Alan Wallace on Modern Vipassana

A discussion on all aspects of Theravāda Buddhism
Brizzy

Re: Alan Wallace on Modern Vipassana

Post by Brizzy » Mon Jun 14, 2010 7:21 am

tiltbillings wrote:
Brizzy wrote:
BTW Being able to read the suttas in the original pali does not make one a better teacher (or worse).
But then one who reads Pali would know one does not take refuge. This whole business of "taking" refuge in monks is a non sequitur. That is not what this thread is about.
Your nephew:
My nephew does not wear glasses. :ugeek:

:smile:

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tiltbillings
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Re: Alan Wallace on Modern Vipassana

Post by tiltbillings » Mon Jun 14, 2010 7:24 am

Brizzy wrote:
My nephew does not wear glasses.
It was the family resemblence I was going for.
>> Do you see a man wise [enlightened/ariya] in his own eyes? There is more hope for a fool than for him.<< -- Proverbs 26:12

This being is bound to samsara, kamma is his means for going beyond. -- SN I, 38.

“Of course it is happening inside your head, Harry, but why on earth should that mean that it is not real?” HPatDH p.723

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jcsuperstar
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Re: Alan Wallace on Modern Vipassana

Post by jcsuperstar » Mon Jun 14, 2010 7:41 am

:toilet:
สัพเพ สัตตา สุขีตา โหนตุ

the mountain may be heavy in and of itself, but if you're not trying to carry it it's not heavy to you- Ajaan Suwat

Brizzy

Re: Alan Wallace on Modern Vipassana

Post by Brizzy » Mon Jun 14, 2010 7:47 am

tiltbillings wrote:
Brizzy wrote:
My nephew does not wear glasses.
It was the family resemblence I was going for.
Actually now that you mention it, that monkey looks pretty cute and very wise.

:smile:

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jcsuperstar
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Re: Alan Wallace on Modern Vipassana

Post by jcsuperstar » Mon Jun 14, 2010 8:02 am

looks like george burns... so um kinda like god i guess
สัพเพ สัตตา สุขีตา โหนตุ

the mountain may be heavy in and of itself, but if you're not trying to carry it it's not heavy to you- Ajaan Suwat

Yundi

Re: Alan Wallace on Modern Vipassana

Post by Yundi » Tue Jun 15, 2010 3:16 am

Brizzy wrote:Is it so outrageous to question certain teachings put forward by teachers, which seem to not quite be in line with the suttas.
Personally, I do not see the issue being one of conformity to the Pali. To me, the issue is one of instruction & method.

To practise 'awareness' is to practise 'staring', 'watching' or 'concentrating'.

Where as to practise mindfulness is to recollect the Dhamma, especially the Dhamma of abandoning craving & grasping.

So the differences between teachers is indicative of their own method of practice.

As I see it, the question is not one of scriptural interpretation. It is a question of practise & method.

With metta

:smile:

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tiltbillings
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Re: Alan Wallace on Modern Vipassana

Post by tiltbillings » Tue Jun 15, 2010 4:21 am

Yundi wrote:

To practise 'awareness' is to practise 'staring', 'watching' or 'concentrating'.
Though we are not at odds with the basic issue, it would seem, as for awareness, it depends upon how you define the word.
>> Do you see a man wise [enlightened/ariya] in his own eyes? There is more hope for a fool than for him.<< -- Proverbs 26:12

This being is bound to samsara, kamma is his means for going beyond. -- SN I, 38.

“Of course it is happening inside your head, Harry, but why on earth should that mean that it is not real?” HPatDH p.723

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tiltbillings
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Re: Alan Wallace on Modern Vipassana

Post by tiltbillings » Tue Jun 15, 2010 4:23 am

jcsuperstar wrote:looks like george burns... so um kinda like god i guess
God died March 9, 1996.
>> Do you see a man wise [enlightened/ariya] in his own eyes? There is more hope for a fool than for him.<< -- Proverbs 26:12

This being is bound to samsara, kamma is his means for going beyond. -- SN I, 38.

“Of course it is happening inside your head, Harry, but why on earth should that mean that it is not real?” HPatDH p.723

alan
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Re: Alan Wallace on Modern Vipassana

Post by alan » Tue Jun 15, 2010 5:39 am

And may he rest in peace. Along with this thread.

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tiltbillings
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Re: Alan Wallace on Modern Vipassana

Post by tiltbillings » Tue Jun 15, 2010 5:54 am

alan wrote:And may he rest in peace. Along with this thread.
God or George Burns may be dead, but this thread lives on.
>> Do you see a man wise [enlightened/ariya] in his own eyes? There is more hope for a fool than for him.<< -- Proverbs 26:12

This being is bound to samsara, kamma is his means for going beyond. -- SN I, 38.

“Of course it is happening inside your head, Harry, but why on earth should that mean that it is not real?” HPatDH p.723

fijiNut
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Re: Alan Wallace on Modern Vipassana

Post by fijiNut » Fri Jun 18, 2010 11:15 am

I was wondering why nobody brought this up this direct contradiction:

from the interview http://www.tricycle.com/a-mindful-balance
Q: Does the Buddha ever mention the term manasikara in his mindfulness instructions?

A:Not that I know of. The term figures most prominently in Abhidhamma-based treatises on Buddhist psychology. In the Buddha’s practical instructions on both samatha (tranquility meditation) and vipassana (insight meditation), the terms sati and sampajanna appear most often.
And from the words of the Buddha's "How appropriate attention (yoniso manasikara) leads to stream entry:" SN 22.122
http://www.accesstoinsight.org/tipitaka ... .than.html
http://www.accesstoinsight.org/index-su ... tml#stream

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Ben
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Re: Alan Wallace on Modern Vipassana

Post by Ben » Fri Jun 18, 2010 12:12 pm

fijiNut wrote:I was wondering why nobody brought this up this direct contradiction:

from the interview http://www.tricycle.com/a-mindful-balance
Q: Does the Buddha ever mention the term manasikara in his mindfulness instructions?

A:Not that I know of. The term figures most prominently in Abhidhamma-based treatises on Buddhist psychology. In the Buddha’s practical instructions on both samatha (tranquility meditation) and vipassana (insight meditation), the terms sati and sampajanna appear most often.
And from the words of the Buddha's "How appropriate attention (yoniso manasikara) leads to stream entry:" SN 22.122
http://www.accesstoinsight.org/tipitaka ... .than.html
http://www.accesstoinsight.org/index-su ... tml#stream
That doesn't surprise me, FijiNut, thanks for bringing it up.
kind regards

Ben
“No lists of things to be done. The day providential to itself. The hour. There is no later. This is later. All things of grace and beauty such that one holds them to one's heart have a common provenance in pain. Their birth in grief and ashes.”
- Cormac McCarthy, The Road

Learn this from the waters:
in mountain clefts and chasms,
loud gush the streamlets,
but great rivers flow silently.
- Sutta Nipata 3.725

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Re: Alan Wallace on Modern Vipassana

Post by Dinsdale » Fri Jun 18, 2010 2:53 pm

Yundi wrote: Thus the Buddha advised right mindfulness is awareness or contemplation of the four satipatthana rather than the four Spice Girls.
The Spice Girls are in fact the esoteric fifth foundation of mindfulness :tongue:
Buddha save me from new-agers!

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tiltbillings
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Re: Alan Wallace on Modern Vipassana

Post by tiltbillings » Fri Jun 18, 2010 3:09 pm

fijiNut wrote:I was wondering why nobody brought this up this direct contradiction:

from the interview http://www.tricycle.com/a-mindful-balance
Q: Does the Buddha ever mention the term manasikara in his mindfulness instructions?

A:Not that I know of. The term figures most prominently in Abhidhamma-based treatises on Buddhist psychology. In the Buddha’s practical instructions on both samatha (tranquility meditation) and vipassana (insight meditation), the terms sati and sampajanna appear most often.
And from the words of the Buddha's "How appropriate attention (yoniso manasikara) leads to stream entry:" SN 22.122
http://www.accesstoinsight.org/tipitaka ... .than.html
http://www.accesstoinsight.org/index-su ... tml#stream
Wallace leaves something to be desired.
>> Do you see a man wise [enlightened/ariya] in his own eyes? There is more hope for a fool than for him.<< -- Proverbs 26:12

This being is bound to samsara, kamma is his means for going beyond. -- SN I, 38.

“Of course it is happening inside your head, Harry, but why on earth should that mean that it is not real?” HPatDH p.723

alan
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Re: Alan Wallace on Modern Vipassana

Post by alan » Sat Jun 19, 2010 5:06 am

Nice, fijiNut. But was the sutta you posted referring to mindfulness instructions?

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