Remembering has to do with the Past , but , the practice of Sati has to do with Present Moment .
sati is :
Or mindfulness
Being aware :
On Purpose ,
Present Moment ,
and
Nonjudgementally .
How to practise sati ?
Re: How to practise sati ?
You always gain by giving
Re: How to practise sati ?
Not quite sure which group of people "rest of us" you are referring to but eg I can follow his posts so far just fine.Manopubbangama
For the rest of us beings who don't really understand your posts or what exactly you are attempting to communicate,...
You can include Ven. Thanissaro in that list.
DooDoot
I posted Buddhadasa is not my teacher and that the same views on sati are held by Sujato, Jayasaro, sutta, abidhamma, etc.
Here a short quote from "on the path" by him
...
"Ardent, alert, and mindful. The qualities that have to be brought to bear on the two activities of establishing mindfulness are three: alertness (sampajañña), mindfulness (sati), and ardency (ātappa).
• Alertness is never defined in the suttas, but is illustrated by examples showing that it’s the ability to be aware of what you are doing in the present moment (§§247–248). In other words, it’s not simply a general awareness of the present; instead, it focuses specifically on the question of your actions—in body, speech, and mind—along with their consequences.
• Mindfulness, in this case, means your active memory: the things you keep in mind to remember where to stay focused in the present moment and what to do with whatever arises in relationship to that focus.
• Ardency is another term that is not defined in the suttas but is illustrated by examples (§§244–246). In this case, the examples show that it is identical with right effort. Because the Pāli term for ardency, ātappa, is related to ottappa—compunction, or the fear of the consequences of unskillful actions—the two are commonly paired, especially in poetry. As a result, ardency carries connotations of heedfulness and vigilance in avoiding any actions that would lead to harm.
In this way, all three of these qualities, as sub-factors for right mindfulness, are informed by right view and right resolves: Alertness keeps focused on what right view identifies as the important problem of the present moment—your actions; mindfulness, are informed by right view and right resolves: Alertness keeps focused on what right view identifies as the important problem of the present moment—your actions; mindfulness keeps in mind the lessons of right view to apply to that problem; and ardency, informed by right resolve, makes the right effort to carry out those lessons for the sake of a true and blameless happiness.
So even though the act of establishing mindfulness is primarily concerned with getting the mind into concentration, it contains elements of discernment as well. This illustrates the point made by §53, that there is no jhāna without discernment.
...
Suttas
“And which is the faculty of mindfulness? There is the case where a monk, a disciple of the noble ones, is mindful, endowed with excellent proficiency in mindfulness, remembering & recollecting what was done and said a long time ago. He remains focused on the body in & of itself—ardent, alert, & mindful—subduing greed & distress with reference to the world. He remains focused on feelings in & of themselves… the mind in & of itself… dhammas in & of themselves—ardent, alert, & mindful—subduing greed & distress with reference to the world. This is called the faculty of mindfulness.” — SN 48:10
- Manopubbangama
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Re: How to practise sati ?
Depends on the posts. When it comes to quantifying the etymological significance of the word "Sati" the train of thought is painfully obvious.
When it comes to following a guy who claimed that Buddhism is by nature "socialist" but then pejoratively using the term "social justice warrior" to harass people one disagrees with, that becomes a bit more interesting.
Re: How to practise sati ?
The posts in this thread of course.Manopubbangama wrote: ↑Sun Dec 16, 2018 10:54 amDepends on the posts. When it comes to quantifying the etymological significance of the word "Sati" the train of thought is painfully obvious.
When it comes to following a guy who claimed that Buddhism is by nature "socialist" but then pejoratively using the term "social justice warrior" to harass people one disagrees with, that becomes a bit more interesting.
I see, you must be talking about something from another thread, something unrelated which I am obviously not aware of.
Re: How to practise sati ?
Do you mind explain the difference between sati ,SkillfulA wrote: ↑Sun Dec 16, 2018 10:12 am
“And which is the faculty of mindfulness? There is the case where a monk, a disciple of the noble ones, is mindful, endowed with excellent proficiency in mindfulness, remembering & recollecting what was done and said a long time ago. He remains focused on the body in & of itself—ardent, alert, & mindful—subduing greed & distress with reference to the world. He remains focused on feelings in & of themselves… the mind in & of itself… dhammas in & of themselves—ardent, alert, & mindful—subduing greed & distress with reference to the world. This is called the faculty of mindfulness.” — SN 48:10
sati indriya and sati bala ?
You always gain by giving
Re: How to practise sati ?
I am not aware of a difference, are you?James Tan wrote: ↑Sun Dec 16, 2018 12:11 pmDo you mind explain the difference between sati ,SkillfulA wrote: ↑Sun Dec 16, 2018 10:12 am
“And which is the faculty of mindfulness? There is the case where a monk, a disciple of the noble ones, is mindful, endowed with excellent proficiency in mindfulness, remembering & recollecting what was done and said a long time ago. He remains focused on the body in & of itself—ardent, alert, & mindful—subduing greed & distress with reference to the world. He remains focused on feelings in & of themselves… the mind in & of itself… dhammas in & of themselves—ardent, alert, & mindful—subduing greed & distress with reference to the world. This is called the faculty of mindfulness.” — SN 48:10
sati indriya and sati bala ?
- Manopubbangama
- Posts: 925
- Joined: Sat Oct 20, 2018 4:17 pm
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Re: How to practise sati ?
When you say that those who view sati as 'observing' or 'awareness' are practicing fruitlessly, what do you mean by that exactly?
Re: How to practise sati ?
https://suttacentral.net/mn118/pli/ms
yasmin samaye- when in religious order.
digham- it is long, long as waiting bus long, not as long breath like taking time like 10 seconds long
rassam- short, but as poor and like dictonary says: stunted.
sabbakayapatisamvedi - is the opposition in body
sikkhati
basically your body gets accustomed to these qualities
the point is, even if its wrong but what matters is the idea and that is differentthan this translation conveys
https://suttacentral.net/mn118/en/sujato
if you translate pretty much word to wordYasmiṃ samaye, bhikkhave, bhikkhu dīghaṃ vā assasanto ‘dīghaṃ assasāmī’ti pajānāti, dīghaṃ vā passasanto ‘dīghaṃ passasāmī’ti pajānāti; rassaṃ vā assasanto ‘rassaṃ assasāmī’ti pajānāti, rassaṃ vā passasanto ‘rassaṃ passasāmī’ti pajānāti; ‘sabbakāyapaṭisaṃvedī assasissāmī’ti sikkhati, ‘sabbakāyapaṭisaṃvedī passasissāmī’ti sikkhati;
yasmin samaye- when in religious order.
digham- it is long, long as waiting bus long, not as long breath like taking time like 10 seconds long
rassam- short, but as poor and like dictonary says: stunted.
sabbakayapatisamvedi - is the opposition in body
sikkhati
basically your body gets accustomed to these qualities
getting used to( accustomed) to that calmed down kayasankhara.‘passambhayaṃ kāyasaṅkhāraṃ passasissāmī’ti sikkhati;
the point is, even if its wrong but what matters is the idea and that is differentthan this translation conveys
https://suttacentral.net/mn118/en/sujato
Whenever a mendicant knows that they breathe heavily, or lightly, or experiencing the whole body, or stilling the body’s motion
Re: How to practise sati ?
Are you sure? This seems to be "On the occasions that", rather than anything to do with religious orders. Samayo is "time" or "occasion".auto wrote: ↑Sun Dec 16, 2018 3:14 pm https://suttacentral.net/mn118/pli/ms
if you translate pretty much word to wordYasmiṃ samaye, bhikkhave, bhikkhu dīghaṃ vā assasanto ‘dīghaṃ assasāmī’ti pajānāti, dīghaṃ vā passasanto ‘dīghaṃ passasāmī’ti pajānāti; rassaṃ vā assasanto ‘rassaṃ assasāmī’ti pajānāti, rassaṃ vā passasanto ‘rassaṃ passasāmī’ti pajānāti; ‘sabbakāyapaṭisaṃvedī assasissāmī’ti sikkhati, ‘sabbakāyapaṭisaṃvedī passasissāmī’ti sikkhati;
yasmin samaye- when in religious order.
Re: How to practise sati ?
religious order is same as to embody vidya.Sam Vara wrote: ↑Sun Dec 16, 2018 5:28 pmAre you sure? This seems to be "On the occasions that", rather than anything to do with religious orders. Samayo is "time" or "occasion".auto wrote: ↑Sun Dec 16, 2018 3:14 pm https://suttacentral.net/mn118/pli/ms
if you translate pretty much word to wordYasmiṃ samaye, bhikkhave, bhikkhu dīghaṃ vā assasanto ‘dīghaṃ assasāmī’ti pajānāti, dīghaṃ vā passasanto ‘dīghaṃ passasāmī’ti pajānāti; rassaṃ vā assasanto ‘rassaṃ assasāmī’ti pajānāti, rassaṃ vā passasanto ‘rassaṃ passasāmī’ti pajānāti; ‘sabbakāyapaṭisaṃvedī assasissāmī’ti sikkhati, ‘sabbakāyapaṭisaṃvedī passasissāmī’ti sikkhati;
yasmin samaye- when in religious order.
Re: How to practise sati ?
Yes, but that's not the quote. I'm lost!auto wrote: ↑Sun Dec 16, 2018 6:05 pmreligious order is same as to embody vidya.Sam Vara wrote: ↑Sun Dec 16, 2018 5:28 pmAre you sure? This seems to be "On the occasions that", rather than anything to do with religious orders. Samayo is "time" or "occasion".auto wrote: ↑Sun Dec 16, 2018 3:14 pm https://suttacentral.net/mn118/pli/ms
if you translate pretty much word to word
yasmin samaye- when in religious order.
Re: How to practise sati ?
time as "its time for dinner". Otherwise you need lend or depend on the meaning from what is written next, this way you make sentences shorter(in meanings) every time you explain past explanation.
In short, just by hearing "yasmin samaye" would be enough to know the entire passage what it is about.
then next part of quote is when the meaning of past quote is as ground or base. So if you know this quote you could know a method to retrieve the past quote.Yasmiṃ samaye, bhikkhave, bhikkhu dīghaṃ vā assasanto ‘dīghaṃ assasāmī’ti pajānāti, dīghaṃ vā passasanto ‘dīghaṃ passasāmī’ti pajānāti; rassaṃ vā assasanto ‘rassaṃ assasāmī’ti pajānāti, rassaṃ vā passasanto ‘rassaṃ passasāmī’ti pajānāti; ‘sabbakāyapaṭisaṃvedī assasissāmī’ti sikkhati, ‘sabbakāyapaṭisaṃvedī passasissāmī’ti sikkhati; ‘passambhayaṃ kāyasaṅkhāraṃ assasissāmī’ti sikkhati, ‘passambhayaṃ kāyasaṅkhāraṃ passasissāmī’ti sikkhati;
next part also same logickāye kāyānupassī, bhikkhave, tasmiṃ samaye bhikkhu viharati ātāpī sampajāno satimā vineyya loke abhijjhādomanassaṃ. Kāyesu kāyaññatarāhaṃ, bhikkhave, evaṃ vadāmi yadidaṃ—assāsapassāsā.
1st quote starts with Yasmin samayeTasmātiha, bhikkhave, kāye kāyānupassī tasmiṃ samaye bhikkhu viharati ātāpī sampajāno satimā vineyya loke abhijjhādomanassaṃ.
2nd have kaye kayanupassi and Yasmin samaye as second
3rd has what was third at 2nd part will be first in this part and 1st part as 3rd
that done there is next tab start again with Yasmin Samaye but it doesn't matter since you start with the first one and know what happen when on 2nd start.
I doubt that someone just memorized it all thousands of Suttas or were remembered blatantly without any key to retrieve lost parts.
Re: How to practise sati ?
I was not referring to the generalisations above. I was referring to the 'kaya sankhara' ('the breathing'). I was referring to how in kayanupassana it can be discerned the effect of ignorance upon the kaya sankara. I was saying there is no need to wait until dhammanupassana to examine paticasamuppada
There is always an official executioner. If you try to take his place, It is like trying to be a master carpenter and cutting wood. If you try to cut wood like a master carpenter, you will only hurt your hand.
https://soundcloud.com/doodoot/paticcasamuppada
https://soundcloud.com/doodoot/anapanasati
https://soundcloud.com/doodoot/paticcasamuppada
https://soundcloud.com/doodoot/anapanasati
Re: How to practise sati ?
Being aware of the breath is not the same as thinking 'I am' breathing which is the only the initial instruction according to MN118.auto wrote: ↑Sat Dec 15, 2018 1:15 pm
i am aware of that i am doing the breathing, its on Suttas.
https://suttacentral.net/mn118/en/sujato
The next part says experiencing or being aware or merely observing the breath.When breathing in heavily they know: ‘I’m breathing in heavily.’ When breathing out heavily they know: ‘I’m breathing out heavily.’ When breathing in lightly they know: ‘I’m breathing in lightly.’ When breathing out lightly they know: ‘I’m breathing out lightly.’
They practice breathing in experiencing the whole body. They practice breathing out experiencing the whole body.
You asked and answered-They practice breathing in observing impermanence. They practice breathing out observing impermanence. They practice breathing in observing fading away. They practice breathing out observing fading away. They practice breathing in observing cessation. They practice breathing out observing cessation. They practice breathing in observing letting go. They practice breathing out observing letting go
That is not what the teaching of anatta is about.so what in your opinion lies on the otherside of the Unbinding?
it is you.
viewtopic.php?t=16264
And what is right speech? Abstaining from lying, from divisive speech, from abusive speech, & from idle chatter: This is called right speech.