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Re: Vegetarians live longer

Posted: Thu Jun 27, 2013 1:03 am
by reflection
While I'm all for vegetarianism, those studies only show correlations. It doesn't show it is the diet per se that makes one live longer. Vegetarians in general also smoke and drink less, I think sport more, and in other ways are more conscious about their health.

Re: Vegetarians live longer

Posted: Thu Jun 27, 2013 1:20 am
by Ben
retrofuturist wrote:Greetings,
The Age wrote:
People who follow a vegetarian diet can enjoy an almost 12 per cent lower mortality rate than their meat loving counterparts, a new study has found.
So only 88% of vegetarians die?

:jumping:

Metta,
Retro. :)
Oh, you are so funny!
All vegetarians die, Paul.
The study found that their mortality compared to non vegetarians is 12 percent lower.

A longer life to experience more dukkha or engage in Dhamma practice.
Relection wrote:While I'm all for vegetarianism, those studies only show correlations. It doesn't show it is the diet per se that makes one live longer. Vegetarians in general also smoke and drink less, I think sport more, and in other ways are more conscious about their health.
Diet was assessed at baseline by a quantitative food frequency questionnaire and categorized into 5 dietary patterns: nonvegetarian, semi-vegetarian, pesco-vegetarian, lacto-ovo–vegetarian, and vegan.

There were 2570 deaths among 73 308 participants during a mean follow-up time of 5.79 years. The mortality rate was 6.05 (95% CI, 5.82-6.29) deaths per 1000 person-years. The adjusted hazard ratio (HR) for all-cause mortality in all vegetarians combined vs nonvegetarians was 0.88 (95% CI, 0.80-0.97). The adjusted HR for all-cause mortality in vegans was 0.85 (95% CI, 0.73-1.01); in lacto-ovo–vegetarians, 0.91 (95% CI, 0.82-1.00); in pesco-vegetarians, 0.81 (95% CI, 0.69-0.94); and in semi-vegetarians, 0.92 (95% CI, 0.75-1.13) compared with nonvegetarians. Significant associations with vegetarian diets were detected for cardiovascular mortality, noncardiovascular noncancer mortality, renal mortality, and endocrine mortality. Associations in men were larger and more often significant than were those in women.
-- Vegetarian Dietary Patterns and Mortality in Adventist Health Study 2, JAMA Intern Med. 2013;():1-8. doi:10.1001/jamainternmed.2013.6473

Correlation or not, the evidence is compelling.

Re: Vegetarians live longer

Posted: Thu Jun 27, 2013 2:30 am
by SarathW
You can prove anything through research!
Just tell me the answer you need.
Having said that, I believe that the balance diet (including meat) and meditation (walking) may/ can extend your life.
I wonder whether I can prove this by a research of the life expectancy of a Buddhist Monk.

Re: Vegetarians live longer

Posted: Thu Jun 27, 2013 4:52 am
by Bhikkhu Pesala

Re: Vegetarians live longer

Posted: Thu Jun 27, 2013 5:14 am
by SarathW
Thanks venerable sir
I got the point.
Longer life is due to just more than the food.
It is not what you got (longer life) but what you do with it (attaining nirvana)
:) :meditate:

Re: Vegetarians live longer

Posted: Thu Jun 27, 2013 5:14 am
by SarathW
Thanks venerable sir
I got the point.
Longer life is due to just more than the food.
It is not what you got (longer life) but what you do with it (attaining nirvana)
:) :meditate:

Re: Vegetarians live longer

Posted: Thu Jun 27, 2013 7:51 am
by Doshin
Ben wrote:
People who follow a vegetarian diet can enjoy an almost 12 per cent lower mortality rate than their meat loving counterparts, a new study has found. The study, published in JAMA Internal Medicine in June, followed 70,000 members of the Seventh Day Adventist Church over a six year period.
"Vegetarian diets are associated with lower all-cause mortality and with some reductions in cause-specific mortality," the authors concluded. "Results appeared to be more robust in males. These favorable associations should be considered carefully by those offering dietary guidance."


Read more: http://www.theage.com.au/lifestyle/diet ... z2XNCu3w80
This is indeed interesting news.
If you follow the link in the article, you would see "Michael J. Orlich, MD". Another article about the same research:
http://media.jamanetwork.com/news-item/ ... -of-death/
The study notes that vegetarian groups tended to be older, more highly educated and more likely to be married, to drink less alcohol, to smoke less, to exercise more and to be thinner.

“Some evidence suggests vegetarian dietary patterns may be associated with reduced mortality, but the relationship is not well established,” the study notes.
".. but the relationship is not well established". In other words the research can not be used to prove that vegetarians live longer or be more healthy. It might easily be because of less alcohol/tobacco, less overweight and more exercise, that is the main cause for better health...

_/\_

Re: Vegetarians live longer

Posted: Thu Jun 27, 2013 7:59 am
by lyndon taylor
Well being a vegetarian obviously doesn't make you less healthy, one of the biggest pro meat eating arguements I hear is that you have to eat meat for your health and that a vegetarian diet leaves out key nutrients. at least we have evidence that arguement is bogus.

Obviously the Seventh Day Adventist sample group doesn't drink or smoke, however I thought the authors of the study were saying they had compensated for that in the Meat eating group. And I don't know how, but scientists are trying to tell us that some drinking lengthens our life.

Re: Vegetarians live longer

Posted: Thu Jun 27, 2013 8:37 am
by Doshin
lyndon taylor wrote:Well being a vegetarian obviously doesn't make you less healthy, one of the biggest pro meat eating arguements I hear is that you have to eat meat for your health and that a vegetarian diet leaves out key nutrients. at least we have evidence that arguement is bogus.
".. but the relationship is not well established" goes both ways ;) In theory it could be more exercise, less alcohol/tobacco and lower weight could compensate for a any theoretical negative side-effects of being vegetarian. But the research can not establish/prove that either.
lyndon taylor wrote:Obviously the Seventh Day Adventist sample group doesn't drink or smoke, however I thought the authors of the study were saying they had compensated for that in the Meat eating group. And I don't know how, but scientists are trying to tell us that some drinking lengthens our life.
As I read the articles, all groups of diets that is compared, is found within the Seventh Day Adventists. The longer living group has many (known health improving) characteristics, one of them being the diet. But no research/conclusion on how much each factor affects the result.

This reminds of a story running some years ago, claiming that research showed that a glass of whine a day, could extent your life, and generally improve your health. When someone researched the origins of the story, it turned out that the research was made in California, and the people who could afford a glass of whine, also could afford better health insurances, hence the best medical care. The benefits of better healthcare outweighed the negative influence of daily alcohol/whine.

_/\_

Re: Vegetarians live longer

Posted: Thu Jun 27, 2013 8:59 am
by lyndon taylor
Well then I can assure you that the meat eating Seventh Day Adventists do not drink or smoke either, so that makes the study quite effective, I don't think they would be any less likely to exercise either.SDA are about half vegetarian, half meat eating but they dont eat pork.

Re: Vegetarians live longer

Posted: Mon Jul 01, 2013 5:19 am
by SarathW
"But there is the case where a certain woman or man, abandoning the taking of life, abstains from the taking of life, dwelling with rod laid down, knife laid down, scrupulous, merciful, compassionate for the welfare of all living beings. From performing & undertaking such kamma, then on the breakup of the body, after death, this person re-appears in the good destinations, in the heavenly world. Or, if he/she does not reappear... in the heavenly world, but instead returns to the human state, then wherever he/she is reborn, he/she is long-lived. This is the way leading to long life, namely being one who, abandoning the taking of life, abstains from the taking of life..."

http://www.accesstoinsight.org/lib/auth ... part1.html

Re: Vegetarians live longer

Posted: Mon Jul 01, 2013 1:25 pm
by barcsimalsi
Long life or short life, rebirth is forcibly free so stop clinging to the old aggregates and enjoy some meat. :jumping:

Re: Vegetarians live longer

Posted: Mon Jul 01, 2013 2:00 pm
by LG2V
I believe this to be true. I've had some health problems clear up after switching to a lacto-ovo vegetarian diet. I think it also helps one avoid many of the dangers of intestinal/bodily parasites. That being said, I still haven't found a way to consume a completely vegan diet and maintain adequate energy levels, although I'd like to. Though, in my case the issue is complicated by food allergies.

EDIT: Corrected a typo.

Re: Vegetarians live longer

Posted: Wed Jul 03, 2013 2:58 pm
by alan
Healthy people live longer. They eat the appropriate amount of meat.
They also lift weights and do yoga. Healthy people make it their business to know what is right for the body--they don't subscribe to any one school of thought, they do what works.

Re: Vegetarians live longer

Posted: Wed Jul 03, 2013 4:24 pm
by lyndon taylor
But the study is comparing healthy people who eat meat, to healthy people that don't, and the ones that don't live some years longer. The SDA church encourages all their members to eat healthily, whether they are vegetarian or not, and that's who the stduy is based on.