S.N Goenka

Exploring Theravāda's connections to other paths - what can we learn from other traditions, religions and philosophies?
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badscooter
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Re: S.N Goenka

Post by badscooter »

convivium wrote:
That's your opinion
that's the regional expert on theravada buddhism's (ajahn thanissaro's) statement, based on what is in the suttas.
That's a bold face lie.... Thanissaro never mentioned Goenka in such manners....
One can ask the venerable if one wishes
"whatever one frequently thinks and ponders upon will be the inclination of one's mind"
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badscooter
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Re: S.N Goenka

Post by badscooter »

Ben wrote:With respect, I don't think you know what you are talking about.
i agree
"whatever one frequently thinks and ponders upon will be the inclination of one's mind"
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convivium
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Re: S.N Goenka

Post by convivium »

Please dont answer this question... It is rhetorical.
there's no question (maybe just a claim you are clinging to or don't want challenged). i'm not trying to tear you away from the goenka people. however, they are effectively saying that these teachings are either unnecessary, or useless. the only point i am making is that they would not be included in the suttas, if they were unnecessary or useless. different people have different proclivities, and the buddha of the suttas taught different methods to different people accordingly. that's all.
Just keep breathing in and out like this. Don't be interested in anything else. It doesn't matter even if someone is standing on their head with their ass in the air. Don't pay it any attention. Just stay with the in-breath and the out-breath. Concentrate your awareness on the breath. Just keep doing it. http://www.ajahnchah.org/book/Just_Do_It_1_2.php
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convivium
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Re: S.N Goenka

Post by convivium »

That's a bold face lie.... Thanissaro never mentioned Goenka in such manners....
One can ask the venerable if one wishes
yeah i'm lying on a buddhist forum.
Just keep breathing in and out like this. Don't be interested in anything else. It doesn't matter even if someone is standing on their head with their ass in the air. Don't pay it any attention. Just stay with the in-breath and the out-breath. Concentrate your awareness on the breath. Just keep doing it. http://www.ajahnchah.org/book/Just_Do_It_1_2.php
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badscooter
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Re: S.N Goenka

Post by badscooter »

convivium wrote:he 'ignores' and rules out a lot of teachings.
If I call Ven Thanissaro, he's gonna tell me that he said these exact words about SN Goenka????... Considering Thanissaro never studied under Goenka, I'm gonna assume his answer is going to be "no"
"whatever one frequently thinks and ponders upon will be the inclination of one's mind"
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convivium
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Re: S.N Goenka

Post by convivium »

if you don't sound crazy, and ask for an opinion as to whether he thinks you should practice in the goenka tradition, then you'll get a response to that effect.
Just keep breathing in and out like this. Don't be interested in anything else. It doesn't matter even if someone is standing on their head with their ass in the air. Don't pay it any attention. Just stay with the in-breath and the out-breath. Concentrate your awareness on the breath. Just keep doing it. http://www.ajahnchah.org/book/Just_Do_It_1_2.php
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vidar
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Re: S.N Goenka

Post by vidar »

convivium wrote:
That's a bold face lie.... Thanissaro never mentioned Goenka in such manners....
One can ask the venerable if one wishes
yeah i'm lying on a buddhist forum.
Then put here the exact quote of Ven. Thanissaro mentioned Goenka, can you do that convivium?
All the world is on fire, All the world is burning, All the world is ablaze, All the world is quaking. That which does not quake or blaze, That to which worldlings do not resort, Where there is no place for Mara:That is where my mind delights. (SN 5.7)

By degrees, little by little,
from moment to moment,
the wise purify themselves,
as a smith purifies silver.
—Dhammapada 239
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convivium
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Re: S.N Goenka

Post by convivium »

no, because i asked him in person. however, it's readily evident in the breadth of his teachings and the way he relates to jhana.
Just keep breathing in and out like this. Don't be interested in anything else. It doesn't matter even if someone is standing on their head with their ass in the air. Don't pay it any attention. Just stay with the in-breath and the out-breath. Concentrate your awareness on the breath. Just keep doing it. http://www.ajahnchah.org/book/Just_Do_It_1_2.php
lojong1
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Re: S.N Goenka

Post by lojong1 »

convivium wrote:...they are effectively saying that these teachings are either unnecessary, or useless.
Quotes might be helpful alongside any chinese whispers. What made you think they are effectively saying such?
If a practise is outside his area of expertise, then perhaps it would be best he not teach it?
Last edited by lojong1 on Tue Mar 26, 2013 10:20 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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convivium
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Re: S.N Goenka

Post by convivium »

something about this discussion is worth mentioning. people only get inflammatory (e.g. accusing others of lying) when there is vulnerability in their beliefs.

http://www.accesstoinsight.org/tipitaka ... .than.html
Just keep breathing in and out like this. Don't be interested in anything else. It doesn't matter even if someone is standing on their head with their ass in the air. Don't pay it any attention. Just stay with the in-breath and the out-breath. Concentrate your awareness on the breath. Just keep doing it. http://www.ajahnchah.org/book/Just_Do_It_1_2.php
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Polar Bear
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Re: S.N Goenka

Post by Polar Bear »

Just to chime in here. It seems that every Theravada buddhist teacher is gonna have some people in the Theravada who don't like the way they teach or think that what they teach is adhamma. How many really are teaching against what is dhamma is another matter that I don't have any answer to but I'd just point out that I've read criticisms on this forum leveled against Mahasi Sayadaw, Goenka, Thanissaro, Brahm, Vimalaramsi, Ajahn Chah, and probably some other teachers that aren't coming to mind right now. So I'd take any criticism you read here with a grain of salt.

:anjali:
"I don't envision a single thing that, when developed & cultivated, leads to such great benefit as the mind. The mind, when developed & cultivated, leads to great benefit."

"I don't envision a single thing that, when undeveloped & uncultivated, brings about such suffering & stress as the mind. The mind, when undeveloped & uncultivated, brings about suffering & stress."
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badscooter
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Re: S.N Goenka

Post by badscooter »

convivium wrote:no, because i asked him in person. however, it's readily evident in the breadth of his teachings and the way he relates to jhana.
lol.. that statement sums it up for me... This is at best an exaggeration of something Thanissaro said. At worst, a horrid overstatement using your own interpretation of Thanissaro to criticise Goenka.
Thanissaro has not read nor studied enough of Goenka to make such a strong statement. That's not like him at all. I never studied under Goenka and I actually like Thanissaro's teachings and talks, but that statement is very heavy. I would never take it upon myself to make public what I assume the Venerable thinks of the Goenka teaching method.
"whatever one frequently thinks and ponders upon will be the inclination of one's mind"
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convivium
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Re: S.N Goenka

Post by convivium »

i keep having to make this point for some reason: i'm not saying goenka is teaching against the dhamma and neither would thanissaro. it's what he doesn't teach that is included in the suttas that's the issue; or rather, what he doesn't allow students to practice if they are to remain in the tradition to do longer or more advanced retreats.
Just keep breathing in and out like this. Don't be interested in anything else. It doesn't matter even if someone is standing on their head with their ass in the air. Don't pay it any attention. Just stay with the in-breath and the out-breath. Concentrate your awareness on the breath. Just keep doing it. http://www.ajahnchah.org/book/Just_Do_It_1_2.php
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convivium
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Re: S.N Goenka

Post by convivium »

lol.. that statement sums it up for me... This is at best an exaggeration of something Thanissaro said. At worst, a horrid overstatement using your own interpretation of Thanissaro to criticise Goenka.
Thanissaro has not read nor studied enough of Goenka to make such a strong statement. That's not like him at all. I never studied under Goenka and I actually like Thanissaro's teachings and talks, but that statement is very heavy. I would never take it upon myself to make public what I assume the Venerable thinks of the Goenka teaching method.
i haven't really made a strong statement.
Just keep breathing in and out like this. Don't be interested in anything else. It doesn't matter even if someone is standing on their head with their ass in the air. Don't pay it any attention. Just stay with the in-breath and the out-breath. Concentrate your awareness on the breath. Just keep doing it. http://www.ajahnchah.org/book/Just_Do_It_1_2.php
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convivium
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Re: S.N Goenka

Post by convivium »

That's not like him at all.
you obviously haven't lived with the guy.
Just keep breathing in and out like this. Don't be interested in anything else. It doesn't matter even if someone is standing on their head with their ass in the air. Don't pay it any attention. Just stay with the in-breath and the out-breath. Concentrate your awareness on the breath. Just keep doing it. http://www.ajahnchah.org/book/Just_Do_It_1_2.php
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