Is the idea that Nibbāna is seen at each of 4 stages of awakening canonical?

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pitakele
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Re: Is the idea that Nibbāna is seen at each of 4 stages of awakening canonical?

Post by pitakele » Tue Jun 19, 2018 11:09 am

mikenz66 wrote:
Mon Jun 18, 2018 4:03 am

Hmm, that's a pity. They'll make them available a few months after the end of the course, which is in a couple of weeks.

All that it has are additions such as Ireland's translation:
https://suttacentral.net/en/iti44

Inserted in relevant places. Here are some of the others:
Thank you for the useful resources. It is interesting that a more accurate translation of Itivuttaka 44 has been added to Sermon 18. The original mistranslation was crucial to some points Bhante was making in that sermon, so I wonder if his conclusions altered? I will check out the full sermon when it becomes available [assuming I am still alive that time :) ]
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mikenz66
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Re: Is the idea that Nibbāna is seen at each of 4 stages of awakening canonical?

Post by mikenz66 » Tue Jun 19, 2018 12:52 pm

Ven KN's Sermon would not have changed. The addition is by Ven Analayo. Keep in mind that the sermons were given in Sinhala 30 years ago and translated (by him) and recorded ten years or so later. Ven Analayo then transcribed them. Ven Analayo mentioned last year that the English translations Ven KN had were the old PTS ones. Clearly he would not need the English translations himself - he would have put them in for those of us who are not fluent in Pali - so he may not have paid much attention to the wording of the English translations.

Do you think that the translation is really affecting his conclusions, or is it just that he keeps using an outdated translation?

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pitakele
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Re: Is the idea that Nibbāna is seen at each of 4 stages of awakening canonical?

Post by pitakele » Tue Jun 19, 2018 2:20 pm

mikenz66 wrote:
Tue Jun 19, 2018 12:52 pm

Do you think that the translation is really affecting his conclusions, or is it just that he keeps using an outdated translation?
Thank you for your reply. I am aware of the process of trancripting & translating the sermons. In Sermon 18, Bhante expounds on the mistranslated terms I mentioned earlier, so they do form part of his argument. I am a great fan of Bhante's works, but disagree with his conclusions in this sermon. Similarly, I disagree with his exposition of M131 Bhaddekaratta Sutta in the Wheel publication 'An Excellent Lover of Solitude'. Bhikku Bodhi and others usually translate this as 'A Single Excellent Night'.
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