentially, you have to have the confidence and motivation to actually strive to attain enlightenment. Ajahn Chah said Nibbana is on the shores of death because you have to literally be willing to put your life on the line to attain it. A great master like Ajahn Chah put himself through incredible challenges and travails voluntarily to train his mind. And he did this for years and years, day in and day out, before he began to teach.

Very few of us, both monastics and laypeople, have that kind of olympian determination. For those of us who don't, we work with what we do have and make the best of it. Even Ajahn Chah acted foolishly when he was younger. As a young village monk, he would use money and sneak out to get Chinese noodles outside the prescribed meal time.

The Buddha didn't ask householders to give up their lives and become monastics. He taught them practices and ways of living that they could apply to their normal lives to make them better for themselves and others. He taught this way for good reasons.
Namo tassa bhagavato arahato samma sambuddhassa
Namo tassa bhagavato arahato samma sambuddhassa
Namo tassa bhagavato arahato samma sambuddhassa

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