Does the Pali Canon make direct mention of the Matikas

Discussion of Abhidhamma and related Commentaries

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zan
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Joined: Sun Aug 28, 2016 1:57 pm

Does the Pali Canon make direct mention of the Matikas

Postby zan » Sun Aug 28, 2016 2:48 pm

Does the Pali Canon ever directly mention the Matikas?
Last edited by zan on Sat Nov 05, 2016 2:17 pm, edited 5 times in total.
I don't have much knowledge of the Dhamma, I'm just a beginner. Keep that in mind before you take anything I say too seriously :tongue:

Jones
Posts: 72
Joined: Thu Aug 14, 2014 9:37 pm

Re: Was the Buddha ever recorded as directly speaking about matikas etc.?

Postby Jones » Sun Aug 28, 2016 7:06 pm

Hi,

Finally in the Nikaya suttas or Vinaya does he ever speak in language identical to or at least extremely similar to the Abhidhamma in such a way that it would be clear that the Sutta is quoting (or extremely similar to) the Abhidhamma and not that the similarity would point to that the Abhidhamma was quoting (or extremely similar to) the Sutta?

Majjhima Nikaya 111 is very similar to the Dhamasangani and the Vibhanga for example-

The Blessed One said, "Monks, Sariputta is wise, of great discernment, deep discernment, wide... joyous... rapid... quick... penetrating discernment. For half a month, Sariputta clearly saw insight[1] into mental qualities one after another. This is what occurred to Sariputta through insight into mental qualities one after another:

"There was the case where Sariputta — quite secluded from sensuality, secluded from unskillful qualities — entered & remained in the first jhana: rapture & pleasure born of seclusion, accompanied by directed thought & evaluation. Whatever qualities there are in the first jhana — directed thought, evaluation, rapture, pleasure, singleness of mind, contact, feeling, perception, intention, consciousness,[2] desire, decision, persistence, mindfulness, equanimity, & attention — he ferreted them out one after another. Known to him they arose, known to him they remained, known to him they subsided. He discerned, 'So this is how these qualities, not having been, come into play. Having been, they vanish.' He remained unattracted & unrepelled with regard to those qualities, independent, detached, released, dissociated, with an awareness rid of barriers. He discerned that 'There is a further escape,' and pursuing it there really was for him.


http://www.accesstoinsight.org/tipitaka ... .than.html
:anjali:

zan
Posts: 403
Joined: Sun Aug 28, 2016 1:57 pm

Re: Was the Buddha ever recorded as directly speaking about matikas etc.?

Postby zan » Mon Aug 29, 2016 3:06 am

Jones wrote:Hi,

Finally in the Nikaya suttas or Vinaya does he ever speak in language identical to or at least extremely similar to the Abhidhamma in such a way that it would be clear that the Sutta is quoting (or extremely similar to) the Abhidhamma and not that the similarity would point to that the Abhidhamma was quoting (or extremely similar to) the Sutta?

Majjhima Nikaya 111 is very similar to the Dhamasangani and the Vibhanga for example-

The Blessed One said, "Monks, Sariputta is wise, of great discernment, deep discernment, wide... joyous... rapid... quick... penetrating discernment. For half a month, Sariputta clearly saw insight[1] into mental qualities one after another. This is what occurred to Sariputta through insight into mental qualities one after another:

"There was the case where Sariputta — quite secluded from sensuality, secluded from unskillful qualities — entered & remained in the first jhana: rapture & pleasure born of seclusion, accompanied by directed thought & evaluation. Whatever qualities there are in the first jhana — directed thought, evaluation, rapture, pleasure, singleness of mind, contact, feeling, perception, intention, consciousness,[2] desire, decision, persistence, mindfulness, equanimity, & attention — he ferreted them out one after another. Known to him they arose, known to him they remained, known to him they subsided. He discerned, 'So this is how these qualities, not having been, come into play. Having been, they vanish.' He remained unattracted & unrepelled with regard to those qualities, independent, detached, released, dissociated, with an awareness rid of barriers. He discerned that 'There is a further escape,' and pursuing it there really was for him.


http://www.accesstoinsight.org/tipitaka ... .than.html
:anjali:


Thank you for your reply. Sorry I edited my original post, I realized it started to ramble and was making my question(s) too vague.

If you re-read it now, could you answer it again please?
I don't have much knowledge of the Dhamma, I'm just a beginner. Keep that in mind before you take anything I say too seriously :tongue:

zan
Posts: 403
Joined: Sun Aug 28, 2016 1:57 pm

Re: Does the Pali Canon make direct mention of Matika?

Postby zan » Sat Nov 05, 2016 2:16 pm

Turns out it does. In DN 16 they are spoken of.
I don't have much knowledge of the Dhamma, I'm just a beginner. Keep that in mind before you take anything I say too seriously :tongue:


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