Ohlala!Dmytro wrote:Hi Vincent,
There's a thread about this:ToVincent wrote:However, śarīra, the physical body, is not kāya, the "body", viz. the "organs" of early Indian philosophy.
Note that here, "organs" do not just mean the ear, the nose, the liver, the stomach, etc.
Although what I mean in my previous post, has very little to do with what comes below, I am marveling at where we are heading to here; with this odd habit of you, to take references out of the context of the EBTs (or without parallels).
It, quite often, makes things a lot more complicated than they seem.
Let's take the eye, for example.
For you, at the time of Buddha:
- the physical eye was "akkhi" (a word that does not appear in the EBTs, with parallels).
- and the "sight" (the faculty,) was "cakkhu".
On my part, I consider the eye, in the perspective of what is depicted in SN 22.47 - (viz. related to the descent (avakkanti) of the faculties (indriyāni) of the grounds or fields of experience (āyatanāni).
That is to say "cakkhu" - as an āyatana - an "eye" that is both the physical eye without its faculty (sight), and "cakkhu" as an "eye" with its faculty.
(see note as the bottom of this page https://justpaste.it/18u12).
In other words, (from my reading of the EBTs, with parallels) I consider cakkhu as a general field of experience that is, or not, propeled by its indriya.
From the above extract, would you say that:Passati bhagavā cakkhunā rūpaṃ,
the Blessed One sees a form with the eye,
Chandarāgo bhagavato natthi.
yet there is no desire and lust in the Blessed One.
The Blessed One, because he restrains his faculties (indriyāni), has no "sight"(?) - which explains that he has no desire and lust?
We are in the sensory realm.
We are here, first and before all, into sensory experiences, through the six internal āyatanāni.
It's not the "sight" that counts. It is the nature of the experience*, through the six fields of sensory experience.
* something that "some", don't want to see change.
What is the "range" of certain "organs" was my real underlying question.
Are these experiences all through the "sensory" realm (saḷāyatana); or is there vedanā out of the sensory realm?