Wat Dhammakaya

A discussion on all aspects of Theravāda Buddhism
jameswang
Posts: 87
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Re: Wat Dhammakaya

Post by jameswang » Fri Mar 10, 2017 8:29 am

exonesion wrote:On the fourth parajika: Claiming of supernatural powers
jameswang wrote: So what if he has? It's still an offense for making claims of psychic powers.
“Should any bhikkhu, without direct knowledge, claim a superior human state, a truly noble knowledge and vision, as present in himself, saying,"

This rule of defeat is applicable only when the Bhikkhu lies about his meditative attainments. Therefore, I asked if the abbot really has vijja or nana of the past. If he has, then wouldn’t this precept remain intact? However, my concern and my doubt is the practical application of this rule. How do you prove that a Bhikkhu is lying? Can any venerable share their understanding of the fourth parajika and how it is accessed to be broken?
I'm not talking about that rule. There's a rule prohibiting monks from making such claims, even if it's true. You know that one? I suppose they don't tell you about this rule.
On unfair treatment of WPD
jameswang wrote: Do you see any unfair treatments?
Yes, the extremely harsh and extrajudicial use of Article 44 on a temple, with unarmed devotees. Are they a national threat to safety? I'd say this is bully.

As for your post about the music video and that your allegation that the human rights may be copied from somewhere, may we know where? We could use some mention of that somewhere. And I don’t think a music video posted on their site is enough to discredit the website.
Did you even take a look?

It's really hard for me to decide if you're just pretending to be unintelligent.
But never mind, I'll give you the benefit of doubt, be more direct about what I think: It's a fraudulent website.

The music video blog post is among the other irrelevant posts shown as posted in 2012, while according to
http://whois.domaintools.com/tahr-global.org
the domain was "Created on 2014-03-05".

Most of the supposedly older postings are just copied material from elsewhere. Only the more recent ones are original, and they are specifically on Dhammakaya.

Seems obvious to me it's a (lousy) con PR job.

On the abbot surrendering
jameswang wrote:
(1) If he knew, why didn't he just go to the police station and save the temple the raid?
(2) Anyway, instead of sleeping in tents, they can choose to go home, right?
(1) If Luang Phor Dhammajayo did, it’s likely he’ll be forced to disrobe. Why? Because DSI made things difficult for him and the temple. For example, DSI could have video-conferenced to him the charges, but they didn’t. They made things horrendously difficult.
That wouldn't make sense. As I understand, in Thailand, a monk can be disrobed wherever he is. And didn't the kind just did that? So, I renew my question: If he knew what would happen, why didn't he just go to the police station and save the temple the raid?

Maybe he didn't know, like he didn't expect the military to take over the government. But I wonder if Dk members can accept that he doesn't have the power he claims to have.
This is possibly the start of what led to the imposition of Article 44, and all the human rights violation we see today.
I don't know if human rights have actually been violated as claimed. But if I were the PM, I wouldn't have used hard power. There's a better way, and I'm told that's presently underway.
(2) They cannot choose to go home. If you mean WPD’s monks, their temple IS their home. And the DSI has currently blocked monks from entering their temple, and hence their home.
I've trouble believing that the wealthy Wat Dhammakaya have nowhere else to house their monks. It's clearly a tactic.

On asking for fixed donations
jameswang wrote: Is it normal in Thailand or Singapore for Buddhist organizations to ask for specific amount of donation?
That's about a month's salary for some people there, right?
At WPD’s Singapore, also known as DCS Singapore, it does not ask for a specific amount of donation. Even though I’m not very close to the centre, I’ve attended their beginner and intermediate meditation classes for about 2-3 times and also many of their activities.
In terms of donations, DCS Singapore does not often ask for fixed donations – devotees are free to give any amount they like. But for bigger projects, like the construction of Singapore’s new permanent centre, a lot of funds is required. And they’ve set the minimal donation at certain sum (there’re tiers as well).
I believe (in my opinion), this will encourage devotees to raise more funds to build the new temple and encourage them to donate more (within their capabilities, of course). It is a month’s salary for some people, but the common practice is to pool money and offer it as a group.
I’m not sure about Wat Phra Dhammakaya in Thailand, but from what I can remember, there’re minimal donation amounts for certain projects as well. TRobinson, am I correct?
Thank you for the info. I appreciate it.
On "Free" stuff
jameswang wrote: Anyway, your free stuff came from people like "form".
Yes indeed James, the temple is a non-profit organization. So, the “free” stuff are financed or given by devotees. And it’s because of the devotee’s support that the temple is there in the first place. Moreover, giving “free” stuff isn’t specific to WPD. In Singapore, the Singapore Buddhist Lodge provides free vegetarian meals (breakfast, lunch, dinner) for the needy, which is possible only with the funds donated from devotees.

Hence, I don’t see what’s the issue with giving of free stuff here, James.
No issue here.

jameswang
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Re: Wat Dhammakaya

Post by jameswang » Fri Mar 10, 2017 8:54 am

exonesion wrote:On the fourth parajika: Claiming of supernatural powers
jameswang wrote: So what if he has? It's still an offense for making claims of psychic powers.
“Should any bhikkhu, without direct knowledge, claim a superior human state, a truly noble knowledge and vision, as present in himself, saying,"

This rule of defeat is applicable only when the Bhikkhu lies about his meditative attainments.
Yes, exo, "this rule". But what about the other one, which I think you know of too? Can you please cite that one as you did for this one?

jameswang
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Re: Wat Dhammakaya

Post by jameswang » Fri Mar 10, 2017 8:59 am

exonesion wrote:On unfair treatment of WPD
jameswang wrote: Do you see any unfair treatments?
Yes, the extremely harsh and extrajudicial use of Article 44 on a temple, with unarmed devotees. Are they a national threat to safety? I'd say this is bully.
Actually, I also think that it's a bad move. I don't know if human rights have actually been violated as claimed. But if I were the PM, I wouldn't have used hard power. There's a much better way, and I've learnt that that's presently underway.

jameswang
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Re: Wat Dhammakaya

Post by jameswang » Fri Mar 10, 2017 9:03 am

exonesion wrote:As for your post about the music video and that your allegation that the human rights may be copied from somewhere, may we know where? We could use some mention of that somewhere. And I don’t think a music video posted on their site is enough to discredit the website.
I wonder if you're just pretending to be unintelligent. But never mind, I'll give you the benefit of doubt, be more direct about what I think: It's a fraudulent website.

The music video blog post is among the other irrelevant ones shown as posted in 2012, while according to
http://whois.domaintools.com/tahr-global.org
the domain was "Created on 2014-03-05".

From my samplings, the supposedly older postings are just copied material from elsewhere. Only the more recent ones are original, and they are specifically on Dhammakaya.

Seems obvious to me it's a (poor) con PR job.

jameswang
Posts: 87
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Re: Wat Dhammakaya

Post by jameswang » Fri Mar 10, 2017 9:08 am

exonesion wrote:On the abbot surrendering
jameswang wrote:
(1) If he knew, why didn't he just go to the police station and save the temple the raid?
(2) Anyway, instead of sleeping in tents, they can choose to go home, right?
(1) If Luang Phor Dhammajayo did, it’s likely he’ll be forced to disrobe. Why? Because DSI made things difficult for him and the temple. For example, DSI could have video-conferenced to him the charges, but they didn’t. They made things horrendously difficult. This is possibly the start of what led to the imposition of Article 44, and all the human rights violation we see today.
That wouldn't make sense. As I understand, in Thailand, bad monks aren't forced to disrobe. They are just disrobed, wherever he is. And didn't the king just did that? So, I renew my question: If he knew what would happen, why didn't he just go to the police station and save the temple the raid?

Maybe he didn't know, like he didn't expect the military to take over the government. But I wonder if Dk members can accept that he doesn't have the power he claims to have.

jameswang
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Re: Wat Dhammakaya

Post by jameswang » Fri Mar 10, 2017 9:23 am

exonesion wrote:On the purging of the World Fellowship of Buddhist Youth (WFBY) President:
jameswang wrote: The link is former (purged) World Fellowship of Buddhist Youth (WFBY) President, Pornchai Pinyapong.
This ousting of the President was proved unconstitutional.
WFB in its capacity as the “Mother Organization” for WFBY has failed to act impartially as seen in their SELECTIVE Invitation only to WFBY RCs of their choice. As a result RCs from about 10 countries and 16 Members Organizations are not invited.
Hence, the decision was invalid. Therefore, Mr. Pornchai Pinyapong is STILL President of WFBY
DMN wrote:
Whether he's still rightly the president doesn't matter here. What matters is that he is still the link between Wat Dhammakaya and Wirathu's Ma Ba Tha that DMN was looking for.

jameswang
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Re: Wat Dhammakaya

Post by jameswang » Fri Mar 10, 2017 9:31 am

jameswang wrote:
TRobinson465 wrote:Check out Professor James L Taylor's piece here. its very insightful for and gives great understanding into Thailand's Buddhism politics.

http://www.newmandala.org/perplexing-ca ... hammakaya/
I quote: "in the last decade or more it has been largely discreet and remained outside of any political alliance."

Really? I thought someone was just saying how the Dk is connected to Shinawarta family.
Just found where I read this: https://dhammawheel.com/viewtopic.php?f ... 53#p417155
It's Dk's good friend, Wirathu, btw.

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exonesion
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Re: Wat Dhammakaya

Post by exonesion » Fri Mar 10, 2017 5:03 pm

1. On my sources: WFBY
jameswang wrote: That's according to your source which has highly vested interest. I rather trust WFBY.
The below sources, which I quoted, are from the World Fellowship of Buddhist Youth (WFBY), the very sources which you say you will rather trust.
1. This ousting of the President was proved unconstitutional.
2. ... Mr. Pornchai Pinyapong is STILL President of WFBY


2. Thaksin more than merely spotted?
jameswang wrote: It's no secret that Thaksin was far from merely spotted as attending one Dk ceremony.
What no secret? Source please, thanks.


3. On my twisting things?
jameswang wrote: Hey! Don't try to twist things here, ok?
Hi James, please explain how I'm twisting anything here. :juggling:


4. On the link between Mr. Pornchai, Dhammakaya, and Wirathu
jameswang wrote:
... Pornchai is still the link between Dhammakaya and Wirathu's Ma Ba Tha. Considering the big donation for Ma Ba Tha's radio station, now we can understand why Wirathu is showing support for Dhammakaya.
The link between Mr. Pornchai, Dhammakaya, and Ma Ba Tha is extremely thin. Even until now, I haven't seen pictures of Mr. Pornchai with Ma Ba Tha. At least that would suggest a stronger link between them. But nope, I can't find any. If you can, it would greatly support your argument.

For Mr. Pornchai's big donation to Ma Ba Tha, again I can't find any credible source that I could use to verify the allegation's authenticity.
IF it is true Mr. Pornchai did give a huge amount to Ma Ba Tha and there's strong proof of it, I believe the World Fellowship of Buddhist Youths (WFBY) would have done something about it. But they didn't.

I believe in in the presumption of innocence, that someone is innocent until proven guilty, and this has been codified in article 11 of the Universal rights. I believe because of scarce evidence that the following argument of yours is weak.

Conclusion: Dhammakaya supports Ma Ba Tha, and hence is also ultra nationalist like Ma Ba Tha. (Correct me if you think I'm wrong)

Premises:
(1) Mr. Pornchai gave a big donation and an award to Ma Ba
Issues with this premise: (Lack of evidence) + (WFBY didn't do anything)

(2) Ma Ba Tha is seen in WPD. Hence WPD must have invited him and also by extension, supported him.
Issues with this premise:
TRobinson said Wirathu came uninvited because the temple grounds are too big, and it's too difficult to control the precise inflows and outflows of visitors. Hence, there's indeed a possibility Wirathu came in uninvited, and the media took pictures of that, and sensationalize it.

Again, using my previous example. If a famous serial murderer slipped into a huge temple like WPD, and the press published a report and said that the temple supports the serial murderer. Isn't this unfair?

5. Low credibility of Ma Ba Tha's words
jameswang wrote: Heck, even Wirathu says that "the former prime minister Thaksin Shinawatra and his sister Yingluk were disciples of Phra Dhammachayo."
Because the link between Wirathu and WPD is weak in the first place, Wirathu's statements are not strong enough to support your argument that "Thaksin Shinawatra aad his sister Yingluk were disciples of Phra Dhammachayo".

Even if they're disciplines of Phra Dhammachayo, what does this imply, if anything at all? :smile:

And I'm sensing there's an implied guilt by association here. :?
“Meditate, Ānanda, do not delay, or else you will regret it later.”
The Buddha - MN 152

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exonesion
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Re: Wat Dhammakaya

Post by exonesion » Fri Mar 10, 2017 5:38 pm

1. On the other rule of Parajika?
jameswang wrote: Yes, exo, "this rule". But what about the other one, which I think you know of too? Can you please cite that one as you did for this one?
What is the other one? I don’t recall any other precepts or rule talking about superior mind states other than the 4th parajika. If you can point it out, I may just learn something new, haha.

2. On tahr being a fraudulent website
jameswang wrote: …It's a fraudulent website.
I agree that the aesthetics of the website leaves much to be desired. But calling the website fraudulent (definition: dishonest, illegal), is a
very strong statement.

But again, your premise doesn’t support that conclusion:

Conclusion: Fraudulent website
Premise 1: Irrelevant information (Music video and Thai words that we don’t even know that they mean)

Premise 2: Copy pasted information from other areas.

These two premises are too weak to support your conclusion that it is stretching the realm of believability.

Hence, it’s not that I’m pretending to be unintelligent, James. It’s just that there’s a huge gap in logic that I couldn’t understand.



3. Did the king defrock the abbot?
jameswang wrote: … in Thailand, bad monks aren't forced to disrobe. They are just disrobed, wherever he is. And didn't the king just did that?
No, the abbot wasn’t defrocked by the king. Rather, his monastic rank was taken away. The same happened to the vice-abbot.


4. On why the abbot didn’t surrender (Part 2)
jameswang wrote: So, I renew my question: If he knew what would happen, why didn't he just go to the police station and save the temple the raid?
My answer is a counter-question to you:

If you’re the abbot, would you voluntarily surrender yourself to answer politically motivated charges, which you know you may be forcefully disrobed?
“Meditate, Ānanda, do not delay, or else you will regret it later.”
The Buddha - MN 152

DMN
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Re: Wat Dhammakaya

Post by DMN » Fri Mar 10, 2017 10:17 pm

Thank you to everyone who has replied to my queries. I need a bit more solid evidence to prove the link between Mr. Pornchai Pinyapong / Dhammakaya and Wirathu. I do believe, as one previous poster has said, that the evidence is weak but I'm thinking that there is something very wrong here. I will not lose faith in Buddhism but I am losing trust in Dhammakaya. The problem remains that a lot of evidence presented here and what I have researched myself is circumstantial and I am not believing newspaper reports. However, as far as I am concerned there is a small but significant amount of evidence building up which suggests that Mr. Pornchai Pinyapong / Dhammakaya have done something that is outrageous in my opinion.

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exonesion
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Re: Wat Dhammakaya

Post by exonesion » Sun Mar 12, 2017 4:29 pm

Two WFBY organizations

I realized there’re two WFBYs after seeing Venerable Gavesako’s post in the news section.

But things become confusing when TWO WFBYs are involved.
So, for clarity, I will refer to the two WFBY by their current Presidents.
1. WFBY – Led by Dr. Pornchai - (http://www.wfbytoday.org/)
2. WFBY – Led by Mr. Denphong -(http://wfbhq.org/)

After some Googling, I found that the creation of the second WFBY (led by Mr. Denphong) can be traced back to 5 April 2016, when Dr. Pornchai (President of WFBY) was unconstitutionally ousted out.

Dr. Pornchai’s removal was ineffective because:
1. WFBY’s secretary general, Mr. Phallop convened an Emergency Board Meeting without informing the President (Dr. Pornchai). This contravenes WFBY’s constitution, (Section 7.4)

Moreover, the secretary general invited only WFBY regional centers (RC) that are supportive of the President’s removal. Hence, RCs from about 10 countries and 16 Members Organizations are not invited.

With possibly biased votes, how can there be a consensus?

And if the emergency board meeting is unconstitutional, then the removal is considered ultra vires (beyond one’s legal power or authority). Therefore, the removal is ineffective and Dr. Pornchai may still be considered as the President of WFBY.

In addition, Dr. Pornchai and his team tried contacting the WFB Secretary General, Mr. Phallop to resolve any misunderstandings. But no response.


Because of a lack of communication, two WFBYs now exist. Moreover, WFB and WFBY (Mr. Denphong) have been giving WFBY (Dr. Pornchai) the cold shoulders.

And this can be seen in their correspondences below:


WFB post rejecting the other WFBY (Dr. Pornchai)
gavesako wrote:
…The World Fellowship of Buddhists (WFB) has issued a statement which categorily rejects a meeting held by a rival "WFBY" in Seoul…
https://www.facebook.com/buddhistyouth/ ... =3&theater
WFBY (Dr. Pornchai) reply to the above WFB’s post
https://www.facebook.com/51497994202761 ... =3&theater


Despite this small issue, both WFBYs have been doing their best to promote and support Buddhism around the world. None is better than the other. And I believe both WFBYs are equally credible.
DMN wrote: However, as far as I am concerned there is a small but significant amount of evidence building up which suggests that Mr. Pornchai Pinyapong / Dhammakaya have done something that is outrageous in my opinion.
What’s the outrageous something that Mr. Pornchai/Dhammakaya may have done?

Warmest regards
Exonesion :anjali:
“Meditate, Ānanda, do not delay, or else you will regret it later.”
The Buddha - MN 152

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exonesion
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Re: Wat Dhammakaya

Post by exonesion » Mon Mar 13, 2017 3:48 am

Sangha Act amendments and WPD's case


Chirachai Punkrasin, ambassador for The Royal Thai embassy, sent a letter to New Mandala to clarify some false information brought up by "The perplexing case of Wat Dhammakaya"

The misinformation is that the Thai government intends to reform the Sangha Act, to which Mr. Chirachai denies.
He said that the Thai Government has intentions only to amend existing provisions, which concern inheritance law related to Buddhist monks. .

The letter to New Mandala (Highlighted for emphasis):
View the full version here:
Clarification.JPG
Clarification.JPG (157.37 KiB) Viewed 859 times
I believe that improving the inheritance law for Buddhist monks would be more productive and more useful than defrocking the abbot of WPD, whose money laundering accusations haven't been proven anyway. :console:

Warmest regards
Exonesion :anjali:
“Meditate, Ānanda, do not delay, or else you will regret it later.”
The Buddha - MN 152

TRobinson465
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Re: Wat Dhammakaya

Post by TRobinson465 » Tue Mar 14, 2017 1:10 am

slimdabuddhist wrote:Yeah see trobinson can't say anything back because he's never been to the Azusa branch. Btw aren't monks supposed to be the ones that clean and take care of their own temple is my question? I know they have their own janitor there but he uses the two twins(I know them both personally and they're extremely hard workers and I feel bad for them) that live there to do most of his work while he hides n sleeps somewhere. Cus I remember monks used to tell me that helping out and cleaning the temple earns you merit. But now looking back I feel like it's an excuse to take advantage of the laypeople.

I'd like a non wpd follower to clarify please cus I know they'll either deflect on me or say something I already know from there.
Dude i was there last week. When was the last time you went? The hall outside the luang pu room has a display up. what is it of? If youve even been there recently you would know what im talking about.
"Do not have blind faith, but also no blind criticism"

TRobinson465
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Re: Wat Dhammakaya

Post by TRobinson465 » Tue Mar 14, 2017 1:14 am

slimdabuddhist wrote:Lol I ordained several times as a novice when lp same was abbot and chat chai was the vice abbot. This trobinson sounds so arrogant and sure of himself. I chose not to name myself because they all know me there I'm not going to verify who I am, but if you wanted me to name drop I can. :lol: so please don't tell me I don't know the branch that I used to go too. You don't know me and I don't know you. But you sir sound condescending as hell, and sorry I'm being honest but I don't wanna break the 4th precept.
LP chatchai moved a few years ago. current vice abbot is LP Pratya. although he is acting abbot now since LP Samma (i think you meant this) is in Thailand. Im very sure of myself. i know Azusa branch well. If i told u my real name im sure you would know me also. Every1 there knows me.
"Do not have blind faith, but also no blind criticism"

TRobinson465
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Re: Wat Dhammakaya

Post by TRobinson465 » Tue Mar 14, 2017 1:32 am

BTW. while i dont have time to read the armada of posts that suddenly popped up over the last few days heres the source i came here to post.


https://www.theguardian.com/world/2017/ ... hist-abbot
"Do not have blind faith, but also no blind criticism"

TRobinson465
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Re: Wat Dhammakaya

Post by TRobinson465 » Tue Mar 14, 2017 1:33 am

"Do not have blind faith, but also no blind criticism"

TRobinson465
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Re: Wat Dhammakaya

Post by TRobinson465 » Tue Mar 14, 2017 1:35 am

Bhikkhu Pesala wrote:
slimdabuddhist wrote:I'd like a non wpd follower to clarify please.
It is the duty of monks to wash their own robes, clean their own dwellings, and sweep their own monastery compounds, but lay people can also make merit by volunteering to do it. Wealthy supporters could also employ someone to do it, or anagarikas, novices, or students living in the temple could do it as part of their own duties.

Of course, a monk could exploit workers, voluntary or paid, if he was wicked by nature. There again, hired workers could exploit the monks and lay supporters by not doing their duties properly.

The monks live upstairs at Azusa and clean it themselves. the rest of the temple others do.
"Do not have blind faith, but also no blind criticism"

TRobinson465
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Re: Wat Dhammakaya

Post by TRobinson465 » Tue Mar 14, 2017 2:15 am

jameswang wrote: That wouldn't make sense. As I understand, in Thailand, bad monks aren't forced to disrobe. They are just disrobed, wherever he is. And didn't the king just did that?.

I do apologize if some1 already answered this. i havent read everything and dont plan to right now. i skimmed and saw this so id like to answer. Monks can indeed be defrocked anywhere (in absentia), but only by the sangha council. However Thailand has a loophole in the legal code where monks cant be jailed. so if the police need to detain a monk, he must first disrobe. That is what hte Junta has been trying to do. use that law to disrobe him. The Sangha council could indeed disrobe him anywhere if they saw a legitimate reason. which they havent. Also, DSI keeps claiming he needs to be present for the case to continue. thats false, he can also be tried in absentia if the Junta has enuff evidence. but they wont do that. they insist he needs to be arrested (and defrocked) first for the case to continue.


Also, i take back my question to slim regarding the luang pu room. Based on ur reply about the Azusa abbots you clearly havent been there in a few years and i can gauge approx timeframe you left. so no need to answer that question since i know you wouldnt know. its only been a few months since the changes to that hallway outside of the luang pu room were made. BTW while you were gone several kids camp rooms were turned into storage rooms.
"Do not have blind faith, but also no blind criticism"

TRobinson465
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Re: Wat Dhammakaya

Post by TRobinson465 » Tue Mar 14, 2017 4:06 am

exonesion wrote: I’m not sure about Wat Phra Dhammakaya in Thailand, but from what I can remember, there’re minimal donation amounts for certain projects as well. TRobinson, am I correct?
Yes that is correct. minimum amount for certain things. Should note that many temples in thailand do this however. and if you dont have enuff and still want to do a certain one you can pool. Idk if other temples allow pooling but i know its common practice for other temples to have minimums for certain things.


Also. i remember thaksin being brought up when i skimmed thru. im not gonna sit here and find the quote or ill never finish doing my family's taxes. but im sure any1 reading will know what im responding too. Thaksin did indeed attend dhammakaya on several occasions. much more than the one time Ashin Wirathu visited on Magha Puja day along with a bunch of other burmese monks. Yingluck, the elected PM the current Dictator overthrew, has also made some visits.

I think what Prof. Taylor was getting at was that is Dhammakaya is seen as supporting thaksin, which is not something we do. Again we have prominent supporters of Thaksin and of his opposition Abhisit at the temple. as is normal in any organization. but theres this idea among yellow shirts that the reason they lose every single election is because Dk tells its massive number of followers to vote red, which is false and unlikely given the geography of the last election (area near WPD was yellow, northeast thailand, far from WPD, was red). Either way the point is WPD is seen by the public as being associated with thaksin because of he would attend our events and the tabloid thai media saying so, and that provides one reason the dictator wants to get rid of us so badly. that on top of the other things Prof. Taylor mentioned. Personally, i think its more about control and crushing potential dissent than any kind of red-yellow politics. Its true for any authoritarian regime. China started persecuting Falun gong after they held a large rally.

Last point b4 i sign off, idk if i covered everything i just skimmed and picked out some topics. again idk about any ties between Ashin wirathu and WPD. all i know is he attended an event once. one source put earlier was that WPD supports burmese monks, which is true. we also support monks in nepal and bangladesh and around the world. but not all burmese monks are part of ashins extremists. thats all i know about it, any ties i could find have been pretty inconclusive. given how much the thai media ties us to Thaksin and, even more comically, the Nazis, i think theres seemingly a vague link between WPD and ashin wirathu in the news because thats what the media likes to report.
"Do not have blind faith, but also no blind criticism"

jameswang
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Re: Wat Dhammakaya

Post by jameswang » Wed Mar 15, 2017 7:18 am

exonesion wrote:Hence, it’s not that I’m pretending to be unintelligent, James. It’s just that there’s a huge gap in logic that I couldn’t understand.
Indeed. I realise that I'm wasting my time here.... I've unsubscribed from this thread. (I suppose that's a purpose of you guys being here.) Have fun!

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