mikenz66 wrote: ↑Mon Aug 06, 2018 9:37 pmNot at all.
If we take a text-critical approach then comparisons between suttas and agamas from different schools indicated that there were variations in organisation of the nikayas, and within suttas. However, the meanings are quite consistent across the collections, so we can be reasonably confident that they reflect the understanding of the Dhamma reasonably soon after the passing away of the Buddha, and so, presumably, they are representative of the Dhamma that the Buddha taught. However, from this text-critical perspective, it would not be reasonable to say: "this is exactly what the Buddha spoke".
Of course there are other perspectives. One could take the view that the Theravada commentaries that indicate that the suttas are what was recited at the first council, that the Abhidhamma was taught to the Buddha's mother in Tavatimsa heaven and to Sariputta. And that the sutras and agamas of the other, schismatic, schools are unreliable. From that point of view the text-critical analysis is irrelevant.
Of course, some might argue that the latter view is similar to the view that the Mahayana sutras were spoken by the Buddha, and preserved by Nagas for centuries.
It is helpful to recognise that people with these different viewpoints are, in a sense, talking about "different Buddhas". See, for example: https://discourse.suttacentral.net/t/bh ... ons/3466/5
For effective practice one needs confidence in the foundations of what one is practicing. How one gains this confidence depends on the individual, and I would be hesitant to recommend abandoning particular viewpoints just because they don't agree with some other type of analysis. For example, if one is a committed traditional Theravada practitioner, then worrying too much about text-critical analysis may not be helpful.
Mike
Are there two types of satipaṭṭhāna; where one type has jhana?
Re: Are there two types of satipaṭṭhāna; where one type has jhana?
Had this been some random sutta I would understand, but this is about the Satipatthana Sutta. I was introduced to Buddhism through Mahayana but their theaching are scattered and all over the place and they have no complete canon that I am aware of, so it is sad to know the Suttas have been tampered with.
Re: Are there two types of satipaṭṭhāna; where one type has jhana?
Are you not Mahayana? If not then sorry...
As for the suttas, take it up with Ajahn Sujato.
As for the suttas, take it up with Ajahn Sujato.
Re: Are there two types of satipaṭṭhāna; where one type has jhana?
Whether or not I am a Mahāyānika (incidentally, I am) isn't really related to whether or not that was an ad hom. My tastes in scriptures doesnt really effect whether or not some old Buddhist scriptures are composite creations.
Ven Sujato, in the thread on SuttaCentral, said that "calling it a forgery is too far".
Last edited by Coëmgenu on Tue Aug 07, 2018 1:00 am, edited 3 times in total.
What is the Uncreated?
Sublime & free, what is that obscured Eternity?
It is the Undying, the Bright, the Isle.
It is an Ocean, a Secret: Reality.
Both life and oblivion, it is Nirvāṇa.
Sublime & free, what is that obscured Eternity?
It is the Undying, the Bright, the Isle.
It is an Ocean, a Secret: Reality.
Both life and oblivion, it is Nirvāṇa.
Re: Are there two types of satipaṭṭhāna; where one type has jhana?
He did how ever say it was not authentic.
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Re: Are there two types of satipaṭṭhāna; where one type has jhana?
Hi, I understand that jhana can come and go in sleep or half sleep when lying down, or in meditation, or in technique which for me is a doing attachment. I understand that its appearance depends on the person but my understanding is that it is not anatta and not dharma and therefore might only somewhat be useful for purification and concentration.
Is jhana dependant on a body? Anatta and dharma are not.
What do you think?
Also time to differentiate these states, often used by neo enlightened authors, 'enlightenment' being a misnomer and almost opposite in meaning to emptines, from anatta and dharma. I wish some authority would make an official statement say from Mandalay to take care of these clever wordy characters taking too much attention from pure hearted beginners. It upsets me alot.
Yes I am new here and needed some help with definitions but the above still stands. By the way AB also has a video on sound of silence and the ringing in the ears. Ok there's alot of stuff out there that needs to be corrected. But no it hasn't been.
Is jhana dependant on a body? Anatta and dharma are not.
What do you think?
Also time to differentiate these states, often used by neo enlightened authors, 'enlightenment' being a misnomer and almost opposite in meaning to emptines, from anatta and dharma. I wish some authority would make an official statement say from Mandalay to take care of these clever wordy characters taking too much attention from pure hearted beginners. It upsets me alot.
Yes I am new here and needed some help with definitions but the above still stands. By the way AB also has a video on sound of silence and the ringing in the ears. Ok there's alot of stuff out there that needs to be corrected. But no it hasn't been.