What is delusion?

A forum for beginners and members of other Buddhist traditions to ask questions about Theravāda (The Way of the Elders). Responses require moderator approval before they are visible.
Post Reply
jwalker
Posts: 2
Joined: Sun Jan 14, 2018 8:05 pm

What is delusion?

Post by jwalker » Tue Aug 14, 2018 3:16 am

Hi all, of the three unwholesome roots - greed/aversion/delusion - I am still unsure of what is even meant by delusion in the buddhist sense. Is delusion the process of creating the "Self" image? Is delusion making ourselves neurotic? Is it ignorance - that we dont even know we are creating suffering? or is it just holding wrong beliefs and generally causing mischief?
Any help would be appreciated.
:buddha1:

User avatar
cappuccino
Posts: 1525
Joined: Thu Feb 11, 2016 1:45 am

Re: What is delusion?

Post by cappuccino » Tue Aug 14, 2018 3:40 am

saying you "don't believe in" something

such as karma, afterlife

SarathW
Posts: 9987
Joined: Mon Sep 10, 2012 2:49 am

Re: What is delusion?

Post by SarathW » Tue Aug 14, 2018 3:43 am

According to Theravada teaching it is not knowing Four Noble Truths.
“As the lamp consumes oil, the path realises Nibbana”

pegembara
Posts: 1286
Joined: Tue Oct 13, 2009 8:39 am

Re: What is delusion?

Post by pegembara » Tue Aug 14, 2018 5:12 am

Expecting impermanent things to remain permanent, thinking that stressful things are pleasurable eg. the chase for fame/fortune/good looks and believing that the body, thoughts, feelings, perceptions are ours.
And what is right speech? Abstaining from lying, from divisive speech, from abusive speech, & from idle chatter: This is called right speech.

User avatar
Bundokji
Posts: 1682
Joined: Mon Nov 24, 2014 11:57 pm

Re: What is delusion?

Post by Bundokji » Tue Aug 14, 2018 7:07 am

Inability to differentiate between the essential and the unessential
Those who mistake the unessential to be essential and the essential to be unessential, dwelling in wrong thoughts, never arrive at the essential.
And the Blessed One addressed the bhikkhus, saying: "Behold now, bhikkhus, I exhort you: All compounded things are subject to vanish. Strive with earnestness!"

This was the last word of the Tathagata.

Dinsdale
Posts: 5930
Joined: Fri Mar 05, 2010 10:32 am
Location: Andromeda looks nice

Re: What is delusion?

Post by Dinsdale » Tue Aug 14, 2018 8:06 am

This is from the Vipallasa Sutta:

"When those with discernment listen,
they regain their senses,
seeing the inconstant as inconstant,
the stressful as stressful,
what's not-self as not-self,
the unattractive as unattractive.
Undertaking right view,
they transcend all stress & suffering."

https://www.accesstoinsight.org/tipitak ... .than.html
Buddha save me from new-agers!

paul
Posts: 1233
Joined: Tue May 31, 2011 11:27 pm
Location: Vietnam

Re: What is delusion?

Post by paul » Tue Aug 14, 2018 11:01 am

Ignorance, the three marks of existence, and vipassana:

“At the cognitive level, which is its most basic sphere of operation, ignorance infiltrates our perceptions, thoughts, and views, so that we come to misconstrue our experience overlaying it with multiple strata of delusions. The most important of these delusions are three: the delusion of seeing permanence in the impermanent, of seeing satisfactionin the unsatisfactory, and of seeing a self in the selfless. Thus we take ourselves and our world to be solid, stable, enduring entities, despite the ubiquitous reminders that everything is subject to change and detruction. We assume we have an innate right to pleasure and direct our efforts to increasing and intensifying our enjoyment with an anticipatory fervour undaunted by repeated encounters with pain, disappointment and frustration. And we perceive ourselves as self-contained egos, clinging to various ideas and images we form of ourselves as the irrefragable truth of our identity.

Wheras ignorance obscures the true nature of things, wisdom removes the veils of distortion, enabling us to see phenomena in their fundamental mode of being with the vivacity of direct perception. The training in wisdom centers on the development of insight (vipassana-bhavana), a deep and comprehensive seeing into the nature of exstence which fathoms the truth of our being in the only sphere where it is directly accessible to us, namely in our own experience.”—“The Noble Eightfold Path”, Bikkhu Bodhi.

SarathW
Posts: 9987
Joined: Mon Sep 10, 2012 2:49 am

Re: What is delusion?

Post by SarathW » Tue Aug 14, 2018 11:43 am

greed/aversion/delusion
If you take delusion in above context which means the household equanimity (Upekkha).
Basically, delusion means not knowing the reality.
“As the lamp consumes oil, the path realises Nibbana”

Circle5
Posts: 894
Joined: Wed May 31, 2017 2:14 am

Re: What is delusion?

Post by Circle5 » Fri Aug 17, 2018 10:10 pm

English language has expressions like "getting hyped up", "don't believe the hype", etc. In my country we call that "getting into a movie". For example teenagers might get hyped up on being cool. Others might get hyped up in the ganger movie. A pimp might get hyped up on how "he is somebody", on how he "does not give a F about police" and stuff like that. His head is caught into the gangster movie. That's why one of the 40 rules of pimping is "don't believe the hype". He should stay focused on the money and not get hyped up like that. Normal people get hyped up into how collage makes them "be somebody", how their job makes them be "from the upper class" etc. and get hyped up like that, get into that movie.

Delusion is that thing that they have due to being hyped up/being into a movie. Besides getting hyped up, there is also delusion that appears due to normal attachments that don't necessarily require one to be into a movie. For example an alcoholic might claim alcohol is not causing him any problem, that it's not detrimental for him. A drug user might say the same. If he would not have attachment for alcohol or drugs, he would have a normal and objective opinion about that habit, his thinking would not be influenced by delusion.

User avatar
DooDoot
Posts: 2723
Joined: Tue Aug 08, 2017 11:06 pm

Re: What is delusion?

Post by DooDoot » Sat Aug 18, 2018 4:09 am

jwalker wrote:
Tue Aug 14, 2018 3:16 am
I am still unsure of what is even meant by delusion in the buddhist sense. Is delusion the process of creating the "Self" image?
Hi JW. Yes. Delusion is the process of creating the "Self" image. On a social level, delusion also includes selfishness & ingratitude.
jwalker wrote:
Tue Aug 14, 2018 3:16 am
Is delusion making ourselves neurotic?
Yes. Any type of confusion, fear, anxiety, etc, is a form of "delusion".
jwalker wrote:
Tue Aug 14, 2018 3:16 am
Is it ignorance - that we dont even know we are creating suffering? or is it just holding wrong beliefs and generally causing mischief?
Yes. All of the above. "Ignorance" is an inherent/underlying lack of understanding and "delusion" is the manifestation of ignorance in relation to a sense or life experience.

User avatar
Aloka
Posts: 5789
Joined: Wed Jan 21, 2009 2:51 pm

Re: What is delusion?

Post by Aloka » Sat Aug 18, 2018 8:48 pm

jwalker wrote:
Tue Aug 14, 2018 3:16 am
Hi all, of the three unwholesome roots - greed/aversion/delusion - I am still unsure of what is even meant by delusion in the buddhist sense. Is delusion the process of creating the "Self" image? Is delusion making ourselves neurotic? Is it ignorance - that we dont even know we are creating suffering? or is it just holding wrong beliefs and generally causing mischief?
Any help would be appreciated.
:buddha1:
This talk "Delusion" given by by Ajahn Sumedho a few years ago might be helpful:

https://www.amaravati.org/audio/delusion/

:anjali:

Post Reply

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 16 guests