I'm interested in better understanding the cultural mindset of the typical "Jambudipan" the Buddha taught. I realize that there were significant differences in worldview between castes and between followers of various sects, and so there's not just one mindset. But I'm looking for the shared cultural influences that would be common to all people at the time -- the foundational mindset that would be common to all. I hope that the better I can sort of put myself in the mindset of the average savaka at the time of the Buddha, the better I may be able to understand the references, allusions, structures, etc. of the suttas.
In that respect, I'm looking for books and articles that I could study that would describe these core culutural beliefs and values and help me to better understand the mindset of the audience to whom the Buddha was teaching. Any suggestions?
With gratitude,
katavedi
Cultural mindset of early Buddhists
Cultural mindset of early Buddhists
“But, Gotamī, when you know of certain things: ‘These things lead to dispassion, not to passion; to detachment, not to attachment; to diminution, not to accumulation; to having few wishes, not to having many wishes; to contentment, not to discontent; to seclusion, not to socializing; to the arousing of energy, not to indolence; to simple living, not to luxurious living’ – of such things you can be certain: ‘This is the Dhamma; this is the Discipline; this is the Master’s Teaching.’”
Re: Cultural mindset of early Buddhists
This may some help.
World religions.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CmEWtEl ... dY8XDn4KAH" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
World religions.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CmEWtEl ... dY8XDn4KAH" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
“As the lamp consumes oil, the path realises Nibbana”
Re: Cultural mindset of early Buddhists
Thank you, Sarath, but I'm not looking for an introduction to Buddhism. I'm looking more specifically for a better understanding of the shared cultural mindset of the people living in the Greater Magadha region during the period of time that the Buddha taught. In other words, the shared myths, stories, values, and other cultural references which may underlie many of the suttas.
I've gotten some bits and pieces from Gombrich's works, from some of Ven. Analayo's writings, and from Joanna Jurewicz and Linda Blanchard's theses (regarding the Vedic hymn of creation), and these were all helpful, but I'd like much more information than I've found so far.
I've gotten some bits and pieces from Gombrich's works, from some of Ven. Analayo's writings, and from Joanna Jurewicz and Linda Blanchard's theses (regarding the Vedic hymn of creation), and these were all helpful, but I'd like much more information than I've found so far.
“But, Gotamī, when you know of certain things: ‘These things lead to dispassion, not to passion; to detachment, not to attachment; to diminution, not to accumulation; to having few wishes, not to having many wishes; to contentment, not to discontent; to seclusion, not to socializing; to the arousing of energy, not to indolence; to simple living, not to luxurious living’ – of such things you can be certain: ‘This is the Dhamma; this is the Discipline; this is the Master’s Teaching.’”
Re: Cultural mindset of early Buddhists
I recommend "India: A history" by John Keay, very insightful work which covers the time leading up to, the Buddha's reign and even right after.
Re: Cultural mindset of early Buddhists
Geoffrey Samuel's The Origins of Yoga and Tantra: Indic Religions to the Thirteenth Century may be just what you are looking for. It's not solely about Buddhism, but it's highly recommended.
All the best,
Jon
All the best,
Jon
Re: Cultural mindset of early Buddhists
Great suggestions, jonnos and ihrjordan. I checked out the TOCs of these books on amazon, and they both look like they'd provide the kind of information I'm looking for. The India one is only $5.99 on Kindle, too! Offsets the steep price of the other one.
katavedi
katavedi
“But, Gotamī, when you know of certain things: ‘These things lead to dispassion, not to passion; to detachment, not to attachment; to diminution, not to accumulation; to having few wishes, not to having many wishes; to contentment, not to discontent; to seclusion, not to socializing; to the arousing of energy, not to indolence; to simple living, not to luxurious living’ – of such things you can be certain: ‘This is the Dhamma; this is the Discipline; this is the Master’s Teaching.’”
Re: Cultural mindset of early Buddhists
Now this is the right approach -)I'm interested in better understanding the cultural mindset of the typical "Jambudipan" the Buddha taught. I realize that there were significant differences in worldview between castes and between followers of various sects, and so there's not just one mindset. But I'm looking for the shared cultural influences that would be common to all people at the time -- the foundational mindset that would be common to all. I hope that the better I can sort of put myself in the mindset of the average savaka at the time of the Buddha, the better I may be able to understand the references, allusions, structures, etc. of the suttas.
However, I pick this very information from the suttas themselves.
Re: Cultural mindset of early Buddhists
A couple of free old books, these versions are quite well scanned, and the djvu files available in "SHOW ALL" are perhaps clearer than the pdf ones:
The Cambridge History of India, Vol. I, Ancient India (1922)
https://archive.org/details/cambridgehistory01rapsuoft" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
Buddhist India by Davids, T. W. Rhys (1903)
https://archive.org/details/buddhistindia00davirich" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
Then of course the Suttas, and the viewpoints of the "others" in Vedas and Upanishads and Jaina Sutras???
Vedas and Upanishads:
http://www.sacred-texts.com/hin/index.htm" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
Jaina Sutras:
http://www.sacred-texts.com/jai/index.htm" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
The Cambridge History of India, Vol. I, Ancient India (1922)
https://archive.org/details/cambridgehistory01rapsuoft" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
Buddhist India by Davids, T. W. Rhys (1903)
https://archive.org/details/buddhistindia00davirich" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
Then of course the Suttas, and the viewpoints of the "others" in Vedas and Upanishads and Jaina Sutras???
Vedas and Upanishads:
http://www.sacred-texts.com/hin/index.htm" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
Jaina Sutras:
http://www.sacred-texts.com/jai/index.htm" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
Re: Cultural mindset of early Buddhists
Thank you very much, JiWe. I've spent the morning reading the relevant chapters of the Cambridge History and am now starting on Rhys Davids' book. Very much in line with what I was looking for.
With metta,
katavedi
With metta,
katavedi
“But, Gotamī, when you know of certain things: ‘These things lead to dispassion, not to passion; to detachment, not to attachment; to diminution, not to accumulation; to having few wishes, not to having many wishes; to contentment, not to discontent; to seclusion, not to socializing; to the arousing of energy, not to indolence; to simple living, not to luxurious living’ – of such things you can be certain: ‘This is the Dhamma; this is the Discipline; this is the Master’s Teaching.’”
Re: Cultural mindset of early Buddhists
I realize I'm years late in answering, but in case anyone else reads this thread and is looking for sources, or katavedi is still following that line of thought, Brian K. Smith's Reflections On Resemblance, Ritual, and Religion is the book I have found the most useful.
metta
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Re: Cultural mindset of early Buddhists
I would also like to know more about this, having been through the same sources you mention. Maybe archeology is the right domain to search in? Anthropology and archeology? I'll do some digging.katavedi wrote: ↑Wed Dec 09, 2015 12:38 am I'm looking more specifically for a better understanding of the shared cultural mindset of the people living in the Greater Magadha region during the period of time that the Buddha taught. In other words, the shared myths, stories, values, and other cultural references which may underlie many of the suttas.
I've gotten some bits and pieces from Gombrich's works, from some of Ven. Analayo's writings, and from Joanna Jurewicz and Linda Blanchard's theses (regarding the Vedic hymn of creation), and these were all helpful, but I'd like much more information than I've found so far.
There are also a couple of users here who might be able to point in the right direction, like Dmytro, Coemgenu, and Sylvester.
"Does Master Gotama have any position at all?"
"A 'position,' Vaccha, is something that a Tathagata has done away with. What a Tathagata sees is this: 'Such is form, such its origination, such its disappearance; such is feeling, such its origination, such its disappearance; such is perception...such are fabrications...such is consciousness, such its origination, such its disappearance.'" - Aggi-Vacchagotta Sutta
'Dust thou art, and unto dust thou shalt return.' - Genesis 3:19
'Some fart freely, some try to hide and silence it. Which one is correct?' - Saegnapha
"A 'position,' Vaccha, is something that a Tathagata has done away with. What a Tathagata sees is this: 'Such is form, such its origination, such its disappearance; such is feeling, such its origination, such its disappearance; such is perception...such are fabrications...such is consciousness, such its origination, such its disappearance.'" - Aggi-Vacchagotta Sutta
'Dust thou art, and unto dust thou shalt return.' - Genesis 3:19
'Some fart freely, some try to hide and silence it. Which one is correct?' - Saegnapha
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- Joined: Mon Apr 17, 2017 11:11 am
- Location: London
Re: Cultural mindset of early Buddhists
Oh.. yes I didn't see that either. Still open for answers - will check out that book you mention.nowheat wrote: ↑Wed Feb 27, 2019 3:03 am
I realize I'm years late in answering, but in case anyone else reads this thread and is looking for sources, or katavedi is still following that line of thought, Brian K. Smith's Reflections On Resemblance, Ritual, and Religion is the book I have found the most useful.
metta
"Does Master Gotama have any position at all?"
"A 'position,' Vaccha, is something that a Tathagata has done away with. What a Tathagata sees is this: 'Such is form, such its origination, such its disappearance; such is feeling, such its origination, such its disappearance; such is perception...such are fabrications...such is consciousness, such its origination, such its disappearance.'" - Aggi-Vacchagotta Sutta
'Dust thou art, and unto dust thou shalt return.' - Genesis 3:19
'Some fart freely, some try to hide and silence it. Which one is correct?' - Saegnapha
"A 'position,' Vaccha, is something that a Tathagata has done away with. What a Tathagata sees is this: 'Such is form, such its origination, such its disappearance; such is feeling, such its origination, such its disappearance; such is perception...such are fabrications...such is consciousness, such its origination, such its disappearance.'" - Aggi-Vacchagotta Sutta
'Dust thou art, and unto dust thou shalt return.' - Genesis 3:19
'Some fart freely, some try to hide and silence it. Which one is correct?' - Saegnapha