Looking for resources on particularly Islamic Meditation techniques

Exploring Theravāda's connections to other paths - what can we learn from other traditions, religions and philosophies?
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rightviewftw
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Looking for resources on particularly Islamic Meditation techniques

Post by rightviewftw » Wed Apr 25, 2018 7:24 pm

As titled i am looking for resources on Islamic meditation techniques, teachers and manuals.
Feel free to just dump info here relative to the subject.
Last edited by rightviewftw on Wed Apr 25, 2018 7:26 pm, edited 1 time in total.
He goes to Niraya, the one who asserts what didn't take place, as does the one who, having done, says, 'I didn't.' Both — low-acting people — there become equal: after death, in the world beyond.
Tyranny of Words - An Introduction to General Semantics
How to Meditate: Mindfulness of Breathing
Factors of Enlightenment & Perceptions
How to Meditate: Basic Satipatthana
Parallel Dhammapada Reading

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Sam Vara
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Re: lLooking for resources on Islamic Meditation techniques

Post by Sam Vara » Wed Apr 25, 2018 7:26 pm

You might want to try PM'ing aflatun if he doesn't see this. He might know of something.

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rightviewftw
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Re: lLooking for resources on Islamic Meditation techniques

Post by rightviewftw » Wed Apr 25, 2018 7:39 pm

Sam Vara wrote:
Wed Apr 25, 2018 7:26 pm
You might want to try PM'ing aflatun if he doesn't see this. He might know of something.
Yea he has written about it before, i will re-post those
rightviewftw wrote:
Mon Mar 05, 2018 1:37 pm
aflatun wrote:
Mon Mar 05, 2018 2:58 am
The kind of prayer many people are talking about in this thread (supplication) as if it is prayer as such accounted for about 5% of the prayer I did for years as a serious practitioner in an Abrahamic tradition.

The recollection of the Buddha that the suttas praise, and which seems to lead to jhana, or just short of jhana, is similar to what an Islam is known as remembrance of God (Dhikr-ullah): Contemplating, keeping in mind, emulating and invoking the Divine Names (mercy, compassion, etc). Dhikr funny enough encompasses much of what we Buddhists call Sati-Sampajanna (mindfulness of what one is doing at all times, along with the ethical teachings that one is trying to actualize. In Islam this to a large extent falls under what is known as ihsan, often deceptively translated as "virtue") ... and it involves formal "sitting meditation" and leads to states of absorption and insight. Of course Right View is not there, so its not Buddha Dhamma, but the structural similarity is undeniable.

Prayer for a Muslim*** in the beginning stages is about submitting oneself to the Divine and at the highest level annihilation (fana) of the self (nafs) in the sheer Existence (wujud) that is the Deity: The highest form of prayer is when it is God who remembers Himself and "you" are nowhere to be found. (cf. Meister Eckhart: The eye through which I see God is the same eye through which God sees me...")

So yeah I'd call that prayer, and say its a wonderful thing to "pray to the Buddha."

***This is just an example. We'd find similar things in the other Abrahamic faiths.
thanks, good info. a bit off topic but do you know of people practicing for "absorbtion ihsan" at all nowadays? Also i assume this would be more of the type of prayer that is recital of a mantra rather than asking for things or what?
aflatun wrote:
Mon Mar 05, 2018 3:35 pm
rightviewftw wrote:
Mon Mar 05, 2018 1:37 pm
thanks, good info. a bit off topic but do you know of people practicing for "absorbtion ihsan" at all nowadays? Also i assume this would be more of the type of prayer that is recital of a mantra rather than asking for things or what?
Plenty of people sure, but just like Buddhism its a mixed scene. There are groups led by teachers that are 1) knowing charlatans 2) well meaning but deluded 3) legit. #3 is super rare. And in this tradition being a legit teacher means having a legit transmission (baya) from a legit teacher, so you can imagine it gets hairy. That said I've known many dedicated practitioners that didn't have a perfect teacher. In the middle east there there still exists a tradition that is master-student based and involves systematic study of theology (kalam), logic, philosophy (falsafa) and these contemplative practices (tasawwuf, i.e. "sufism"). Similar to the way rigorous scholastic training is wedded to intensive meditation practice in the Tibetan tradition. It's out there, but its hard to find.

And yeah while the practice encompasses all activities of normal life and can be implemented in a variety of ways, it comes to a head in sitting-type practice which usually involves actual repetition of a name, like a mantra. But that's not the only way its done. Some people use the breath, some people do visualization or 'staring' type practices, some people even dance (@39 seconds) . And there are various schemes associated with all of this that amount to a 'progress of insight' also, most clearly articulated by Ibn Al Arabi, Suhrawardi, Mulla Sadra, etc.
I would like to know more, because there are many Muslims around. I've also found some videos on youtube but it is not much.
He goes to Niraya, the one who asserts what didn't take place, as does the one who, having done, says, 'I didn't.' Both — low-acting people — there become equal: after death, in the world beyond.
Tyranny of Words - An Introduction to General Semantics
How to Meditate: Mindfulness of Breathing
Factors of Enlightenment & Perceptions
How to Meditate: Basic Satipatthana
Parallel Dhammapada Reading

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Re: lLooking for resources on Islamic Meditation techniques

Post by retrofuturist » Wed Apr 25, 2018 11:54 pm

Greetings,
Sam Vara wrote:
Wed Apr 25, 2018 7:26 pm
You might want to try PM'ing aflatun if he doesn't see this. He might know of something.
Ditto Khalil Bodhi.

Metta,
Paul. :)
"Do not force others, including children, by any means whatsoever, to adopt your views, whether by authority, threat, money, propaganda, or even education." - Ven. Thich Nhat Hanh

"The uprooting of identity is seen by the noble ones as pleasurable; but this contradicts what the whole world sees." (Snp 3.12)

"One discerns wrong view as wrong view, and right view as right view. This is one's right view." (MN 117)

dharmacorps
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Re: Looking for resources on particularly Islamic Meditation techniques

Post by dharmacorps » Thu Apr 26, 2018 1:14 am

Idries Shah wrote a lot of books on Sufism. Its probably the only sect that would encourage meditation.

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Grigoris
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Re: Looking for resources on particularly Islamic Meditation techniques

Post by Grigoris » Thu Apr 26, 2018 9:55 am

There is this book, which has essays by Islamic scholars plus an introduction by His Holiness the Dalai Lama, which you may find useful/interesting.

Common Ground Between Islam and Buddhism
ye dhammā hetuppabhavā tesaṁ hetuṁ tathāgato āha,
tesaṃca yo nirodho - evaṁvādī mahāsamaṇo.

Of those phenomena which arise from causes:
Those causes have been taught by the Tathāgata,
And their cessation too - thus proclaims the Great Ascetic.

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dylanj
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Re: Looking for resources on particularly Islamic Meditation techniques

Post by dylanj » Thu Apr 26, 2018 9:57 am

sufism
susukhaṁ vata nibbānaṁ,
sammā­sambud­dha­desitaṁ;
asokaṁ virajaṁ khemaṁ,
yattha dukkhaṁ nirujjhatī


Oh! extinction is so very blissful,
As taught by the One Rightly Self-Awakened:
Sorrowless, stainless, secure;
Where suffering all ceases


etaṁ santaṁ etaṁ paṇītaṁ yadidaṁ sabbasaṅkhārasamatho sabbūpadhipaṭi nissaggo taṇhakkhayo virāgo nirodho nibbānaṁ

This is peaceful, this is excellent, that is: the stilling of all preparations, the relinquishment of all attachments, the destruction of craving, detachment, cessation, extinction.

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Grigoris
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Re: Looking for resources on particularly Islamic Meditation techniques

Post by Grigoris » Thu Apr 26, 2018 10:20 am

dharmacorps wrote:
Thu Apr 26, 2018 1:14 am
Idries Shah wrote a lot of books on Sufism. Its probably the only sect that would encourage meditation.
All Islamic sects encourage different types of meditation.
ye dhammā hetuppabhavā tesaṁ hetuṁ tathāgato āha,
tesaṃca yo nirodho - evaṁvādī mahāsamaṇo.

Of those phenomena which arise from causes:
Those causes have been taught by the Tathāgata,
And their cessation too - thus proclaims the Great Ascetic.

Traveler8
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Re: Looking for resources on particularly Islamic Meditation techniques

Post by Traveler8 » Thu Apr 26, 2018 10:37 am

Prayer itself, when done properly could be considered as a form of meditation. Also dhikr, repeating of the short Muslim mantras and concentrating on them.

There is a story in some hadith that the Prophet found his companions sitting in silence and asked them what are they doing. They replied that they are remembering Allah. He said, good, keep doing that. In some instances they cried during prayers.

They are basically repeating their holly mantras in prayers and dhikr with the intention of serving God and reaching heavenly realms. In a way it's like Pure Land Buddhism.

In the earliest sources it's all very simple, without any secret or advanced techniques not suitable for everybody. Groups such as Sufis later developed many elaborate practices that in extreme cases could include traveling out of the body and talking to dead people. But these are mainly influences from other religions. I mean, if you see a Sufi teaching that you should follow your breath, than you can assume that Islam is not the source of his teaching. Especially when he says, you should on the in-breath say “Aal” and on the out-breath one “Laah”.

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Re: Looking for resources on particularly Islamic Meditation techniques

Post by Dhammanando » Thu Apr 26, 2018 3:27 pm

A very thorough account of the Shi’ite understanding and practice of the “inner jihad” ...

Ayatollah Khomeini, Commentary on Forty Hadiths - An Exegesis of Surat Al-Tawhid and Some Verses of Surat Al-Hadid

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Grigoris
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Re: Looking for resources on particularly Islamic Meditation techniques

Post by Grigoris » Thu Apr 26, 2018 6:37 pm

ye dhammā hetuppabhavā tesaṁ hetuṁ tathāgato āha,
tesaṃca yo nirodho - evaṁvādī mahāsamaṇo.

Of those phenomena which arise from causes:
Those causes have been taught by the Tathāgata,
And their cessation too - thus proclaims the Great Ascetic.

Traveler8
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Joined: Wed Apr 11, 2018 9:14 am

Re: Looking for resources on particularly Islamic Meditation techniques

Post by Traveler8 » Fri Apr 27, 2018 6:44 am

Practice: ya Shahid

We start with a silence, and in this silence we practice what the Sufis call the fikr of the breath, which means silently watching your breath, so the mind is taken up with the rhythm of the breath. It’s very important to do this before you do a wasifa practice.

- Silence.

If your mind is starting to wander, bring it back to your breath.

- First stage: Saying the wasifa out aloud.

Now we do the practice silently on the breath: as you think of Shahid, think of it on the in-breath and on the out-breath. That’s the fikr of Shahid.

- Second stage: fikr.

The third stage of the practice, which the Sufis call the fikr as-Sirr, is a state of meditation on the wasifa itself. You are no longer conscious of the breath, but simply conscious of the wasifa in your meditation. Simply allow the presence of Shahid, think of Shahid as not just an abstract word in Arabic; it is a vibration that has a presence, what the Sufis call hadrat, presence. This spiritual presence is a condition of the spirit that manifests itself as Shahid.

You experience that presence when you are identified with your celestial counterpart, your angel. We are surrendering ourselves to that presence, that’s what we mean by meditating on Shahid. Rather than thinking of Shahid as an object to concentrate on, you actually become Shahid because you feel the presence of it. You no longer think of the word
Shahid, but you tune in to its presence, its atmosphere. That can only be sensed when we are still and we are silent.

-Third stage: fikr as-Sirr.

So we’ve had an experience of the three ways of practicing Shahid. We are in effect experiencing three different kinds of rhythms. These three rhythms are spoken of by Hazrat Inayat Khan as the rhythms of the mind:

- In the first rhythm, the mind is dominant, and unless you can concentrate on Shahid, the mind becomes chaotic. It’s a fast rhythm. The nature of the mind is quick.

- The second rhythm is progressive. By that he means that you can make progress, in your personal life. The mind is not so dominant, but it’s a mixture of the influence of your soul and the influence of the mind. That’s when we’re saying the fikr of Shahid: it’s very internal, quietly working and progressing inwardly.

-The third rhythm is a slow rhythm, eventually it becomes so slow it becomes still. That’s the rhythm of meditation, when the mind is quietly floating with the experience. The mind becomes transparent to the experience; it is in sync together with the soul that is also experiencing the experience.

These three rhythms go with the three stages of practicing the wasifa.
http://www.sufismus.ch/assets/files/ome ... s_2004.pdf

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Grigoris
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Re: Looking for resources on particularly Islamic Meditation techniques

Post by Grigoris » Fri Apr 27, 2018 7:19 am

xofz wrote:
Fri Apr 27, 2018 7:00 am
Trust me, there is nothing to be found from worship of Allah. Stick to the teachings of the Buddha.
Yeah, your view of Islam is probably more valid than that of 1.8 billion Muslims globally... :thinking:

To be clear: I am a Buddhist, so for me the path to liberation is clear, for me, but to say that there is NOTHING to be found from the worship of Allah...
ye dhammā hetuppabhavā tesaṁ hetuṁ tathāgato āha,
tesaṃca yo nirodho - evaṁvādī mahāsamaṇo.

Of those phenomena which arise from causes:
Those causes have been taught by the Tathāgata,
And their cessation too - thus proclaims the Great Ascetic.

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DooDoot
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Re: Looking for resources on particularly Islamic Meditation techniques

Post by DooDoot » Thu May 03, 2018 1:55 am

Traveler8 wrote:
Thu Apr 26, 2018 10:37 am
There is a story in some hadith that the Prophet found his companions sitting in silence and asked them what are they doing... I mean, if you see a Sufi teaching that you should follow your breath, than you can assume that Islam is not the source of his teaching. Especially when he says, you should on the in-breath say “Aal” and on the out-breath one “Laah”.
This post has a contradiction in it because, in reality, when the mind is silent the mind naturally becomes aware of the in breath & out breath; just like when a person walks up a steep hill they become aware of the in breath & out breath. It is quite obvious Islam, Buddhism or any other doctrine is not the source of his teaching to follow your breath. This is why the Buddha did not teach to follow the in & out breath but taught to abandon craving (which results in following the in & out breath)

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Grigoris
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Re: Looking for resources on particularly Islamic Meditation techniques

Post by Grigoris » Thu May 03, 2018 6:17 pm

DooDoot wrote:
Thu May 03, 2018 1:55 am
Traveler8 wrote:
Thu Apr 26, 2018 10:37 am
There is a story in some hadith that the Prophet found his companions sitting in silence and asked them what are they doing... I mean, if you see a Sufi teaching that you should follow your breath, than you can assume that Islam is not the source of his teaching. Especially when he says, you should on the in-breath say “Aal” and on the out-breath one “Laah”.
This post has a contradiction in it because, in reality, when the mind is silent the mind naturally becomes aware of the in breath & out breath; just like when a person walks up a steep hill they become aware of the in breath & out breath. It is quite obvious Islam, Buddhism or any other doctrine is not the source of his teaching to follow your breath. This is why the Buddha did not teach to follow the in & out breath but taught to abandon craving (which results in following the in & out breath)
What are you talking about??? :rolleye:
Anapanasati Sutta
ye dhammā hetuppabhavā tesaṁ hetuṁ tathāgato āha,
tesaṃca yo nirodho - evaṁvādī mahāsamaṇo.

Of those phenomena which arise from causes:
Those causes have been taught by the Tathāgata,
And their cessation too - thus proclaims the Great Ascetic.

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