Dharma of Karanei?

Exploring Theravāda's connections to other paths - what can we learn from other traditions, religions and philosophies?
Post Reply
Tenma
Posts: 9
Joined: Wed Apr 11, 2018 2:36 am

Dharma of Karanei?

Post by Tenma » Wed Apr 11, 2018 2:44 am

Does anyone have the Dharma of Karanei and the Dharma of Viropake? I would like to use them for help in my practice.
But before I go on, do these dharmas require empowerment? I'm more familiar with Vajrayana, so I have no clue on what the Theravada do.

User avatar
cappuccino
Posts: 1560
Joined: Thu Feb 11, 2016 1:45 am

Re: Dharma of Karanei?

Post by cappuccino » Wed Apr 11, 2018 3:22 am

there is the teaching of Buddha

otherwise there is no teaching

User avatar
retrofuturist
Site Admin
Posts: 20130
Joined: Tue Dec 30, 2008 9:52 pm
Location: Melbourne, Australia
Contact:

Re: Dharma of Karanei?

Post by retrofuturist » Wed Apr 11, 2018 3:27 am

Greetings Tenma,
Tenma wrote:
Wed Apr 11, 2018 2:44 am
Does anyone have the Dharma of Karanei and the Dharma of Viropake? I would like to use them for help in my practice.
But before I go on, do these dharmas require empowerment? I'm more familiar with Vajrayana, so I have no clue on what the Theravada do.
These concepts are foreign to Theravada, so Theravada has no position on them, other than that they are not within the scope of Theravada.

As such, your questions would be best put to a different corner of the Internet. I was going to suggest you try Vajracakra.com but it appears it was shut down in December 2017.

Metta,
Paul. :)
"Do not force others, including children, by any means whatsoever, to adopt your views, whether by authority, threat, money, propaganda, or even education." - Ven. Thich Nhat Hanh

"The uprooting of identity is seen by the noble ones as pleasurable; but this contradicts what the whole world sees." (Snp 3.12)

"One discerns wrong view as wrong view, and right view as right view. This is one's right view." (MN 117)

Tenma
Posts: 9
Joined: Wed Apr 11, 2018 2:36 am

Re: Dharma of Karanei?

Post by Tenma » Wed Apr 11, 2018 3:40 am

retrofuturist wrote:
Wed Apr 11, 2018 3:27 am
Greetings Tenma,
Tenma wrote:
Wed Apr 11, 2018 2:44 am
Does anyone have the Dharma of Karanei and the Dharma of Viropake? I would like to use them for help in my practice.
But before I go on, do these dharmas require empowerment? I'm more familiar with Vajrayana, so I have no clue on what the Theravada do.
These concepts are foreign to Theravada, so Theravada has no position on them, other than that they are not within the scope of Theravada.

As such, your questions would be best put to a different corner of the Internet. I was going to suggest you try Vajracakra.com but it appears it was shut down in December 2017.

Metta,
Paul. :)
Strange, I found the mention of the two here:
http://khmerlegends.blogspot.com/2013/1 ... -tree.html
Since it was Khmer, I automatically thought it was Theravada. Is there such thing as Cambodian Vajrayana or Mahayana? Never heard of that.

User avatar
retrofuturist
Site Admin
Posts: 20130
Joined: Tue Dec 30, 2008 9:52 pm
Location: Melbourne, Australia
Contact:

Re: Dharma of Karanei?

Post by retrofuturist » Wed Apr 11, 2018 3:47 am

Greetings,
Since it was Khmer, I automatically thought it was Theravada. Is there such thing as Cambodian Vajrayana or Mahayana? Never heard of that.
If my engagement here with people exposed to Cambodian Buddhism is anything to go by, it's a real mish-mash of all of the above.

What I can tell you for sure if that it's not in the Suttas, it's not in the traditional Theravada Commentaries, and the notion of "secret" Buddhist teachings which would require "empowerment" was specifically refuted by the Buddha in the suttas...
'I have preached the truth without making any distinction between exoteric and esoteric doctrine: for in respect of the truths, Ananda, the Tathagata has no such thing as the closed fist of a teacher, who keeps some things back.
Metta,
Paul. :)
"Do not force others, including children, by any means whatsoever, to adopt your views, whether by authority, threat, money, propaganda, or even education." - Ven. Thich Nhat Hanh

"The uprooting of identity is seen by the noble ones as pleasurable; but this contradicts what the whole world sees." (Snp 3.12)

"One discerns wrong view as wrong view, and right view as right view. This is one's right view." (MN 117)

paul
Posts: 1278
Joined: Tue May 31, 2011 11:27 pm
Location: Vietnam

Re: Dharma of Karanei?

Post by paul » Wed Apr 11, 2018 4:25 am

Karanei is the Metta sutta, also called the Karaniyametta sutta after the opening word "Karaniyam" meaning: This is what should be done...
I think "Viropake" refers to Paritta chanting.
In my opinion, the reciting of protective chants is not the highest expression of Theravada.

Ruud
Posts: 107
Joined: Fri Apr 16, 2010 9:07 am

Re: Dharma of Karanei?

Post by Ruud » Wed Apr 11, 2018 7:40 am

I also thought about the Metta Sutta for the first one. And if we are thinking in the direction of paritta-chants, then the second one could be the Khandha paritta:
I love the Virūpakkhas,
the Erāpathas I love,
I love the Chabyāputtas,
the Kaṇhāgotamakas I love.

I love the footless creatures,
the two-footed I love,
I love the four-footed,
the many-footed I love.

May the footless not harm me!
May I not be harmed by the two-footed!
May the four-footed not harm me!
May I not be harmed by the many-footed!

All sentient beings, all living things,
all creatures, every one:
may they see only nice things,
may bad not come to anyone.

The Buddha is immeasurable,
the teaching is immeasurable,
the Saṅgha is immeasurable.
But limited are crawling things,
snakes and scorpions, centipedes,
spiders and lizards and mice.

I’ve made this safeguard, I’ve made this protection:
go away, creatures!
And so I revere the Blessed One,
I revere the seven perfectly awakened Buddhas.
https://suttacentral.net/an4.67/en/sujato
Dry up what pertains to the past,
do not take up anything to come later.
If you will not grasp in the middle,
you will live at peace.
—Snp.5.11,v.1099 (tr. Ven. Bhikkhu Bodhi)

Whatever is will be was. —Ven. Ñānamoli, A Thinkers Notebook, §221

paul
Posts: 1278
Joined: Tue May 31, 2011 11:27 pm
Location: Vietnam

Re: Dharma of Karanei?

Post by paul » Wed Apr 11, 2018 8:39 am

Alternative rendering Piyadassi Thera:

Protection of the Aggregates
(Khandha Paritta) (1)
Thus have I heard:

On one occasion the Blessed One was living near Savatthi at Jetavana at Anathapindika's monastery. At that time at Savatthi a certain monk had died bitten by a snake. Thereupon many monks approached the Buddha and having saluted him sat beside him. So seated those monks spoke thus to the Blessed One:

'Bhante (Venerable Sir), a certain monk at Savatthi had died bitten by a snake.'

'Assuredly, monks,' said the Buddha, 'that monk has not suffused with thoughts of Loving-kindness (Metta) the four royal tribes of snakes. Had he done so, that monk would not have died of snake-bite. What are the four royal tribes of snakes? The royal tribe of snakes called Virupakkha, Erapatha, Chabyaputta and Kanhagotamaka. Monks, that monk, did not suffuse with thoughts of Loving-kindness these four royal tribes of snakes, had not done so he would not have died of snake-bite. Monks, I enjoin you to suffuse with thoughts of Loving-kindness these four royal tribes of snakes for your safety, for your preservation and for your protection.' So said the Blessed One. Having thus spoken, the Buddha, the 'Welcome One' (Sugata), further said (suggesting how they should express themselves :)

1. 'May I have Metta towards Virupakkhas
Towards Erapathas may I have Metta
May my Metta be towards Chabyaputtas
Towards Kanha-gotamakas also Metta may I have.
2. May I have Metta towards the footless
And towards bipeds too, my Metta may I have
May I have Metta towards the quadrupeds
And towards the many footed also, Metta may I have.
3. Let not the footless do me harm
Nor those that have two feet
Let not quadrupeds do me harm
Nor those endowed with many feet.
4. All beings, all living creatures,
May good fortune befall them all
May not the least harm on them befall.
Infinite (in virtue) is the Buddha, infinite is the Dhamma and infinite is the Sangha. Finite are creeping creatures - snakes, scorpions, centipedes, spiders, lizards and rats. I have guarded myself, I have made my protection. Depart from me, ye beings. I bow down to the Blessed One; and to the Seven Supreme Buddhas.' (2)

NOTES:

1. Culla Vagga, ii. p. 110; also in the Anguttara under the title Ahi (metta) sutta, ii.72; Khandha-Vatta Jataka, 203.
2. Vipassi, Sikhi, Vessabhu, Kakusanda, Konagama, Kassapa, Gotama.

Post Reply

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: altar, TRobinson465 and 56 guests